Weaklefthand4ever
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Posts posted by Weaklefthand4ever
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58 minutes ago, BigW said:
One of my favorite sites, although it was down for a few days recently.
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1 minute ago, Tim K said:
It sounds more a high school activity. I can’t imagine a bygone era in drum corps where you would vote for the most handsome male and prettiest girl. Perhaps it happened. The bygone era was known for toughness and grit, and the directors I know from that time would have loved the opportunity to wipe the pretty boy face off the most handsome male and dashed the beauty queen dreams of the prettiest girl.
I don't know why I have the ending scene of Dirty Dancing going through my mind now.
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25 minutes ago, JimF-LowBari said:
“Gives .05 of eligible you make” wth is that in English?
That's Engrish Jim.
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On 11/13/2018 at 5:59 PM, garfield said:
A great deal has to do with how typical George Hopkins' situations is in the activity. I would say in many ways he is atypical. Yes every director wants what is best for his/her corps as GH did. He did push the envelope during his time with DCI, but again that is not that different from other directors. He called all the shots, but again that is not that different from other directors. However, what makes a difference is that we may be dealing with someone who could be diagnosed with a narcissistic personality, which should be stated at the outset is not an excuse for criminal behavior, and this adds a different dimension. His rants were like no others. When people disagreed with him, he reacted in a way that differentiated him from other directors. He also believed rules did not apply to him yet he made sure every rule applied to everyone else. The fact that some of the behavior GH is being charged with takes place in a wok environment and some may involve spiking a drink may make this situation unique
I knew someone would be thinking along the same line (I'm sure many do.) Let's face it, the man is a malignant narcissist. I wouldn't be shocked if somehow a claim of NPD was brought forward. In this case (if I remember the way the specific law works,) NPD is still considered a "Character Disorder" which wouldn't offer any protection from a legal perspective. Many of his so called "apologies" from the old "yeahguy" blog site seemed to certainly point to this type of character flaw. His messages always seemed to be devoid of actual empathy and had that air of "sorry (not sorry) if your feelings got hurt but you have to accept me as I am." Malignant narcissists are only fearful of being caught....it's the only thing that tempers their control tactics. I guess in hindsight, he must have felt safe since, until this story broke, he was continuing to get away with his actions from his rants all the way trough to the allegations of sexual abuse / misconduct. I'm glad the victims found the voice to come forward. I'm certain there will be more.
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On 11/14/2018 at 9:31 AM, Fran Haring said:
That appears to be the case in a lot of states.
For one example, I would hazard a guess that no other state employee in Alabama is even on the radar screen compared to what Nick Saban is paid. LOL. Heck... there are many NFL coaches who are not in his neighborhood.
At 11 million a year or somewhere around that mark, I would say you're absolutely correct.
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21 hours ago, Jeff Ream said:
ah yes, Symphonic Dances for the confused drum corps fan as it was called
LOL. I remember sitting in the stands at finals with my late father and him saying stuff like "They just made a blob....why is it a blob? Ohhhhh....now it makes sense....it turned into a stick thing with another bigger stick thing. Wait...why is there a big blue beach ball?!?! I'm so confused! But I like the music!"
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22 hours ago, dans said:
Absolutely loved 88 Suncoast. One of my favorite shows!
I did as well. '88 was my "I'm taking a season off" year (in truth it was my "What do you mean I'm cut?!?" year.) That show always appealed to me as accessible and fan friendly.
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17 hours ago, BigW said:
I remember when Spirit circa 1979-1980 had a line of these snares or ones very similar in early season, and they didn't last very long, going to a more conventional snare made by someone else:
I can't quite figure out how to magnify this and the board won't let me upload an image. That being said...let's hear it for Septoms. I think every group should have a set for when kids complain about the weight of modern drums.
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20 minutes ago, awunderlich said:
If ever there was a time for TAMA to make a play it is now
At probably what....close to 18K for a battery, it's gonna take a hell of a move to bring it within reach.
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2 hours ago, Jeff Ream said:
the 18 inch bass weighed about the same as a 26 inch Pearl
Did North drums and Stingray have any association? I remember 86 BD breaking out the North Tri-Toms for Channel One Suite but I don't remember the specific lineage.
Speaking of of this brings back a horrible / funny memory of being at a Spirit camp (I can't remember if it was 86 or 87,) and one of us auditioners had one of the old Ludwig HV snares with a double rimmed chrome Power Stroke (Power Blow) head on it and it ###### one of the techs off (might have been either Scott Brown or Turtle) enough that a stick was driven suddenly through head like spiking a vampire. Bad snare concept, horrible horrible horrible head (though at least you always kept your eyes up,) and double rimming. Ahhhhh the memories.
