RichCranford82

I see where you're trying to go with this analogy but it just doesn't hold water for me. Let me try an analogy of my own. Let's say your a big fan of the NBA. Now there have been changes to the game throughout the years to be sure (3 point line, shot clock etc.) but the nature of the game has pretty much stayed the same. Next year the powers that be decide that in an effort to assist in dunking ability trampolines will be added to the court (I forget what they called that thing on tv a few years back where essentially the entire court was a trampoline, you see how long that lasted). Would you still be as big a fan of the NBA and the game you fell in love with at that point? When DCI allowed the amplification of ANYTHING that's exactly the point for me when the changes made went beyond the scope of "minor" and in fact drastically changed the nature of the activity, for the very first time in the history of Drum Corps you could no longer consider it acoustic. I recall reading in another post someone felt that by todays standards some of the current generation might find stuff from the 70's and 80's "silly". To be honest anytime I've heard amplified singing/narration in a show the word "silly" doesn't even do justice to the feeling I get. Does it matter what I think? Only to me and that's why I've chosen to basically "abandon" DCI after 28 years. Please don't confuse my decision as a form of disrespect to the current generation of performers, If today's DCI floats your boat more power to you, I just will never understand why they felt the need to make just drastic changes. Evolution? No, that's what you saw from the beginning of the activity up until 2004. Now it's a whole new ballgame.

Well said!

Couldn't the same be said about EVERY Drum Corps performance ever put out there? As far as I know there has never been a score of 100.

I will, thanks!!

Yeah, and I'm taking the $500 a year spent on DCI shows and merchandise to DCA, laughing all the way ('cause "we" are a joke, right?).

Call it what you want "dude", hard to hijack a thread that didn't have much of a point to it to begin with.

And what point is that exactly? That there are people out there who like or at the very least "don't mind" amplification and singing/narration in todays DCI? Ok, I get it , but why does that crowd find it necessary to point out that those who don't like or agree with the recent changes in DCI are in some way "nerdy" or "have no life"? If you're a fan of what DCI is currently doing great, more power to you and you should be happy, but is it SO hard to understand that for alot of folks who have been following this activity for some time there is a feeling that alot of the things that made us Drum Corps fans (as opposed to marching bands) in the first place are going by the wayside in the present world of DCI? You want to be the worlds best summer marching bands? Go for it, just be careful what you wish for, you're actually getting it sooner than you may think.

Good Lord, are you TRYING to just stir up trouble?!

I edited because while I couldn't agree more with you I guess I just finally realized that they have not and will not ever realize this so complaining is an exercise in futility. It's official, I'm done with DCI and seeing as I already own the legacy DVD/CD's they'll never get another dime of mine (yes, I know no one gives a hoot), see ya at a DCA show near you.

As do I, although I tend to not hold out much hope in light of recent history.

Just a quick question for you before this gets closed per your request, how exactly did you come up with adding saxophones as your "point in time" in which you decide that Drum Corps IS marching band? While you're thinking about that, let me also ask why it's so hard for you to understand that for many people that point has already been reached. And when saxes are added, how well will you respond to someone telling you to "get over yourself and enjoy the show"? Just wondering.

But why not? It seems to me that if the vote was 10 to 10 this year, isn't it just a matter of time before it passes, most likely next year? If there is the negative reaction that you think there will be (and so do I btw), maybe, just maybe DCI, and more importantly the directors AND instructors will think twice about opening the "pandora's box" of electronics. If nothing else they could use the reaction as a dry-run of sorts to gauge the impact it will most likely have once it passes. This of course goes under the assumption that they in fact WANT to know how passing such a proposal would affect their fan base, but sadly I think that might be the last thing they consider when making such decisions. With all due respect to Mr Sylvester, reading his posts make it pretty clear to me that most in the position of having a say in rule changes would be thrilled with an elephant passing gas into a synthesizer, providing it allowed them to indulge their artistic vision.

Hey G, haven't talked to Dave in some time myself, need to give him a call and yes, I have the 81 and 82 recordings, not bad if I do say so myself! :P

Not trying to brag or anything, but I actually have copies of a bunch of Kobald's reel-to-reel recordings and I can tell you they are absolutely out of this world, to this day my favorite recordings. I was lucky enough to march with a guy who was a nut for electronics who happened to know Mr Kobald and in turn I was able to get alot of that stuff. You haven't lived until you've heard his reel-to-reel of 75 Muchachos!!! (or 77 Bridgemen for that matter!) The best thing DCI could ever do is make those recordings available (pretty sure they have them) to the general public. THATS a petition we should be getting together!

I'm suprised no one has mentioned 81 yet (maybe I'm just too old!) - had to be the worst recording of a DCI finals, much worse than 95. If I'm not mistaken 81 was the last year Ken Kobald did the recording, switching to digital with Lawrence Rock and Jim Unrath in 82. Please don't think I'm bashing Kobald, he did more for Drum Corps than anyone could possibly realize, I just always wondered what in the world happened in 81. 80 wasn't that hot either but 78 and 79 were fantastic. I always chalked it up to it being the first year at Olympic Stadium, the acoustics in that monstrosity had to be an incredible challenge. 82 actually turned out to be one of my favorite recordings when they were able to use the echos to great effect, Crossmen's "Russian Christmas Music" being a beautiful example of that.

