Stu
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Posts
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Joined
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Days Won
28
Posts posted by Stu
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13 minutes ago, Jeff Ream said:
and at the high level of NCAA sports, those kids are getting scholarships that pay for their schooling. DCI has no such option.
I marched with a scholarship provided to me by my corps.
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9 minutes ago, MikeD said:
I did not see that in reading backwards through the posts.
I did see this that you replied to a few pages back...which does not speak to any value judgements on right or wrong choices:
"Unnecessarily inflicting suffering on youth is not the kind of suffering I want youth experiencing. I want youth to chose their own path. Mandating that they cannot march where they want seems to be exactly that."
I misread this statement: "Unnecessarily inflicting suffering on youth is not the kind of suffering I want youth experiencing." Sorry. I actually agree with it.
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4 minutes ago, Jeff Ream said:
aww gee here i paid thousands of dollars, and ya know what...this place isn't for me. Why the #### should I be forced to stay there when it was not the best situation for me?
They shouldn't. Ergo, your idea fails.
Duty, honor, commitment, covenant, overcoming adversity, learning to deal with it instead of running away,.....my idea works out in the end.
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6 minutes ago, Cappybara said:
Breaking: Old guy thinks younger generation is no good. More at 8
You failed to understand my post. But you will, in time.
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2 minutes ago, MikeD said:
Wow, that is just about completely the opposite of what I have seen in general terms my entire career working with young people, and I am almost 66...started working with bands in 1971, as a college freshman, and am now a substitute teacher in my new home district. Sure, there are examples of what you said, but kids today, in my view, work VERY hard overall.
I am deep into the educational environment also. And I never said they were lazy; in fact many do work very hard. Many are vry intelligent.
But working for their own gain irrespective the impact on others, the it is about me not we success, look at my reaction videos, follow me on twitter. Not doing anything sacraficially for anyone besides themselves. That is what our culture has taught them instead of the aformentioned vertures in my other post.
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3 minutes ago, Cappybara said:
That post is a caricature of the boomer generation.
Years to come, when you are old, and I am dead, wisdom, not knowledge, but wisdom shall be in your soul. And when that time comes, please remember this boomer.
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1 minute ago, MikeD said:
Wrong choice? Maybe you made the right choice to march corps A one year, and then you made another right choice to march corps B the next year.
However, my comment was in direct reference to what if a youth actually did make the wrong choice.
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5 minutes ago, PamahoNow said:
It is truly hard to believe that you believe this.
Yes I believe that Free Will does demand responsibility and consequence of action. So if you made the wrong choice, consequence, even suffering, teaches wisdom and respect for others. And if you learn to take failure with grace, deeper appreciation for success will materialize. Yes I believe that to the core of my soul.
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1 minute ago, jeffmolnar said:
Closed caption: "Grumpy old man complains that the younger generation doesn't exist just to please him."
Refresh my memory. If I remember our previous exchanges correctly, you and I are as far as any two people can get as it applies to the opposite ends of the spectrum.
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37 minutes ago, BigW said:
They naturally want to be where they will gain the most success in a short window of opportunity for themselves. One can't blame them, especially with the fees involved.
Thoughtful. Sometimes, slow and prudent progress to ensure long term stability and viability is far more valuable than getting a flash in the pan. Seen that happen and wreck my corps.
Somewhere down the line, Instead of teacing many of our youth the nobilities of self sacrafice, honor, delayed gratification, patience, wisdom, consequence, vertue, convent, the true meaning of success, and holding them to that standard, our culture has allowed them to develop their own sense of narcissistic, twitter, Facebook, Machiavellian, no consequence, immediate gratification no matter what perverted definition of success.
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1 hour ago, corps8294 said:
Laugh all you want. But the best wisdom is garnered through failure and subsequent consiquences than success. And to truely appreciate succes you must first learn to accept failure with grace.
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2 hours ago, Fran Haring said:
How is that?
Not being snarky here... just an honest, uninformed question. LOL.
A clarification here. There is nothing wrong with self promotion. BD, for example, should promote themselves. Come see us at the rehearsal site this afternoon, come to the show and see us perform in the stadium, come talk to us after the show. All are wonderfully fine!