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23 minutes ago, Lance said:
You must have really hated their Juliet production, then.
Juliet was 13, and her dad was making her marry a grown man, and iit was perfectly normal back then.
Lol. Not my all time favorite show but it had some great moments. I look forward to seeing what PR can out out there.
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On 10/31/2018 at 4:47 PM, Jeff Ream said:
hey look, i know the amount of hell Dan DeLong, Kevin Murphy, John Stauffer, Andy Hostettler, Chris Moyer, Chris Pagotto, Ken Hackman, myself and others went through to get Stingray drums to sound good for us at Westshore. Doesn't mean the drums still didn't suck. it just meant we killed ourselves trying to make them sound good
If only you could have gotten them to not weigh 697 lbs Jeff.
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On 11/2/2018 at 12:56 PM, Lance said:
Joan of Arc
There were some murders in that story, right?
So, gold for Phantom in 2019 it is!
Well....if being burned at the stake is considered murder. You never really know these days. Someone will probably give us one of those "well...you have to understand that things were different in the 1430's. The rules of conduct weren't clearly defined so...." lines.
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I've put a great deal of thought into this topic since the GH "scandal" broke months back. I put "scandal" in quotes for one simple reason. Though deplorable and shameful to the activity we all love, I truly don't believe that anyone who has been around this activity for any length of time truly believed that something of this nature wasn't going to come to light at some point in time. In every large organization involving underage participants, there is the potential for abuse. Take that same group and put them on tour for two months and the potential increases significantly. Does that mean that we throw the baby out with the bathwater and shut the book on DCI? IMHO, the answer is no. In almost EVERY large organization there are examples of scandal and abuse. If we closed down every business which has any report of misconduct (we can stretch this to misconduct of any sort if you so choose,) there would be almost no businesses left. I have worked in the corporate world for over 20 years at the Sr. management level and some of things I've heard, and unfortunately witnessed were outright disturbing. Someone said in a similar thread that it's a Risk vs. Reward scenario. I cannot agree with that statement simply because the risk to those who are abused cannot be offset by the reward of the experiences of those who never were. It's simply not a fair comparison. One bad experience cannot be outweighed by ANY number of good experiences when seen through the lens of a victim (nor should it be.) I personally never experienced any issues nor heard any rumors during my time marching but I am not naive enough to believe that things didn't happen and won't possibly happen in the future. You can only mitigate to a certain point.
On 10/31/2018 at 7:16 PM, Slingerland said:The CEO of any non-profit reports to their Board. In this case, the Board is still predominantly made up of individuals who are salaried employees of member corps...which is the beginning of the problem.
Excellent point. This is in serious need of restructure though I can't be certain that this isn't common in the non-profit world. I don't think we can hold DCI up in comparison necessarily with other organizations as it is a unique activity.
On 11/1/2018 at 7:49 AM, garfield said:What would DCI, the organization, need to look like to accomplish that kind of "Tour Management" for the whole activity?
When will drum corps be able to not waste creative energy on getting kids and equipment safely and happily down the road?
"What a wonderful world..." drum corps could be. IMO
/AGREE Indeed what a wonderful world it would be. I've worked for some extremely large companies with HUGE vendor / outsourcing populations. We always had a group that handled the management of those companies in every facet of how they worked within the confines of our company standards. Things always tend to work better when the vendors are left to control and discuss how they will accomplish the best possible outcomes for their employees and not have to worry about every detail of how the business moves as a whole.
23 hours ago, karuna said:No one is buying the "I was powerless to act" nonsense. They had a duty to report suspected abuse. They failed. They need to go.
In many states failing to report is a crime. Failing to report when abuse is actually proven is often a felony.
I don't disagree that things should be reported and investigated. I do, however, have some experience with this at a corporate level. You can (and should,) report and investigate (if that is within your scope of responsibility,) an allegation of misconduct. However, there are simply put, situations where the circumstances of what is reported make it very difficult to take much action. In my world, if someone comes to me and states that they feel an offensive and/or hostile work environment has been created, it is my job to report that situation to HR regardless of any evidence. Even if that individual does not WANT it reported, the fact that they brought it to me puts the need for action squarely on my shoulders. But if someone's uncles, brothers, sisters, third cousins fourth roommate tells me "I heard through the grapevine that so and so did such and such," that makes it a difficult call. I can ASK that individual to report the situation to HR, but I have no specific guidance / directive to do so. The best path in that situation is generally to report it directly to my supervisor. It's a very fine line and having something credible to report is far different than stirring the rumor mill, and we all know how the rumor mill goes on here as well as in our own business lives.
