Cuban
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Posts posted by Cuban
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Mmmm, not necessarily. It might just mean they are the line that gets the most attention and are the most popular. Style over substance, in other words. Not to say they were awful or anything, just sayin. A lot of people in the 90's might have told you that the Madison Scouts were the best drum corps every year, and they were indeed very good, extremely popular and entertaining. But I can think of some drum corps who were consistently just...better, from a performance quality standpoint. Does it make people who like Madison (or SCV's plate line) wrong for liking them? No. Again, just sayin.
Yes, thats fine in the situation and anecdote that you used it with, but this is not the case in this scenario. They are doing many things right, they aren't just popular because they get attention, they get attention because they're one of if not the best.
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Sorta agree, thats why i'm not too big of an SCV cymbal fan, I am a fan or the corps, but don't see what the big deal is with the cymbal line.
I do understand that they're pretty much visual and the crowd, especially the kids, respond to it.
I guess thats what bothers me, that they're hyped up so much, but they only use 1 technique while playing (which isn't the best for sound quality, but theres no right or wrong way to play cymbals) , and stick to pretty much the same visuals. I will give them credit for precision and execution though. I guess its just what the crowd likes, kinda like the cowboys or yankees...america's teams but haven't won a championship in...how long?
EDIT: For people who say cymbal lines are useless, watch academy's show last year and picture it without a cymbal line.....impossible. Their drill practically revolved around the cymbals. They had great drill, technique, and visuals.
Funny you mention Academy. They are taught by a former SCV Cymbal Player, and use the exact same approach and technique Vanguard uses.
I respect the SCV cymbal line for exactly what you disagreed with them on. (Speaking of, how is there technique not the best for sound quality? Who decided what was best for sound quality, and what technique would that be?)
They are consistently one of the cleanest sections in the activity, and while they may recycle things, they have more identity and history than any other plate line this far. And when the same guy is heading it for 15+ years, of course its going to look virtually the same year after year.
If most people reply that "SCV Has the best plate line" every year, they must be doing a lot of things right.
P.S. Check out spirit this summer. Rebuilding a program, and hopefully back on track soon.
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Nearly all my hype music, are old shows from the group(s) I march with.
Specific ones that arent:
SCV 03.
Steve Reich (Electric Counterpoint) Movement 3: Fast.
Sublime
Just about anything Beatles.
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No, he's not agreeing with you...he's saying your oversimplifying the predicament of the rising cost of "the drum corps experience" to almost self-righteous proportions...
I don't want to be a jerk, but...this is exactly what I was attempting to explain.
Its just not as simple as: "Where there is a will, there is a way."
One last example, I would have marched a certain California Corps last year, If I hadn't had my credit card "used" by a family member and left me without the money I had saved.
I hate to bring up stupid personal things. But those types of experiences happen to a great many people.
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I am agreeing with you in very small ways, and trying to explain why people just have to give up.
Some people bust their backs for sponsorships, get a few, and are still missing a LOT of money.
Its one of the reasons I cant get into college yet. I get all these grants and bonuses because im broke, with a government loan that is limited to a certain ammount because its my first year, I still have about $3-4,000 Im accountable for, but without credit for another loan, you dont go to school. Because you have no other choice, when you cant get a good paying job without a degree or networking, and dont have credit because you are so young.
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If you aren't willing to work for / spend / fund $4000 for corps, then you will not march because it isn't in your interests to do so.
Obviously, you are offended by what I have said, and you are right, you do not need to justify anything. However, I will keep my opinion until I learn more about the reasons for not marching.
Hello,
After reading several of your..."Opinions"...here is a good example for you.
I age out this coming summer. I have been exposed to the activity since I was 5 years old. My family is full of musicians and the like, had a lot of friends that marched etc.
My parents growing up, had 4 kids, and were never good with money. They still are not, and that was always something out of my control. Ive tried to find the money for the last 6 years to march. Every time I have come up short. I sent countless letters to Doctors, Lawyers, Businesses, friends, family, and anything else I can think of. I never was left with enough.
Due to many reasons ever since I was able to start working (15ish) , I had to help support my family finacially. I have 2 jobs, and only 1 of my 3 siblings are helping along with me, keep my parents off the street. I was however, able to march in Music City Mystique the last 5 years. (Independent World Class Drumline since '95) At this point, the dream ive had of marching Corps is something Im physically doing every thing I can to make happen.
