garfield
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Posts posted by garfield
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1 hour ago, Jeff Ream said:
DCAF has been discussed here for several years now. In fact there's usually a column discussing DCP. you may or may not have been a target of those columns 😂
I’m both glad that I was completely unaware and, at the same time, certain that I couldn’t care less.
His viewpoint and mine couldn’t appear to be further apart.
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52 minutes ago, cixelsyd said:
This dance has gone on long enough. Are you willing to drop the third person, and contend that it is your own opinion that pre-covid DCI was already on the brink and only Varsity can save it?
They are the kind of steps DCI has taken over and over whenever growth accidently occurs.
Uhh, no. Pre-Covid DCI had no solid direction to solve the key problem and members were left to consider only a shrinking pie and getting their piece of it.
I speak in third person because I didn’t like the first two. Actually, I always speak just for myself.
Your second point needs no embellishment by me except “accidental growth”. Yep, no more needed.
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50 minutes ago, cixelsyd said:
What problem?
Drum Corps consistently and continuously becoming smaller, more expensive, and less relevant in a growing competitive marketplace for participant dollars.
That one.
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48 minutes ago, cixelsyd said:
What problem?
Oh, is that the problem? Never fear. DCI has operated that way for its entire existence. It has always been a conduit for funds, rather than a receptacle.
Sorry, but drum corps is not Shark Tank. That is not what the activity is here for.
But why take my word for it? You just said so yourself a couple of pages back:
Maximize the gate came first in the original iteration, too
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1 hour ago, Jeff Ream said:
Bain Capital isn't a fan of doing business with non profits
Evidence please.
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2 hours ago, cixelsyd said:
Before C-19, DCI and their corps were putting the final touches on their strategic plan initiatives to fine-tune (if your description is correct) an already successful and sustainable operating model for drum corps. Apparently, they felt pretty secure about it, because the two highlighted paths forward were to:
a. Raise higher barriers to entry for new/advancing corps
b. Raise the cost of equipping a fully competitive corps with "any-instrument"
There were other ideas on the agenda, like putting some funds aside as a reserve... again, not the sort of topic you normally hear from an organization whose very survival is under imminent threat.
Both of these things can easily be seen as the last actions of a dying dynasty trying to exclude others from the last morsels of sustenance.
Rationally, are these the things that are done by a healthy, vibrant, and growing activity?
"A Reserve Fund". I tell ya', I've gone back through every DCI 990 I have printed for decades and I can't tell you the last year DCI had a "reserve" fund. But I can illustrate very quickly how much the corps have pulled out for themselves!
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1 hour ago, cixelsyd said:
Learn? No problem. Read a book. Bring in a motivational speaker. Take a class.
There are plenty of ways DCI can learn from Varsity, without entering into joint-venture contracts.
None of which at all will provide a single spark of anything other than more banter around the problem.
There are lots of great ideas, TONS of great ideas, that are meaningless until they are put into practice with real commitment and money. I've got BOOKS of great ideas.
Lots of people around the activity have lots of good ideas. The problem is that DCI has no money with which to turn a good one into reality even if they had one.
Varsity might be a willing player with deep pockets to listen to great ideas and fund them, but they will do so only with the intention of making a long-term profit. It's up to the drum corps to show them that great ideas can be profitable to spur, and pay for, other great ideas. Finally, in my view.
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3 hours ago, cixelsyd said:
... which, in my mind, is a disqualifier.
If the "survival" of drum corps is the mission, it requires a mission-driven organization to achieve it. That may not be enough either, given the increasingly vague mission statements of DCI over the years. But even that faulty compass is far better than no compass at all.
For-profit business is about (wait for it) profit, with no other necessary preconditions. Drum corps has never been a profitable endeavor. The number of for-profit drum corps and circuits (zero) reflects that. If the operation of the DCI activity were turned over to a for-profit entity, the extent of change necessary to achieve the mission of the business (true profitability) would transform drum corps into something so materially different that I would no longer care to follow it.
Drum corps has been profitable for each and every year that it has returned a payout to the corps from the tour it organizes and the fans it gets to come see its shows. Several million dollars each year is paid back to the drum corps (the size of those payouts is different each year and their impact is for another discussion).
Nobody has suggested that DCI or any of the corps suddenly turn into for-profit enterprises. Nobody. So there's zero chance that you have to worry about it suddenly morphing into something profit-focused (and by your implication) necessarily then kid-negative and ruining your enjoyment, such that it is.
