SUNCOAST RETURN!

[paradiddle]

To be completely honest....

Suncoast in a way is making a come back....in the form of another corps.

It has sound in the name......and has to do with a color.

Just look at some of the staff and management.

Blue/Green Noise? ...just kidding....

When you all start talking about how much CASH is needed to start a DCI corps it makes me think how out of whack DCI has become.

My opinion is you have to start small - didn't SC Sound start as a parade corps? It didn't take them long to become good once the right people were in place.

[SUNCOASTFAN]

Newseditor44 posted:

Not to be the total pessimist but I think there are much more serious questions that need to be asked outside a discussion forum. Before bringing a corps back, there are several things that have to be determined, and former staff and alumni should be considered and consulted as well. But most importantly, a corps shouldn't be brought back just because it seems like a good idea. If you want to succeed, there are hast to be a higher purpose involved, and a willingness to disassociate yourself and ideals from that which once was. In essence, you would be creating a brand new drum corps based on the Suncoast Sound, not actually reviving the corps. So rather than asking the questions you've asked, you need to be ready to answer the following:

1. Why and for whom would it be beneficial to start a new corps in the Tampa area?

2. Would there be enough support from educators in the area?

3. What are the means of income and fund raising

4. How does the community benefit, what can we give back to the community?

5. What's the motivation?

6. Is there interest from the community?

7. Why?

SUNCOASTFAN responded with:

Best post yet!

Answers:

1) Students in the area and corporate exposure

2) If you look at some of the current educators in the area a lot are Suncoast Alumni, we would hope so.

3) Start-up cost (est 250k) would be available and then 100k for an additional 4 years. Fundraising, perfomornace fees and other sponsors would be the responsibility of the operational management. Adhere to the budget given.

4) Local support in the community with high profile performances during the year.

5) Personal fan of the activity and Director of Marketing for firm. No other motive other then to give back much in the same as we give to the United Way and Boys and Gilrs Club of Tampa.

6) Not sure, probably not at this point.

7) Why not?

My response:

1. Corporate exposure? Haven't we learned that relying on corporations isn't a good thing? Heck, that was one of the things that killed Suncoast the first go around...Circle K pulling its support in the 80s. Drum corps doesn't give corporations the kind of support they need or desire, and if a corps is "lucky" enough to land themselves a corporate sponsor, once the corporation realizes they aren't getting enough in return, they bail. How can a resurging Suncoast be assured that corporate dollars will be available for 4-5 years as you elude in item #3? What happens to the corps after year 4? How will the corps make up the $100k loss?

2. Really? Are there really THAT many Suncoast alumni in the area that are music educators? I find that hard to believe. Heck, Spirit had a much longer life in Atlanta than Suncoast did on the Florida coast and we've got maybe a half dozen alumni in the area that are band directors. Shoot, even some of the Spirit alumni are not supportive of their kids marching in corps...even those that had good experiences in the corps.

3. Start up costs...$250K? Have you brokenn that down? I'd like to see the breakdown. Newseditor's question was what was the means of income, to which there was no answer. Having start up costs covered or partially covered isn't the question...where will the daily operational budget come from? Is there a plan? You can't start a corps simply because you have the start up covered...there has to be a plan for longevity. You can't simply pass the buck to the operational management; they have to be IN PLACE with a working plan.

4. What kind of high profile performances do you have in mind? And don't forget...most any drum corps can only provide a quality public performance from May (?) through August. What about the other 8 months of the year?

5. Giving to the Boys and Girls Clubs or United Way has a much greater meaning to the public than if you gave to a drum corps. If a corporation gave to Suncoast, would that give the corporation the "goodwill" it might expect as a result? I don't think so. If it did, we'd see more corporations clammoring to sponsor a drum corps possibly. But instead, we've seen sponsorships that have been very short lived. Why? Because they didn't work for the sponsor, or at least they didn't get what they desired.

The other problem I see in ressurecting a once great corps, is that now that a newly formed corps has to enter DCI at the lowest level and work its way up, anyone joining the new Suncoast might have certain expectations based on the corps' history. I know that if I knew that if the corps snagged most of its former legendary staffers to come back to build the corps again, expectations would be high. You might expect very talented players to come to the corps. But, if those highly talented players had to wait a minimum of 3 years before they had a chance to play in DCI World Class and possibly a chance in semis or finals, would they be that patient? Would they come and stick with a corps for such a duration, in the name of bringing that corps back? And of course, keep in mind that kids that would be eligible to march in a corps today was at most 1-2 years old when Suncoast last made it into finals, so there might not be much sentiment among today's youngsters to stick it out in hopes of bringing back a once great drum corps...a corps that they never saw live.

Some great stuff here, thank you!