Its going to cost me $5,000 to get this done. But when you have house payments, long time building debt, typical bills, ROUND TRIP tickets once a month from November-February, Camp fees, Food for living, Tour Fees, and Gas money while working, 5,000 is one of the most daunting financial figures I can imagine.
I am planning on selling my car, selling what ever belongings can be sold, and willing to leave my family in a slightly worse position for my 11 minuets at finals. From what I understand, you do not have a concept of just HOW FAR some are willing to go to march, but just CANNOT make that descision.
Get any penny you can for a chance to march, audition, risk getting cut AFTER you spent the money, and be left out on the street. For many people in the States, thats the reality whether you choose to or not.
I can live off of $5,000 for almost a year, no joke. And I know this is a lot of rambling, but you need to get it in your head that most American's view $5,000 as an unbelivable ammount of money.
"Then its not in your best interest to march."
My rebuttle to the fact that you think in absolutes is the following:
What kind of a dream is it, if you aren't willing to truly sacrifice every single thing to get it?
Im willing to be left homeless to march my age out, and to end an amazing performance career with something Ive wanted since childhood. And I have an idea that Ill have a completely different experience standing at retreat than a few others.
I hope that was a good example for you.
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I like this idea...I think it would have to be an all-age type of thing simply due to school for most kids under 21...if anyone wants to start one, I'm there!
You do realize that in WGI, there are thousands upon thousands of students performing each year...and its growing insanely more and more each year...
Both percussion and guard are enourmous, have hundreds of highschools, and independent groups all decently classified and draw in thousands of spectators each april....
There is no reason why you would have to have all age.....
Every weekend or during the week rehearsals just like all the groups do already....It would be very successful and It'll just take the right people to push it forward....
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Raw, intense, and pure emotion. That show sums up the Vanguard's incredible legacy to me.
It is also music that many people flat out ADORE. Its beautiful, and entertaining, and just something that most fans can relate to.
It is a good example of the simple enjoyment you can get out of Drum and Bugle Corps.
EDIT: By the way. that new SCV banner is awesome.
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Goosebumps. That is seriously awesome!
Michael, your journalism is always something I look up to as a journalist major myself!
Keep it up!
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So the actions of a Director means they didnt deserve to win if they were the best?
( Just feeding the fire. And wondering what thats supposed to mean.)
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I want to see SCV either move up, or stay still.
I want to see Cadets move up. (12 years since anyone other than semis winner won finals...)
I want...a cheeseburger.
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why do they announce all the other scores and leave the last ?
thats why i like WGI...this is torture
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Save it. There is at least two other corps that don't get due credit. Phantoms score has risen dramatically here in the last week or so. They are in 4th and have been as low as about 6th this year. Don't even.
AMEN.
Thank you.
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With all the end of the world ideas with DCI......and the rediculous hatred for people walking and playing music on a piece of grass...
Why the hell can't we just watch drum corps....
Who cares if you don't like it....
I didn't like Spirit's 88 show...but since when does anyone have to like all of them? I still give them the credit they deserve...(not a knock at spirit...except for 88 :P )
With all this cadets hate...and people freaking out over the actions of whomever...
A very...personal friend of mine...is currently marching...and the actions of the crowd last night, actually has the corps pumped to have the very best show possible...
If anything is wrong, its the fact that performers have to get pumped about throwing a bad reaction back in the audience's faces instead of just doing what they love...and thats perform a bada** show...
Regardless. Leave the drama for reality TV. Im pretty sure the performers could care less about any of it.
Please. Just Watch Drum Corps.
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2 Points are reinstated.
More news at 11.
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Drum Corps International is good.
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This reminds me of the 2004 Quarterfinals theatre showing.
Interviewing a Cavalier as he walks off the field.
"So, what do you think it takes to be a James Bond Girl?"
"Well, I can show you."
And the crowd goes wild.
(( I dont remember the exact words, but thats close enough ))
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Im not going to lie, i honestly am sick of Jolesch. I know one company, that shot WGI percussion in 2006, Happel, was unbelievable...ive never in my life seen such great shots in the activity.
They had about 5 photographers covering different areas of the arena and taking outstanding shots at incredible mooments of shows. Jolesch just waits till somoene is standing still and shoots rapid fire.
Ive never understood why they continue to deal with a company that "generally" doesn't deliver.
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its not what he says (the music student part), but who is saying it....
Its creepy the way he speaks....im sure in that corps there is a better Speaker, a better actor...but then again, its also tied with the drill....
