"...close to 50,000 in attendance..."

[manoloblahniksabre]

To those who think this post was intended to be subversive or cynical:

Being particular about facts is not being cynical. It's being critical because I care about drum corps. Yes, I do question press releases such as this because I think it intended to be misleading in order to blow the attendence figures out of proportion because DCI thinks that by packaging drum corps in a big, bold, glossy wrapping they'll make the public love us and get a slew of corporate sponsorship.

It isn't going to happen.

The only thing DCI can hope for through this is is to reel in some band geeks. Personally, I think they are targeting the wrong demographic. Who's really going to be watching ESPN2 at 10 pm on a Tuesday people? I think, if anything, the demographic that PBS reaches is more appropriate for finding potential DCI fans. THe problem with PBS? It's too small. The problem with ESPN? I doubt anyone who sees this, outside of people in the marching music community, are going to give a ####. I honestly look for DCI (and, after the ESPN2 broadcast, forever to be known as "Extreme Marching Band") to be the target of lots of cable network jokes.

I think that DCI is too esoteric for the average Joe that is looking for game highlights on ESPN2 on a weekday. Just don't hold out for any Pepsi/Nike sponsorships.

A friend of mine who is on the DCI Board told me the official PAID attendance for this year's finals was 20,000. That I can believe.

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[ssorrell]

You say I put too much emphasis on numbers. Isn’t that the name of the game? If the activity had twice the number of participants, twice the number of fans, wouldn’t it have twice the opportunity to sell all the periphpals thus twice the profit?

Let's think about what we really want.

If we have TWICE the number of fans, where will they go? What would we do with them? It's a nice problem to have, but it would create a whole different set of problems.

Many shows are maxed out , or close to it, now. Most stadiums that host a corps show would not be able to handle a 100% increase in attendance without opening up the back side, and that's not an option as that would turn off a new spectator in a heartbeat. So what would we do? Create more shows? The tour is filled with shows now. Corps do not get many off nights for extra practice or some R and R. So where would these shows fit in? Make the season longer? Not an option.

We actually did have twice the number of participants a couple of decades ago and beyond. The finals attendance may have been close to double its current numbers, but local shows weren't...I mean you can only get so many fans in a smaller local venue. So having twice the number of participants does not necessarily equate to a doubled fan base (and I'm not saying that you were making that assumption).

Let's remember...when we talk about growing our activity we must keep our eye on the smaller things...the backbone of this activity...the local show. Let's not focus solely on finals and regionals, as those contests can certainly grow, but as I've said before, those big shows are more for die hard fans, not for the new or novice fan. If we want NEW fans, I feel like we must patiently indoctrinate them at the local level. And when we do that, if done in mass quantities, we'll outgrow our present infrastructure...so, what do we do? At best, we need to at least bring new fans in to replace the ones we lose each year for whatever reason. Perhaps we are succeeding in that quest, as the local shows are nearly at full capacity. We've lost long time die hard fans who would traditionally attend major shows, and it will take quite a while for any new fan to get to the point to where attending a major show is attractive to them. so maybe, just maybe we are growing already and we've failed to recognize it.

[manoloblahniksabre]

How many people, outside of people in the marching music community who love it for what it is, really want to watch marching bands at all, much less, "extreme marching bands" ? Don't you think that if the general public was into marching music it would have exploded a long time ago??

If you package it as "extreme marching band" it just generates more laughs (to the average person) than anything. "Extreme Marching Band" makes me think of a fat dude with a tuba and a bottle of gatorade. WHY on Earth, considering the negative connotations most people associate with marching band, would you want people to think this IS marching band?

Why?  Ask 10 people what drum corps is, I'd say 3 or 4 know.  Ask 10 people what marching band is, and 9-10 know.

I think the whole result of this is to get people to say, "These drum corps aren't like the marching bands I remember."

I don't think anyone automatically assumes that DCI on ESPN2 is like "this one time, at band camp,..." any more than the movie "Bring it on" is truly an accurate representation of cheer.

Marching band people know that drum corps are the higher quality product in general.  It's also not attached to academia (save Spirit).  So why rub everyone's nose in it?  Anyone who is in a corps knows it's not a band.  But for the simplicity of growing an audience, what's the crime?

Honestly, how many times have we all said to the uninitiated that "it's sorta like marching band, only really really good.  Oh, and no clarinets."  If it grows the audience, the bigger crime is not using the advantage.

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[manoloblahniksabre]

What I really want is this:

A return to grassroots drumcorps. You're right. Stabilizing at the local level is the only way, especially with rising fuel crisis.

Let's think about what we really want.

If we have TWICE the number of fans, where will they go?  What would we do with them?  It's a nice problem to have, but it would create a whole different set of problems.

Many shows are maxed out , or close to it, now.  Most stadiums that host a corps show would not be able to handle a 100% increase in attendance without opening up the back side, and that's not an option as that would turn off a new spectator in a heartbeat.  So what would we do?  Create more shows?  The tour is filled with shows now.  Corps do not get many off nights for extra practice or some R and R.  So where would these shows fit in?  Make the season longer?  Not an option. 