Here's our take at this point to some of your points that are well taken:

1) Our corporation is fine with long-term support. The Suncoast Circle K deal was not the doing of Circle K. This was a Suncoast management issue that sent Circle K packing after only one year of a three year commitment of 1 million dollars.

2) More Suncoast staff in Florida then you could imagine. People like Mr. Williams, Mr. Robinson and Mr. Ford to name a few are local, this is not to say they would even have an interest.

3)Our corporation is fine with long-term support and are willing to place funding in place and out of our hands and into a separte non-profit corporation to be dispersed annually under a guided Board of Directors. As far as the start-up cost is concerned this amount is after all equipment has been purchased so the actual figure is much higher.

4) Well aware of the "season" of the activity. Yes, we would have some local high profile functions.

5) I absolutely agree. We are very proud to have supported these fine organizations for the past 10 years and will continue to do so. Supporting the drum corps activity is just another avenue of support for a different venue. It would be expected that our support would build life lessons with each member of any group we support.

Please realize we are NOT trying to defend what our intentions or objectives may be. I thank you for your questions and concerns with attempting such a project. I cannot speak for how your alumni have or have not supported your groups return or changes over the years. It would seem however that you are on solid ground and have a wonderful organization that you are proud of and should be. We can only hope for continued input on the web but have started to contact certain people of interest to advise us.

Look forward to continued dialog.

[ssorrell]

1) Our corporation is fine with long-term support. The Suncoast Circle K deal was not the doing of Circle K. This was a Suncoast management issue that sent Circle K packing after only one year of a three year commitment of 1 million dollars.

So, yes...it was Circle K that pulled out. It doesn't matter that Suncoast management brought it on, the fact is, they are the one that bailed.

That's the problem in relying on corporate dollars...at any time, the "commitment" can be broken.

Of course we don't know what corporation we are speaking of here, but in today's economy, nearly every business in every sector has had bad times. What wouild happen if this corporation suddenly has a bad quarter and cuts have to be made? What would be one of the first things to get cut? I would guess a quarter to a half million dollar sponsorship of a drum corps. Can any corporation GUARANTEE a long term commitment? Iron clad? I don't see how.

And if Suncoast management made Circle K go bye bye, why would this go around be any different? There are a very rare few drum corps throughout history that could claim to having a solid business management team. Most every corps is operated on a shoe string by a staff of volunteers, or in the very least, management that is paid very little. If we expect a drum corps to operate to the liking of a huge regional or national corporation, we might as well be looking for a needle in a haystack. That is, unless the corporation is going to pay a nice salary for a professional management team that will operate the corps daily. Otherwise, you could see the same issues arise that happened previously.

4

) Well aware of the "season" of the activity. Yes, we would have some local high profile functions.

What kind of "high profile" functions are we talking about here?

For years, Spirit played in local parks, every major local parade in Atlanta, we played for corporate CEOs at private banquets, events at the Braves stadium...to name only a few. And it seemed as though we never were any better known in town than if we hadn't done those performances at all. All people see is a band playing...your average citizen doesn't care if it is a nationally known drum corps or not. So these high profile functions...I don't know if they would actually serve a purpose, as the expected or intended result may not happen.

Please realize we are NOT trying to defend what our intentions or objectives may be.

But if you expect the drum corps alumni and masses to accept your extended arm of support, you might very well have to explain your objectives. I'm sure DCI would be interested in that as well. Otherwise, how can anyone be assured that this relationship is secure? I see that you state that you would at least partially support a drum corps because it would "build life lessons with each member of any group we support", if that is not indeed your only motivation. That's very noble and I don't mean to question it and I certainly mean no disrespect, but I don't see a large corporation dolling out hundreds of thousands of dollars, year after year, for that reason alone. Giving to United Way or Boys and Girls Clubs is very noble and is nationally known to be worthy organizations. Drum corps in general doesn't have such a reputation. And in starting up a drum corps from scratch, there is no history. Will the BOD of such a corporation share your enthusiasm? Will they see the "life lessons learned" in each member, or will they see a group of young musicians simply having a good time? Giving to United Way or Boys Clubs helps under priviledged children and promotes their support to give them better lives. If BOD looks closely at drum corps...what will they find? IMO, that's exactly why we don't see corporations sponsoring drum corps today...corporations just don't see the need to foot the bill so that a bunch of mostly white middle class teenagers can tour the country playing music. We certainly found that to be the case in the 80s in looking over corporate Atlanta trying to find a sponsor for the financially ailing Spirit. I applaud you if you see more than what those corporations saw, but again, will your BOD agree?

I thank you for your questions and concerns with attempting such a project. I cannot speak for how your alumni have or have not supported your groups return or changes over the years. It would seem however that you are on solid ground and have a wonderful organization that you are proud of and should be. We can only hope for continued input on the web but have started to contact certain people of interest to advise us.