There are several changes which need to take place in the activity. That is a true enough statement. I don't know the inner workings as well as others seen to know here. I also don't have the time, nor the inclination, to source, verify and fight about legalities. That being said, there seem to be a lot of assumptions about who knew what and when and I am simply not of the belief that it is my job or place to pass judgement on a situation that I am not in full knowledge of the FACTS about. I've been on the bad side of that little trap before and it's not a pleasant place. I think the biggest overall change is that DCI, much like most companies, needs to be proactive rather than reactive and that's a HUGE change for any organization. I worked for AT&T for 20 years at the corporate level and spent all 20 of it peeing on fires that we created ourselves. The approach was always to react because "You don't want to overreact to something that hasn't happened yet or the investors will flip their $%#%." It eventually got to me enough that I retired and went to work for a much more progressive company which attempts to pre-plan for contingencies.
Hire an outside firm to consult on how things should be run to give the best (and safest,) possible experience to the kids and staff shoud look. I wish Jim Cook were still around. I always found his insight and common sense to be a breath of fresh air. He hired the experts to do what they did best and didn't seem to ever put much faith in what he THOUGHT he knew. At least that was always my interaction with him.
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On 10/16/2018 at 1:10 PM, Jeff Ream said:
shoulda been around TOB in 92. Mechanicsburg did a Beauty and the Beast show, and had the teacups etc out there. CV parents made up buttons with teacups on them with a slash thru them ala Ghostbusters. other parents around them got annoyed so the next week they showed up with buttons with CV in place of the teacups.
I may complain about spectator behavior at corps shows, but band world takes the cake. thats why i rarely go to a band show unless i am teaching or judging.
That's a pretty common thing unfortunately. Even now, I hear parents talk about how amazing their kids band program is and how they can't BELIEVE that so and so band beat them at X competition and how it's all about how big and loud you are. I went to a show recently where parents were actually HECKLING other bands. There's no place for that in the marching arts. I also saw multiple parents and kids break ranks of other groups. A few of the kids asked me about my corps jacket, but their parents seemed to have no clue that there was anything beyond screaming at the top of their lungs and complaining. I also hear a lot of "In 2001 I was in color guard and we won the [insert random band competition here] and we were the best that there ever was" stuff. I just want to tell them to crawl back into their cars and watch Bruce Springsteen "Glory Days" on a continuous loop.
I get supporting your kids. My parents always went to at least DCI SE when I marched and HS band competitions once I rejoined my HS group. But come on...have some respect for what these kids are trying to do. Since when did HS Marching Band become HS Football? Maybe it's worse in the south than in other areas.
Our band directors were still highly involved in the DCI activity and were very, VERY specific on etiquette with the parents at HS shows and competitions. I hate to think it's a generational thing, but it does seem to follow that path.
The show was great and the kids seemed to have fun performing it. THAT is the most important thing. Someone stated that this could very well be the next generation of DCI performers and that's probably a true enough statement. If the level of music education is good and the kids are pushing their own expectations of what can be done on the field, I'm all for it.
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On 10/25/2018 at 12:23 AM, Jeff Ream said:
didn't use Stingray eh?
And Corders.....never forget that the best shells are exploding shells.
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On 10/15/2018 at 3:51 PM, queenanne_1536 said:
You're going to get a bunch of different opinions. I'd take those opinions and view some of the suggested shows based on period. For me, '85 - '93 is probably my favorite era because most shows were so highly entertaining. The hornlines played more, the drill was demanding and cohesive, and the guard work was very synchronized. Vanguard 2018 is one of my all time favorite shows, but in general the activity has lost me a bit after 2013. I just find of 12 finalist shows I'm generally bored with 7-8 of them. I didn't feel that way '84 - 2013. Find the era you like most and start there, then branch out.
I think you hit the nail on the head and my guess is that it's honesty generational. My first live experience with DCI was in 1984 in Birmingham and I started marching in 1987. I'm drawn to roughly that same time frame of shows with very few exceptions and usually those exceptions are very much stand out's for one reason or another (2016 Bluecoats would be an example.)
To my eyes and ears, the mid-80's through roughly 2011 had a great balance between M&M, sound, accessible (and entertaining) music all of which created highly entertaining shows that I can still hum from beginning to end to this day (as I type this '87 Sky Ryders "There's a place for us" just popped into my head.) I don't know if to my senses the horns line played more. I always felt through performing and playing, that the musical level (difficulty,) hasn't really changed much from then to now. The drill is certainly more demanding and I MARVEL at how these young adults fly across the field. There's just something about the fine balance of that "generation" of shows that makes them memorable to me more so that today's.