But come see us warm up in the lot while the competition is going on in the stadium, and don't bother with the early on corps because We are the real show. That behavior is what goes against the DCI mission. Again, clarification.
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1 hour ago, PamahoNow said:
Unnecessarily inflicting suffering on youth is not the kind of suffering I want youth experiencing. I want youth to chose their own path. Mandating that they cannot march where they want seems to be exactly that.
They are marching where they want. Nobody forced them to try out for that corps. It was of their own Free Will. However, the nature of fairness withn competition, social cohesivness, and respect for others, mandates that rules of transfer and competition must be established. There are consiquences for your Free Will choices. Free Will does demand responsibility and consequence of action. So if you made the wrong choice, consequence, even suffering, teaches that respect for others.
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1 hour ago, MikeD said:
..that is part and parcel of the scholastic sports environment. Parents and their kids move from town A to B all the time, and the kids participate in scholastic activities where they live, be it band, sports, drama, model UN, etc.....
However...... HS Athletes who's families just happen to move and transfer from school X district to a nationally top ranked athletic school A are scrutinized to the nth degree. And they should be!!!!
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12 minutes ago, MikeD said:
Scholastic sports are governed by state scholastic athletic associations. Little League and other non-scholastic organizations, sports or not, are totally outside the scholastic realm.
True. And most scholastic organizations govern and prevent transfer for personal or team athletic gain. Football is not an academic class but a youth competitive environment.
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11 minutes ago, MikeD said:
Not sure how any of that equates with a corps not providing a member with a sufficiently positive experience so that they WANT to stay with their current corps.
No, "suffering" is not a vital part of marching drum corps, especially when that suffering is to NOT march drum corps. Seems ridiculous to me. It is the members who decide where they want to march. They pay for the experience and deserve to right to audition where they wish. You are also saying kids in their next-to-last age-eligible season will not be able to march their age-out year.
Suffering is a valuble life lesson to learn. Shielding youth and avoiding them from learning those lessons, even in drum corps, especially in drum corps, does a grave disservice to the youth.
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1 minute ago, MikeD said:
How do you equate Little League baseball with scholastic football?
The teams are all youth competitive entities not academic courses.
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20 minutes ago, corps8294 said:
The main architect of the G7 proposal is gone, thank goodness, and his former corps now find themselves at the top of the middle tier of the Top 12. A lot of those other G7 corps probably went along with Hopkins because he was bully; no Hopkins, no G7. What's going on with the Scouts, Regiment, and other corps in their current situation is self inflicted.
Those boards, with the exception of the Cadets, who signed on are still pretty much intact. And if you think the boards of BD, SCV, Cavaliers, were bullied then that is one laughable belief. Just because these boards relented due to the member corps stifling it does not mean they have had a change of heart. That condscending tone is still there with at least 4 if not 5 boards. And I pray Regiment is being humbled by their current situation.
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33 minutes ago, Fran Haring said:
How is that?
Not being snarky here... just an honest, uninformed question. LOL.
The DCI mission statement says it is to be "a cooperative fraternity of its member drum corps."
Cooperative does not mean to promote an idea to come see only the elite warm up in the lot, follow them into the stadium, and miss out on the others in the fraternity. And a fraternity does not mean that only a few are the real show so do not bother seeing the others.
The elite internet promotions of come see the only groups that matter, which began around 15 years ago and are still going on, and now perpetuated by the youth who were brought up on that promotion, is indeed the antithesis of the DCI mission statement.
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22 minutes ago, karuna said:
The focus on talent is mis-placed. It's not about talent -- it's about staff and design.
Cadets won for many years with what most of the top corps would have considered "middlin'" talent. Why ? Because they had great teachers and great designers.
Madison needs to find and keep the right staff. Produce a show that makes HS kids watching say "I'd like to be a part of that". Give your current membership great instruction so they can become better performers. You'll get more than enough talent walking in the door.
While that may have been true in the eighties, nineties, and the early 2000's, they way shows are structured and staged today requires rather mature talent. Yes great staff, but great staff with very mature talented performers is now required. And the few eliet saw this comming about 15 years ago.