Spirit alumni came out in droves to help when the corps was about to break down in 2000. We had a little over 20 years of alumni to draw from and what we gained from their support was important in our ability to continue tour, but was a miniscule amount in the budget. As Spirit survived and pressed on for more years, many if not most of those supportive alumni crawled back under their rocks and haven't been heard from again. Many felt as though the corps abandoned its roots with its updated image and more contemporary show design, and as a result, they stopped supporting the corps. I have no reason to believe it would be any different for a Suncoast resurrection. If it is not what THEY can appreciate, they might not care for it nor support it. Of course, this is based solely on my experiences with one corps...your mileage may vary. :>)

I'm with a few others...I think it would be easier, with less hurdles to overcome, if you started a new corps from scratch.

Edited February 22, 2008 by ssorrell

[ssorrell]

Perhaps we need to simply remember Suncoast Sound as the great drum corps that it was and leave it be. There would be an enormous amount of pressure in living up to the name if you try to bring it back from the dead. If there is a need for more drum corps activity in that area, nothing is in the way of starting up a new corps!

I've said more than my share now...I'll quiet down and let others give their thoughts. I don't want to seem like I'm trying to dominate the responses.

With that said...I'm outta here!

Edited February 22, 2008 by ssorrell

[NSBNole]

Blue/Green Noise? ...just kidding....

That would be The Turquoise Noise.....

Thank you very much.

[Russellrks]

I think we all can agree it would be a great thing to see Suncoast rise from the ashes of it's past.

The reality is that money or no money, it will take years of very committted hard work to make this happen. Having the support of a corporation to get the equipment necessary for start up is a big help. Whoever is in charge of spending this seed money needs to have the penny pinching skills of my mother. Buy used equipment at the best possible prices. Get the Air Force Academy to donate the uniforms of their next graduating class if you can. (That's how the corps got the only uniform that they ever had the first time around. Hopefully, they are made of a lighter more breatheable fabric nowadays.)

Staff, with the exception of key personnel will probably have to be mostly volunteer or paid very little in the early years. There is an unbelievable number of alumni who have become band directors in the area and committed coordinated help from this base would be crucial IMO.

Can it be done? Sure. Will it be hard? you betcha. With the exception of the amount of money needed, the road to building a successful drum corps hasn't changed over the years. The money is a reality that cannot be ignored but just as important, even moreso than the money is the dedication, and determination of the people who decide to get involved and make this a reality.

Edited February 22, 2008 by Russellrks

[SUNCOASTFAN]

So, yes...it was Circle K that pulled out. It doesn't matter that Suncoast management brought it on, the fact is, they are the one that bailed.

That's the problem in relying on corporate dollars...at any time, the "commitment" can be broken.

Of course we don't know what corporation we are speaking of here, but in today's economy, nearly every business in every sector has had bad times. What wouild happen if this corporation suddenly has a bad quarter and cuts have to be made? What would be one of the first things to get cut? I would guess a quarter to a half million dollar sponsorship of a drum corps. Can any corporation GUARANTEE a long term commitment? Iron clad? I don't see how.

And if Suncoast management made Circle K go bye bye, why would this go around be any different? There are a very rare few drum corps throughout history that could claim to having a solid business management team. Most every corps is operated on a shoe string by a staff of volunteers, or in the very least, management that is paid very little. If we expect a drum corps to operate to the liking of a huge regional or national corporation, we might as well be looking for a needle in a haystack. That is, unless the corporation is going to pay a nice salary for a professional management team that will operate the corps daily. Otherwise, you could see the same issues arise that happened previously.

4

What kind of "high profile" functions are we talking about here?

For years, Spirit played in local parks, every major local parade in Atlanta, we played for corporate CEOs at private banquets, events at the Braves stadium...to name only a few. And it seemed as though we never were any better known in town than if we hadn't done those performances at all. All people see is a band playing...your average citizen doesn't care if it is a nationally known drum corps or not. So these high profile functions...I don't know if they would actually serve a purpose, as the expected or intended result may not happen.

But if you expect the drum corps alumni and masses to accept your extended arm of support, you might very well have to explain your objectives. I'm sure DCI would be interested in that as well. Otherwise, how can anyone be assured that this relationship is secure? I see that you state that you would at least partially support a drum corps because it would "build life lessons with each member of any group we support", if that is not indeed your only motivation. That's very noble and I don't mean to question it and I certainly mean no disrespect, but I don't see a large corporation dolling out hundreds of thousands of dollars, year after year, for that reason alone. Giving to United Way or Boys and Girls Clubs is very noble and is nationally known to be worthy organizations. Drum corps in general doesn't have such a reputation. And in starting up a drum corps from scratch, there is no history. Will the BOD of such a corporation share your enthusiasm? Will they see the "life lessons learned" in each member, or will they see a group of young musicians simply having a good time? Giving to United Way or Boys Clubs helps under priviledged children and promotes their support to give them better lives. If BOD looks closely at drum corps...what will they find? IMO, that's exactly why we don't see corporations sponsoring drum corps today...corporations just don't see the need to foot the bill so that a bunch of mostly white middle class teenagers can tour the country playing music. We certainly found that to be the case in the 80s in looking over corporate Atlanta trying to find a sponsor for the financially ailing Spirit. I applaud you if you see more than what those corporations saw, but again, will your BOD agree?