My father hated the electronics being introduced but I truly believe that if used tastefully, they can add a tremendous amount of additional voicing to shows. As he got older, I would introduce him to shows with subtle uses of electronics and I truly don't believe he ever noticed.
In short, I think the biggest difference came to me when I first saw PR 2010. That show, whether you are a fan or not, elicited an emotional response that to me, sums up a generation of drum corps sound which I continue to search for every year and every show.
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6 minutes ago, JimF-LowBari said:
Wonder what are the legalities of those pbs videos. Seems like back then less rights laws on music, audio and video rights as compared to today. And the laws that existed were ignored. PBS probably has the rights to the recordings but as to the music itself? Could end up with no audio at spots like today if anyone even wants to do the research.
Valid point. I haven't studied how the laws actually work nor do I have the patience to truly wade into the subject as it deserves. I would have thought in my younger years that there would be some sort of statute of limitations if you will on video material.
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On 10/11/2018 at 9:57 PM, StrikerEZ said:
Yeah, that probably would’ve been the easier way to do it lol.
That sounds like a good idea. I’ll have to ask David, a guy who marched Mandarins this past year, if he has any videos. And there might be someone I know in my band who has a flash drive with tons of shows on it, so I might see if I can get my hands on that....
Well, I guess it just depends on your definition of ”relative.” I’ve only been following the activity for a couple years now, but I’ve gone back and watched a few older shows. (Tilt should’ve won lol)
Not that I condone possibly "questionable" videos, but an internet search using some filters pretty much got me to full shows of everything listed so far. Granted, the audio/video quality can be questionable. It's a shame that PBS.org doesn't have anything in their video archives after all of the years championships were aired there.
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On 10/10/2018 at 9:51 PM, Sideways said:
Has not been mentioned yet but you will want to watch Suncoast Sound 1988...easily 15 years ahead of its time.
I hadn't thought about that show in years until you mentioned it. I don't think I really appreciated that show at the time (I had just marched my rookie season the year before,) but I grew to dig it later.
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I think that's the culture of most of the top lines. As was stated, if you have the chops, the feet/legs and the attitude to keep up then I would go for it. If not, there are always corps looking for volunteers for both DCI and DCA. I know my back simply will NOT take marching another year so I've reached out to a DCI and DCA corps that I marched with previously to see what kind of help I can offer them.
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'03 Phantom and I loved 2010 Phantom as well.
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On 9/7/2018 at 3:37 PM, BigW said:
3: I know it's been tried, I know when it's been done it's been a positive thing... it's a question of time, setting up the whole situation- Outreach to the scholastic end. Clinics... teaching materials...there's a wealth of fantastic instructors and groups who could really sell the brand in such a positive way if this was done. I know, I know, no time. There has to be a way to make this time. Someone on staff that functions mostly or totally as some sort of educational liaison? Build that bridge, students and directors will cross, at least those who understand.
And that is the part that I guess I never truly understood. I was one of the lucky ones I guess in the early to mid 80's. My father took to me my first DCI finals in 1984. His sister was involved with the Bridgemen and at one point, he was approached to be involved in some way with Suncoast Sound (he was a food service director at the time,)but I don't believe it ever came to fruition. My band directors were all highly involved in DCI at one point or another (Jim Gladson, Perry Vandergriff, Joel Denton and Preston Gunter.) We were encouraged to go to DCI shows. We went to Spirits camps in mid 80's at West Georgia or Merryville. They shaped my love and involvement in Drum and Bugle Corps for both DCI and later DCA.
I understand the importance of summer band camps, the attitude that some of the kids come back to their HS programs with regarding quality and work ethic. My HS directors always sat down with any of those who were marching corps before HS band camp and clearly defined the dynamic differences between the two.
Why exactly is there such "bad blood" between some HS Band Directors and Drum Corps 30 years later? THAT's what I would like to know. DCI (and DCA) should be encouraging kids and directors to come out to shows with significant discounts if they aren't doing so already. That would be one way to get some younger blood in the audience it would seem.
In my real life, I'm an instructional designer. I spend 60 hours a week at call centers all over the world. I interact with a LOT of proud parents who's kids are in their local HS marching band. What's shocking is that almost NONE of them know what drum corps is...at all. Their very vocal about their kids "amazing marching band" and many of them have a real chip on their shoulder that something else exists.
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I've been looking on the alumni page and the facebook site. Worst case scenario, I'll see them and Spirit at DCI South.
George Hopkins Charged with two Counts Sexual Assault
in DCI World Class Corps Discussions
Posted
#### it man! I had almost forgotten that I once endured that movie after reading the book (in the theater no less.) But you do indeed draw an interesting parallel.