We actually did have twice the number of participants a couple of decades ago and beyond.  The finals attendance may have been close to double its current numbers, but local shows weren't...I mean you can only get so many fans in a smaller local venue.    So having twice the number of participants does not necessarily equate to a doubled fan base (and I'm not saying that you were making that assumption). 

Let's remember...when we talk about growing our activity we must keep our eye on the smaller things...the backbone of this activity...the local show.  Let's not focus solely on finals and regionals, as those contests can certainly grow, but as I've said before, those big shows are more for die hard fans, not for the new or novice fan.  If we want NEW fans, I feel like we must patiently indoctrinate them at the local level.  And when we do that, if done in mass quantities, we'll outgrow our present infrastructure...so, what do we do?  At best, we need to at least bring new fans in to replace the ones we lose each year for whatever reason.  Perhaps we are succeeding in that quest, as the local shows are nearly at full capacity.  We've lost long time die hard fans who would traditionally attend major shows, and it will take quite a while for any new fan to get to the point to where attending a major show is attractive to them.  so maybe, just maybe we are growing already and we've failed to recognize it.

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[ssorrell]

If you package it as "extreme marching band" it just generates more laughs (to the average person) than anything. "Extreme Marching Band" makes me think of a fat dude with a tuba and a bottle of gatorade.

Extreme sports have been the rage for years. When you think of Extreme Snowboarding, do you think of some overweight kid drinking a beer with his ballcap on backwards while doing some sort of jump or flip? If so, then you should know that you are incorrect with that assumption. Why would you assume that someone will conjure up the images that you suggest when they see the term "Extreme Marching Band"?

The word "extreme" has potential here folks, especially when used in the atmosphere on ESPN2. It could make an otherwise uninterested kid watch just because of the use of that singular word. Maybe those that are marketing the program know EXACTLY what they are doing.

Edited August 29, 2005 by ssorrell

[manoloblahniksabre]

How many people consider marching band a sport? You'd be incorrect in your assumption that most people do.

You're not going to get past the fact that the majority of folks see any sort of marching music as boring. Especially teenage boys. You can use any sensationalizezd adjective you want. It's still extreme MARCHING BAND....

Extreme sports have been the rage for years.  When you think of Extreme Snowboarding, do you think of some overweight kid drinking a beer with his ballcap on backwards while doing some sort of jump or flip?  If so, then you should know that you are incorrect with that assumption.  Why would you assume that someone will conjure up the images that you suggest when they see the term "Extreme Marching Band"?

The word "extreme" has potential here folks.  It could make an otherwise uninterested kid watch just because of the use of that singular word.  Maybe those that are marketing the program know EXACTLY what they are doing.

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[ssorrell]

How many people consider marching band a sport? You'd be incorrect in your assumption that most people do.

You're not going to get past the fact that the majority of folks see any sort of marching music as boring. Especially teenage boys. You can use any sensationalizezd adjective you want. It's still extreme MARCHING BAND....

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Even though DCI has been pushing the activity as a "sport" for years, I agree with you that most will not consider it as one. I didn't say that they wouldn't. But, we will be on a sports network, hence my suggestion that appealing to the extreme sports minded TV watcher is not a bad thing.

You certainly are making some broad and bold statements. Outside of your own personal experiences, how can you claim that MOST people view marching music as "boring"? How can you say that MOST teenage boys will do so?

[drumcat]

Don't you think that if the general public was into marching music it would have exploded a long time ago??

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Maybe you've noticed that the 2005 corps doesn't sound much like the 1970's anycorps. No one listened to grunge until it had its own identity. No one listened to punk until it was refined for the mass market. No one took rap seriously until it was comical about intense issues.

Tell me why drum corps couldn't become a 'classical' genre now... Maybe the odds aren't great, but who really thought that GlamRock bands were going to be replaced by plaid-wearing stoners from Seattle?

(cue the Stryper power-ballad)

Sweeping assumptions about the demise of an art form is more proof that it's alive and well.

[drumcat]

Outside of your own personal experiences, how can you claim that MOST people view marching music as "boring"?  How can you say that MOST teenage boys will do so?

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ESPN disagrees with you, manoloblahniksabre, and they have market research...

Edited August 29, 2005 by drumcat

[manoloblahniksabre]

Show me the market research, then. Please. Or point me to where it can be found.

...and I'm making broad assumptions because I think that there is plenty of plain logic to back it up.

Drum corps will never be a popular music genre, and I don't understand why it has to be.

Only people so insecure in their love for an activity need to reach out to the popular masses for approval. I think the ESPN numbers are going to speak for themself. The people who tune in to watch are going to be the same people who tuned into PBS. Alumni, band kids, etc.

ESPN disagrees with you, manoloblahniksabre, and they have market research...

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Edited August 29, 2005 by manoloblahniksabre