Shadow_7 Posted March 4, 2007 Share Posted March 4, 2007 Most Euphoniums have trouble with intonation. That's why the good ones have a compensating system and a 4th valve. So valve combinations are more in tune, and you have more valve combinations to choose from to help better intonation. Has anyone played the King Tuba? 1141SP? or 1151SP? How does it compare to a Deg 4 valve (swiss made) or other Tubas/Contras? Is the 1141 awkward to manuever with the 4th valve being played by the other hand? Is it well balanced? I'm looking at buying one of those Phantom Tubas since the local startup corps went Bb and owns no horns. Does it have good visibility when marching drill? I haven't found any reviews of it on the internet to form an opinion of a horn I've never played or seen in anything other than pictures. Thanks in advance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow_7 Posted March 5, 2007 Share Posted March 5, 2007 I finally found one review, under the 1151 for the 4 valve 1141. As I feared it appears to be odd to handle. A bit bell heavy, and the 4th valve is too far back when in the playing position to play comfortably. And just looking at the specs, the 1151 seems to be the better horn for the outdoors. They're both supposedly good sounding horns, with nickel plated valves which is a plus. 4 valve BBb Tuba - 1141 - Bell: 19.5" / Bore 0.687 3 valve BBb Tuba - 1151 - Bell: 21" / Bore 0.734 The propaganda difference being superior intonation for the 4 valve, and no mention of that for the 3 valve. Plus some visibility to the left, and comfortable to hold for the 3 valve, which isn't mentioned for the 4 valve. I guess I'm leaning towards the 3 valve horn then. Unless I find a better option. The review also said that the bracing didn't hold up even for horns under a year old. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
regularsopguy Posted March 5, 2007 Share Posted March 5, 2007 I noticed recently that Kanstul reduced the list prices of their marching tubas (Bb contras to some of us!) last year: $8740 this year: $7570 i also noticed that the list price on their marching euph was lower last year: $3015 this year: $2990 would this make people consider kanstul marching brass again I wonder? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow_7 Posted March 5, 2007 Share Posted March 5, 2007 i also noticed that the list price on their marching euph was lowerlast year: $3015 this year: $2990 Is this for the Bb horns? I paid $1,835 in 2002 for a new G Euph. And the 2006 suggested retail price is $2,190 for the same Euph model. Granted that when I looked in 2002, the Deg Gs were assumed to go for about that $3K amount. At least according to a response I got from my inquiry email. I think the main reason many don't use Kanstul is that they don't finance the horns. You must pay for the horns before they even start building them. At least for the G's. As an individual consumer. Back in 2002 when I bought mine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LunchboxTScontra Posted March 6, 2007 Share Posted March 6, 2007 I've been lucky enough to be able to play on both manufacturers of horns, and I'm on the fence. The Yamaha Contra was light, and had a quick response, as well as a quick valve timing; but I felt that it had a bright response which isn't one of the characteristics that I think of on the Field. I've marched with the King Contra and I'm comfortable with the sound it produces as well as the stability of it. The biggest problem I have with the King Contras is the positioning of the 4th valve. It's extremely cumbersome to have to take your left hand and rotate it inward to use the valve. Another problem with the King Contras is the durability of the brackets holding the slides together, they seem to become weak and break after about two or three seasons of use. Overall I would say go with King. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow_7 Posted March 27, 2007 Share Posted March 27, 2007 I finally got a 1141SP King. It's a really nice playing horn, worth the Phantom price just on that trait. The King(19.5" bell) plays much better than what I recall of the Yamaha 201(17.5" bell). It plays and sounds close to my Conn 20J. Although the Conn 20J is more lush and able to take more volume before it starts to get a little tin-ny. I've only had the King a couple hours now, but it's a nice playing horn. I would have to concur on the poor marchability of the horn. I have yet to figure out a good position/finger to use to make use of the 4th valve. So far using my thumb and rotating the wrist to engage the valve seems the most comfortable. Except that you've got to move the valve a considerable distance to engage it. There's no short action valves here. And the valve is rather recessed into the tubing of the horn. Which is good for the protection of the valve, but not so good when trying to use it. Anyone know which hands and placements are best for handling this 1141SP horn? It's mint enough that there's no worn spots to indicate where others have gripped the horn. And no obvious handles and gizmos to indicate where it was intended to be handled. Anybody have a Kontruba manual for the 1141? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supersop Posted March 27, 2007 Share Posted March 27, 2007 Kanstul G bugles all the way Soprano Bugle KSB 100 G .470 5" Diameter Bell; $ 735 Powerbore Soprano KSB 102 G .470 5" Diameter Bell; Heavy Mouthpiece Receiver; $ 800 Mellophone Bugle KMB 180 G .470 10 ½" Diameter Bell $ 920 French Horn Bugle KHB 185 G .470 10" Diameter Bell $ 1,215 Baritone Bugle KBB 190 G .562 10" Diameter Bell $ 1,215 Bass Baritone Grande KBG 191 G .562 10" Diameter Bell $ 1,250 Euphonium Bugle KEB 195 G .593 11 ½" Diameter Bell $ 2,190 Contra Bass Bugle KCB 201 G .689 19" Diameter Bell 18 lbs $ 6,110 Contra Grande Bugle KCG 200 G .689 21" Diameter Bell 26 lbs $ 7,235 Seems like great pricing for brand new horns direct from the factory ... THAT ARE MADE IN AMERICA! www.kanstul.net Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idontwan2know Posted March 27, 2007 Share Posted March 27, 2007 Kanstul G bugles all the way <snip> Seems like great pricing for brand new horns direct from the factory ... THAT ARE MADE IN AMERICA! www.kanstul.net Yeah, sure, if you've got the $100k up front, are prepared to wait 6 months to a year to get your horns and have virtually no resale market once you're ready for a new set. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadow_7 Posted March 27, 2007 Share Posted March 27, 2007 and have virtually no resale market once you're ready for a new set. Unfortunately that applies to all G lines. Fortunately the Troopers and now the Kilties have bought at least in part some NEW G horns. Which should help keep the after market inventory stocked for a few more years at least. ----- Anyone know where to get after market King tuba parts? I could use a brace screw or two and maybe an aftermarket tuning slide as the one I have needs to be about 3" shorter to keep me from playing 20 cents flat. With my King 1141, I'm pushed in all over the place and still 20 cents flat across the board. Plugging the spit valve only raises it 3 to 5 cents. And that's with a middle of the road mouthpiece, I'd hate to see where it sits if I throw in my Caver, a PT-88 based mouthpiece. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mchromik Posted March 27, 2007 Share Posted March 27, 2007 Unfortunately that applies to all G lines. Fortunately the Troopers and now the Kilties have bought at least in part some NEW G horns. Which should help keep the after market inventory stocked for a few more years at least. The Troopers took delivery of a new set of Yamaha Bb brass this winter, Pioneer is the lone G line in Div1. They had relatively new G horns for sale earlier this winter on their website. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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