But to suggest that DCI can't learn a bunch from a billion-dollar performance organization is complete folly.
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33 minutes ago, MikeD said:
At this point I agree. Varsity has a focus on scholastic business, as that is where the volume...hence money...is. Drum corps is nothing at all from a financial standpoint. The DCI name is valuable however. That is why the DCI article makes it clear this is about Varsity teaming up with DCI for a SoundSport fall+ scholastic effort, and it made clear the current summer activity is not part of the agreement.
If that changes, then we'll see.
Personally I will be surprised if this amounts to very much, but again, we'll see. There are already outlets for schools who want this type of thing all over the US between marching band circuits, indoor winter guard/music circuits and WGI. At least in my area, band directors in general tend to get through marching season (competing or not) and jump into the rest of their music ensembles, such as jazz band, pit orchestras and other smaller groups. Those who want to compete later in the year do the existing indoor circuits which provide excellent performance and/or competitive opportunities.
I can't disagree, it'll probably end up nothing beyond Varsity trying to start SS/DLB in school environs. Doesn't that take band director/music director approval? I'm sure they've thought that through.
That said, people, businesses, and practices change with time and maturing markets. Maybe, in time and with some demonstration of what can be made substantial with SS/DlB, Varsity will show good practice and good faith. If there's any part of DCI that I think is worth risking for that gamble, it'd be SS and DLB.
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42 minutes ago, cixelsyd said:
We just went through a cancelled season. DCI is still alive, and plans are underway for 2021. If that does not meet the definition of "survival", let me know why not.
Short-term answer to a long-term problem. Think beyond and before Covid.
Really, I hope this was you being witty.
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There’s no evidence that Varsity is interested in drum corps, so there’s no indication of what agreements would be required for the two to consummate anything beyond SS/DLB.
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19 minutes ago, cixelsyd said:
Choosing which predator eats you is not "survival".
Neither is what they have now, is it?
You’re referring to beggars, not choosers. The DCI brand is valuable.
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2 hours ago, cixelsyd said:
Not just that - what you are saying is:
1. Imagine DCI makes their own contest rules (rather than corps representatives).
2. Replace "particular company", "specific company" and "certain company" above with "DCI".
Varsity is for-profit. Nothing should be presumed.
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5 hours ago, Jurassic Lancer said:
I think that episode of Drum Corps AF is required listening for anyone wanting to know about Varsity and its implications for drum corps.
Yes! Me,too!
The opinions there need to be understood for exactly what they are.
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Mods, question please: Is it appropriate to discuss commentary from the DrumcorpsAF podcast? Not cut and paste, just discuss the commentary of the presenter.
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11 hours ago, N.E. Brigand said:
You have to be joking.
What Varsity did in some cheerleading contests -- and per that Houston Press article, it appears their founder acknowledged this in court as part of an explanation for why cheerleading shouldn't be considered a sport -- is to award a higher score to teams that bought its products.
Imagine DCI telling corps that their scores would go up if they bought a particular company's uniforms, or played a specific company's instruments, or used a certain company's services for transportation.
Again, you need to dial back your vitriol. I'm not joking and I'm not your enemy nor your punching bag. I don't have to explain to you the format of this platform.
I've read and re-read all of those articles, and I've scanned research sources on the company and its executives not-normally available to the non-paying public. (For instance, despite being private for much of its life, MANY hedge funds have or have had a finger in Varsity's success and each of them correctly crow about their due-diligence in investing in Varsity's ideas. They discuss items of importance without revealing insider information and are extremely helpful in understanding the company and its operations.) I'm willing to spend a few minutes seeing if this podcast comes off as serious discussion. I'll give the message a chance.
I'm simply not going to out of hand disqualify this deep-pocketed fabulously successful business team simply because some here may have a vested podcast research interest or even a strong opinion.
DCI has been FOR DECADES losing relevance and eating its own to now barely call itself a $50million activity. Many people both in and out of the activity have been gnashing teeth and speaking in hushed tones about the coming financial demise of the activity and its descent into irrelevance as other competitive performance activities are stealing its spotlight, all while refusing to see their business-nirvana doesn't come with unfettered freedom to continue the profligate spending ways of drum corps' "leading voices" without, somehow, maintaining enough relevance among fans to pay for it. The activity has always, from day one, been about maximizing the gate to spread the gospel, get kids actively paying for the experience, and draw in adoring (and paying) crowds. That goal demands as much business acumen as it does creative brilliance and, so far, I've seen only one of those demands being met.