The recruitment culture changed a little after Y2K.. When the few elite began a big internet push of lot videos along with a real promotion for the youth to come see the real show warm up in the lot and follow them into seeing the real show in the stadium. Which, by the way, is the antithesis of the DCI mission statement.
The majority of the DCI member corps shot down a formal push, but that recruitment strategy still exists informally on the net. We now have a cohort of talented youth who were brought up on that philosophy. Go to the elite, at any cost, because they are the real show.
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10 minutes ago, corps8294 said:
This thread is getting beyond ridiculous. If the Madison Scouts were placing in the middle of the Top 12, like they did years ago, none of this talk of "things aren't fair" wouldn't be taking place. The members they have, this year, are out there working just as hard as the Blue Devils, SCV, etc, etc, etc. I'm sure they know and understand that finals is going to happen this year and more than likely, next year. But all this talk about unfair member movement and such is silly.
You can believe it silly. Fine. But to state that I am posting these ideas because of 'Madison', with them slipping out of the top 12, is simply not true.
I began to think this way concerning an unrestricted and restricted free agency idea even back in 1988 when Madison won. It erked me even back then that many upper division corps were being used by youth as feeders for the more elite corps.
And it became a real important issue with me when honesty finally materilized with the G7 proposal; where the 7, including MY corps in which I performed with, blaitently and crassly admitted that the other corps should be religated to a status basicly serving as feeders for them.
Colts, Boston, Scouts, Spirit, et al rallied against that proposal. But the atmosphere that the elite are still the only real show, that going to the lot to see them instad of being in the stands to watching Pacific Crest, has gravely influenced who many of the current youth who desire to perform with just them.
And even though this is a Scouts thread, I hope and pray that the board of directors at Regiment, one of those 7, is learning a valuable humble lesson right now!
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14 minutes ago, AlexL said:
Another funny side effect the idiotic 'don't let kids transfer corps without a penalty' thing would have is a lot of kids just wouldnt turn out for lower placing corps.
A lot of kids don't make their 'dream' corps and then go march somewhere else, hoping to build some skills and experience so they can go march where they really want to go. Year after year people advise kids who don't make their first shot to go somewhere. If they knew that marching somewhere would impede their ability to get to their goal, they'll just stay home and work on improving themselves some other way.
A) Staying home if you do not make your WC corps of choice is already happening with many youth. The extra cost to try elsewhere in the same season is prohibitive to many. Free Agency in proper competitive context.
B) Auditioning for a second choice WC corps is also happening with other youth. Also Free Agency in proper competitive context.
C) Auditioning for an OC corps to receive that training. Again also Free Agency in proper competitive context.
D) Using a second choice WC corps, one that is in the same competitive division as the first choice, having them train you in order for you to then bail to another WC corps, allowing the next WC corps to reap the talent gained from the previous WC corps the very next season (without some sort of compensation or penility), is not only an abomination to the proper context of Free Angency but a complete narcisestic selfish act which in turn perpetuates the creation of only a few elite corps.
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4 minutes ago, IllianaLancerContra said:
Heck, lets work in a member draft while we're at it
If the performers were paid I would also promote that. But since they pay dues I am for Free Agency, both unrestricted and restricted depending on the scenario.
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5 hours ago, mrk said:
....A better analogy than an athlete might be a student who opts to transfer to another University. Whatever her motivation, if she meets the academic requirements, pays the tuition, and the new school has an opening, she's in....
Neither DCI, nor any of the corps, are academic institutions with non profit edicational exemptions. They are listed as youth competitive activities. So it is not like Sally transfering from State University to MIT because of the academic math instruction. While she may transfer from one WC corps to another WC corps based on who is on staff, it is still a competitive transfer not academic.
What happened to Madison?
in DCI World Class Corps Discussions
Posted
A) I have spent the last thirty years placing capital in stocks, bonds, precious metals, other investments, and am not relying on Social Security which will likely implode. So how are kids today funding my retirement?
B) When I was in my youth my dad was an idiot. Now I have come to realize he was the most wise person who ever gave me advice. So I was much like you many moons ago.