Spirit alumni came out in droves to help when the corps was about to break down in 2000. We had a little over 20 years of alumni to draw from and what we gained from their support was important in our ability to continue tour, but was a miniscule amount in the budget. As Spirit survived and pressed on for more years, many if not most of those supportive alumni crawled back under their rocks and haven't been heard from again. Many felt as though the corps abandoned its roots with its updated image and more contemporary show design, and as a result, they stopped supporting the corps. I have no reason to believe it would be any different for a Suncoast resurrection. If it is not what THEY can appreciate, they might not care for it nor support it. Of course, this is based solely on my experiences with one corps...your mileage may vary. :>)

I'm with a few others...I think it would be easier, with less hurdles to overcome, if you started a new corps from scratch.

Wow, fantastic input!

As we read your comments, opinons and views on how things have worked for your situation and based on your experience and drum corps knowledge we appreciate everything you have mentioned. I am also not at total liberty to discuss detailed information with regard to who we are at this point for obvious reasons but I can say our CEO is very much like Mr. Cook with being philanthropic but at a larger scale.

Starting a drum corps from the ground up is always an option but the model that was in place, level of staff and programming for Suncoast Sound during the 80's is a standard we are looking to support longterm.

You are also correct in saying the alumni associations are good for a certain purpose but cannot dictate the daily goals and or objective of the day to day operation for any organization and should be made aware of this from the beginning. Our CEO is on many Board's that are supported by volunteers and or alumni and their support has tremendous value but at no time do they dictate how, why, where and when. Committee's alumni and volunteers work for organizations but cannot run them.

Again, thank you for your comments.

[randyb]

Perhaps we need to simply remember Suncoast Sound as the great drum corps that it was and leave it be. There would be an enormous amount of pressure in living up to the name if you try to bring it back from the dead. If there is a need for more drum corps activity in that area, nothing is in the way of starting up a new corps!

I've said more than my share now...I'll quiet down and let others give their thoughts. I don't want to seem like I'm trying to dominate the responses.

With that said...I'm outta here!

Let me take my Teal director's hat off for a moment and throw a few things out.

Having twice been a part of the Suncoast org., once as a staff member and the next as its director in 1994, I can only say this, Suncoast was an excellent corps in the past that all of us who ever had a part of being associated with it, will remember and love. There has been talk like this in the past of ressurecting the Suncoast name and bringing it back to the field again, but I would agree with Mr. Sorrell, it was a great drum corps and that we need to just remember it for that sole purpose and what it gave to the activity. I have read many posts on here about how and why it should be brought back and can honestly say all of them are admirable. However, the question I ask is this, is it just for the reason of having the name back or is it for the fact that starting another corps in Florida just seems to be the thing to do these days. By no means am I suggesting that the state can not support another drum corps with membership, but it is more than just membership that supports a drum corps. You may have all the dollars in the world to have a corps, but if you do not have the volunteer support, sustained financial support and the efforts behind the scenes to help run an organization of this magnitude, it won't survive.

To those that don't know the history of the corps, please read up on it at www.suncoastsound.org first before making statements like "it was just started as a parade corps". Bob Cotter, Sr. would not be very appreciative of that statement if he were alive today.

To all those that marched, taught or were involved with the Suncoast Sound, you made your mark in the history of DCI and for that moment in time you shall always be remembered. Let the NAME Suncoast Sound be remembered for what it was to those who were a part of this great corps throughout the years, "The Greatest Love of All".

[Russellrks]

Randy, after reading your post, I agree with you (and Steve) 100%.

It probably would be for the best that any new corps starting out in Fla. forge their own identity and let the name Suncoast Sound remain where it is now, a pleasant and respected memory.

Edited February 22, 2008 by Russellrks

[EndzoneEric]

Randy, after reading your post, I agree with you 100%.

It probably would be for the best that any new corps starting out in Fla. forge their own identity and let the name Suncoast Sound remain where it is now, a pleasant and respected memory.

It would probably also make Teal Sound's life alot easier NOT having to compete with another corps for members and community support and recognition, for that matter.

Mr. Blackburn is right... it's more than members that make a drum corps these days.