Drum corps, the activity, can learn a TON from the Varsity management team and the proposition that doing so somehow sells out the soul of drum corps is silliness. And, for so long as they are willing to allow, DCI should ride their coat-tails into scholastic venues with SS/DLB and without sacrificing itself, its mission, or its goals. It's not an either/or business proposition and anyone who's serious about the discussion will see that enough to allow this discussion to evolve like that relationship could if given the chance.
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4 hours ago, Jeff Ream said:
Varsity makes the rules, not the cheer groups. hence the difference
It's a difference. Sure. Is it a disqualifier? No. Lots of differences: Varsity is clearly "For-Profit", for example.
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3 hours ago, Jeff Ream said:
John held nothing back, and many of us that contribute to the podcast helped research
link?
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5 hours ago, N.E. Brigand said:
Oh come on. You're gaslighting us.
Imagine the NFL telling teams in every game that whichever one spent more with Gatorade in the previous week gets an extra touchdown.
Please, stop attacking personally. If it continues, I will simply report the post.
Your opinion does not trump all others. I've seen this movie.
Seriously, THIS is what you accuse me of for having a different opinion? The term is trendy and popular among some projectionists but is mostly misused, as your usage examples.
""Gaslighting" is used to describe abusive behavior, specifically when an abuser manipulates information in such a way as to make a victim question his or her sanity. Gaslighting intentionally makes someone doubt their memories or perception of reality."
Who's commentary above fits that definition and who's does not?
I don't presume your mind is that weak and you shouldn't presume that I'm so nefarious. I know you know better.
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50 minutes ago, Slingerland said:
DCI has been and continues to be the corps themselves. There's nothing for Varsity to buy, per se. Music for All is probably more at risk, but they seem to be pretty well put together, and circling the scholastic wagons shouldn't be that hard for them to do, as band directors (who are, after all, public school teachers in most cases) are going to be more in tune with non-profit management than something accurately seen as an attempt by a hard goods company to create a tied-circuit in the interest of moving more shoes and uniforms.They'd buy the brand, and they'd pay some multiple of the present value of X years' of expected income, then work like crazy to increase the income for the differential.
Sure, the corps would have to agree. But put, say, half-to-a-million $ in the pocket of each drum corps and see how quickly they come to a decision to sell the brand for someone else to control and grow.
Eh, but what do I know. I'm Schultz.
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1 hour ago, N.E. Brigand said:
You have to be joking.
What Varsity did in some cheerleading contests -- and per that Houston Press article, it appears their founder acknowledged this in court as part of an explanation for why cheerleading shouldn't be considered a sport -- is to award a higher score to teams that bought its products.
Imagine DCI telling corps that their scores would go up if they bought a particular company's uniforms, or played a specific company's instruments, or used a certain company's services for transportation.
Every year DCI tells the corps that they will score better if they buy A&E, march 150 and not 140, sign bus and tractor leases, and compete on a national tour.
In terms of expectations, I'm not seeing much of a difference. Your mileage obviously varies, and probably because the revenue in one goes to a single tour manager and into the hands of corporate sponsors in the other.
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This might help round out the impressions of the evil genius at the top of Varsity.
IBD, Bloomberg, and the WSJ write very favorably of the leadership, and the financial success they enjoy is clear proof that his model works better, financially, than drum corps’. I’ll put that up against a single opinion-writer masquerading as a business writer.
The more I read, the more I’m beginning to believe Varsity to be the kind of interest that drum corps should be clamoring for out of survival!
”Yes! Come in and take Soundsport and DLB to where it needs to be,” — that one elusive place it never found a home - schools.
Welcome, Varsity!
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31 minutes ago, Jeff Ream said:
their owner admitted groups wearing Varsity wear score better. it's called monopoly......corner every piece of the market you can and use scoring as a way to make it happen
And drum corps score better when they adhere to the competitive rules they themselves create. I’m not seeing much difference. They both need kids and fans to pay up.
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So Varsity goes from elementary to college.
sounds like a match made in heaven for DCI.
I’d say the real challenge is in getting Varsity to care enough!
COMMONWEALTH vs GEORGE HOPKINS 10-23-19
in DCI World Class Corps Discussions
Posted
That wasn’t the point, IMO