I agree, comparing baseball to Drum Corps isn't fair and besides it doesn't hold water. To even think that the game of baseball has "evolved" much like Drum Corps is kind of silly, at least baseball plays by the same rules as they pretty much always have. For baseball to catch up I have an idea, lets put a microphone on all the players this upcoming season so at least they can tell us what part of the field we should be watching. Not only that, think how much fun it will be to hear the right fielder heckle the batter (NOONAN!!!), or better yet break into an impromptu song while the ball is in play! Silly, right? I guess the comparison of Sports and an artistic activity just doesn't work, unless maybe you're the marketing director for DCI - "Summer Music Games" anyone? :P

That line was crossed for me the minute I heard someone speak/sing into a microphone. Say what you will about the changes in instrumentation, design and show concept over the years, the one thing that remained constant was the acoustic nature of Drum Corps. Once they took that away I was pretty much done with DCI and decided my money was better spent with DCA, a product quite frankly I enjoy more. Like I stated in another thread I recently moved to Allentown only about 5 miles from J Birney and I'm not even thinking about going to the show and that's something I never thought I'd say after 25 years of being a member/fan. I can just hope that those select few who seem intent on pushing their "vision" of "anything goes" truly know what they're getting themselves in for because at the current rate they'll get their wish sooner than you may think and the line between Drum Corps and marching band will no longer exist. Of course some will be thrilled with that prospect, but a truly unique idiom will be sacrificed along the way.

Aren't we comparing apples to oranges here?

All I know is that a few months ago I moved to Allentown, only about 5 miles from J Birney and after the direction I've seen DCI take the last few years I'm not even thinking about going to the show. After almost 30 years of following Drum Corps this is the first time I can ever say that I've felt this way. What did it for me? Narrartion, pure and simple. Believe me, I've heard all the arguments and when all this started I went in with an open mind. Truth be told I actually physically cringe when hearing narration, call me an old-timer or whatever but I prefer goosebumps while experiencing a drum corps show, not a feeling of cheezy embarassment. Now I'm not naive enough to think that anyone really cares if I'm in the stands at a show this summer or not and seeing as my marching experience was 20 years ago I realize that it's more about those marching today and if Drum Corps today is what floats your boat more power to you. Just please don't tell me how "short-sighted" I am or how I'm "missing out" because of my lack of interest in the current product in DCI. My money from now on is with DCA, until THEY start with narrartion - please God, no!!!

You know as I think about it the years I spent in Corps (from ages 14 to 18) taught me more about taking people for face value rather than relying on half-baked assumptions based on some "category" they may fit into. I certainly didn't lead a sheltered childhood, growing up in the suburbs of New York you get a good idea of what goes on in the world, the truth is marching was the one of the first places I can remember that it didn't mean one thing if you were gay. Now I would never pretend to speak to someone else's experiences, but the general sense was that those folks who were gay had found a venue where it just didn't matter. We were all there for the same reason, to feel that common bond with your peers being involved with something that you're not only good at but genuinely have a blast doing and that felling of group pride is something that no one forgets. The fact that someone happened to be gay wasn't a secret because it didn't have to be, truth be told nobody really cared one way or the other. Were there jokes made? Sure, but in the context of it went both ways (ok, THAT didn't sound right!), you get 100+ kids in that age range together and everybody is fair game, believe me! I gotta tell ya, if you've been involved with Drum Corps for any length of time and you're homophobic odds are you have alot more issues than just that going on!

Didn't think of the Crossmen, 1980 anyone? I know they tried to revive the Spanish theme in 85 but enough time has passed, I say they take another crack at it!

I just happened to come across a video of 88 Madison and it got me thinking, out of all the versions of "Malaquena" I've heard which is my favorite? My vote was 81 Madison, it didn't let up from beginning to end and always reminds me of why I love Drum Corps! I remember seeing that show in Clifton NJ early in the season and it absolutely blew me away. What even added to the atmosphere was the fact that 27th and Madison were both still undefeated, first meeting of the year for both. I'll never forget watching the Scouts hornline warm up by singing thier parts to Malaquena. I'm happy to say I have a tape of that show (oops, don't tell DCI!), hearing the generator in the background still brings back memories! Second place would have to go to 84/85 Hawthorne. I know this is a DCI forum, but for raw emotion you didn't get much better than the Cabs. I don't remember the name of that soprano soloist they had back then, but what chops! Ok, the second part to the 2 part question is who will be the next DCI Corps to have a go at Malaquena? My gut would say Madison, but after watching Garfiel---sorry, The Cadets take a stab at it in 03 it makes you wonder. I think that Phantom doing a more "classic" take rather than a variation of the Kenton version might be fantastic if done right. Any thoughts?

Just wondering if anyone knows if there is a particular reason why DCI doesn't offer the Collector's Series CD's anymore - the only thing I can figure is that they're trying to push the online downloads. When they came out I made the mistake of only buying Vol. 2 & 3 thinking that I would go back and get Vol. 1. Oops, I guess I waited too long! I'm not making that mistake again with the DVD's. To date I don't own 1 Drum Corps DVD, all my stuff is either video (including homemade tapes of the late 70's/early 80's), CD's and over 100 records (can't bring myself to throw any of them away!). Then I came across this offer and at 15 bucks a DVD there is no way I was going to miss out this time - Merry Christmas to me b**bs !!! Just for the record the first show I'm watching is '77 Bridgemen B)

I honestly can't thank you enough!!! You have no idea how nice it is to hear an actual, honest-to-goodness DRUM & BUGLE CORPS again b**bs b**bs b**bs