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More Plates would be a dream. But there are not enough competent instructors. And there are not very many willing caption heads either. And some of the few competent teachers had to deal with not so willing caption heads...what'dya do ?
Hopefully things will start to change in the next 2-3 years...
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i would love to see it...some crazy different scores and placements...but..
honestly with all this hype and excitement, i dont think anythign different will happen...I think the usual placements will occur that take place every single year...
*most* of these long standing top 5 corps have developed formulas for success and that wont change....
most of the upsets will happen of course, finals week...once everyone is done and every member (and lets face it, it happens) takes every bit of it seriously....
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Looks like they've decided to take a direction of....this isn't a joke....I love it...
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yea...so whos the girl?
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Spirit = NO. What the heck is that? Im sorry...but a bad WGI percusison uniform?
Bluecoats = I love it...i think its very aggressive and serious...
Glassmen = Someone bring back the 02 uniform...
Cadets = Always looking good....
Madison = When is someone going to save this corps? Nothing but changes the last few years...they need some consistency...i miss the 05 uniform...that was way awesome...
Crown = I really do like the idea...but the part in the front...hanging...looks like it could be...painful...
Cymbal Lines
in DCI World Class Corps Discussions
Posted · Edited by Cuban
The same way you cant be convinced any particular one is "the best," you cannot convince me that they are not, and have not been the cleanest year to year. And no matter what you say, this activity is about cleanliness. Its competitive, and its judged on who has each member looking as close to identical as possible. They have a uniformity of technique, sound, and that extra element of an aura about them. Now Im not going to say that CERTAIN players of other groups don't have that, but not many other lines have every last person on that same page.
Southwind had a few the last summer, Music City Mystique has a few each year, Spirit had it in 2004, Some magic members in 05, etc. All cool, but missing that undeniable element from EVERY LAST PLAYER.
And rut-roh, Id love to know what lines you found to be "better" and what years. And Id like to hope it's not based all on I&E.
You also can't convince me that any other cymbal line thus far works harder than the SCV cats. They move in months before anyone else and rehearse as much as possible during those weeks. Im pretty positive no one else does the same. This always gets argued amongst cymbal players, I guess it can't be helped, I just do believe that SCV is on another level when it comes to what they do. (Im not saying they are the only right way of doing things...) Many groups have come close, but ended up changing techs, or disappearing before really reaching that level.
Im not trying to get into a huge argument over it, but I hate to see people with statements such as "Ive seen better." Without some sort of opinions on whom they saw was cleaner.
They aren't hyped because of gimmicks. They're hyped because when the audience watches what they're doing, its clean, uncomplicated, and performed intensely.
And I certainly hope you aren't catagorizing me as someone who just sits and watches. I've marched great lines, I've marched bad ones, and I've taught great lines. I look at the cymbal line extremely fairly. Im not just a fanboy.
I just don't subscribe to this "everyone works just as hard!" when in life, some people work harder, or are pushed harder. MANY work hard, but just not quite as much as others. Just because a cymbal line Isn't hyped, doesn't mean they are worth less, but the ones that are hyped, usually have people, alumni, kids, etc. supporting them by getting the word out, and getting videos out to the public. I DO subscribe to the philosophy that if a GREAT cymbal tech (Diaz, Eddie, Robert, Gomez) can stick it out with a program for many years, there is a better chance that the success can build upon itself. Eddie and Robert are testaments to that (minus the fact that the cymbal program got screwed at spirit after 2004 which was out of the tech's control).
Diaz on the other hand, I'm pretty sure didn't have a huge choice in his having to corps hop. He had some great lines at random places yes, but things would be much different if he had the chance to stick around a solid corps for multiple years. I really do attribute a lot of the loss of cymbal lines to the fact that there are very few qualified teachers for it, and the handful of truly qualified ones are sick and tired of dealing with caption heads that don't respect the instrument or the people that each it.
SCV gets a lot of attention. Yes, much of it it has a lot to do with the fact that people record them, post them on their website of choice, and spread the word of mouth. It also helps that they haven't had any real off years in a LONG time. And their corps has managed to not have to go inactive thus far. But a lot of it has to do with their actions. They set the example for a corps that has remained one of the best almost since the activity has been around. That is not an easy task.
Im not going to lie, I really feel like its not that hard to achieve that level, but it takes administration to hire the right person, and not threaten to take the section away just because it takes a bit to