Questions on Flag spinning ...

[yashiharu]

Q1.

the above screenshot is captured from the WGI fundamrntal DVD

the instructor emphasizes the UP & DOWN Motion shown in the screen shot ...

I found that:

1. Right hand is comfort as it almost didn't move up & down (like an origin ...)

2. Left hand is killing me, as it moves too much, very easy to get tired ...

3. very different if adding lower body movement at the same time

I just want to know if this is correct?

why don't we keep both hands up & down within the same small range?

million thx

I'm too new to CG ...

Edited November 1, 2008 by yashiharu

[yashiharu]

seems no one understand my word ...

[Stick Stack]

I THINK I understand your question!

The instructor is probably emphasizing the up and down motion of the flag.

Can't tell exactly what spin they're doing but in general, you want to stay in the spin spot with both of your hands. I think that's the origin you are talking about.

The reason why her hands are moving up and down is because she is seperating her hands. She might be doing that to get further down the pole so she can spin out of the silk.

In general, though, I would recommend grabbing with as little space between your hands as possible.

[N Murphy]

Everyone's technique varies, and the only correct technique is the one that your entire group is using consistently. With this being said, our group uses the 'tab' or the 'connection' as the point of origin for a spin.

This tab and/or connection (it is the same point, just two different words we use interchangably) is the halfway point in the pole, and also happens to be where the flag connects to the pole at that midpoint. Thus the tab of the flag, or the connection of the flag to the pole.

We spin with one hand on one side of that tab, and one hand on the other side. (this would mean that one hand is in the silk, and one on the bare pole). However, we only allow about one inch between the hands. Our hands are very close, and we also make sure that the tab does not bob up and down. We use their belly button as a refrence point. Their hands must stay at belly button level. (now, our shorter members must make adjustments if the flag has a tendency to hit the groud or be too low)

If you were to look at our older spinners (more experience), their tab stays stationery. It does not move up and down when the spin is happening. If a tab is bobbing up and down, it may mean that the spinner is not grabbing the pole with their hands and transferring it from hand to hand, but they may be "popping" it up to the receiving hand thus letting go and not having a smooth transfer of equipment. most of the time that spinner is using a loose grip and not using their thumbs to control the movement.

A bobbing tab could also mean that they are bending their arms and straightening them too much, thus pushing down when silk is down, and bending arms up when silk is up (bringing hands to chest level).

Most spinning should occur from the wrists, not from the arms. There should be very little elbow movement.

Hope this helps!

[Jak]

I'm not sure I understand the original question, but I thought would throw this out there. I know that most groups spin at their belly button, but we actually spin in front of the chest. Our spin spot is our sternum, and we push the spin way out away from the body. This is better at building strength, because it's hard to maintain that level for long spin blocks. But more importantly, I like the way they look. Their elbows are very lifted and away from the torso, which helps the elbows to stay completely motionless. They also take up more space and look more in control by spinning away from the body. In addition, it helps them to be much more lifted in their upper bodies and to hold the length in their spine and their necks that I look for. One thing you have to watch is that they don't pull their shoulders up around their ears.

After years of experimenting, this is the only way I could ever get them to look good on Over spins. And it keeps them from looking schlumpy on all their spins.

[fitzamous rex]

thats a very interesting way of doing drop spins but would it work for speed spins/peggy spins? would the technique differ because the flag isnt going at straight up and down vertical "angles" and instead going down vertically, to an angle, to up vertically and to an angle again? if that even makes sense to you. i agree with one of the previous posts, the instructor most likely did it in order to emphasie what you should do but it is not necessary to do them so drastically. it would help to just make the interval between you hands smaller but to to exactly as he/she does. sorry f this was just a repetition of the other responses

[byline]

In general, though, I would recommend grabbing with as little space between your hands as possible.

Yes! Also, spin with relaxed elbows. My "rule" was to spin with hands down below the belly button, with the flag tip only about an inch off the ground.

The technique may be exaggerated a bit on the video so that the up/down check positions for the flag are emphasized, but I always found drop spins quite easy (and much easier to perform and clean than push spins; I won't go into that technique, as I think it would just confuse things).

Basically all you're doing is rotating the flag with your right hand, dropping it into your left so that both palms are facing front. Then you hold on with your left hand and continue the flag rotation up into your right hand, with the right palm facing more toward your left (rather than palm front). And remember to keep the elbows relaxed. I think that's what people find tiring is that they hold their elbows up, and then the flag keeps going higher and higher because the person is afraid of hitting the ground. Don't worry; hardly ever happens! So relax the elbows, and remember to keep the flag tip only an inch off the ground.

Also, the free hand always grabs underneath (beginners often want to grab with the free hand on top of the rotating hand). So the catch checkpoint for easy/drop spins goes like this (or, at least, this is how I taught it):

Count 1: Drop the flag into your left hand, grabbing it under your right hand, palms facing front; on count 1, the flag end of the pole is down.

Count 2: Hold on with your left hand, rotate the flag up into your right hand, again grabbing it underneath your left hand, right palm facing left; on count 2, the flag end of the pole is up.

Count 3: Same as count 1 (remember to keep the elbows relaxed, flag tip only about an inch off the ground).

Count 4: Same as count 2 (remember about those elbows).

Etc., etc., etc.

With beginners, I started out with exaggerated stops on each checkpoint, just to make sure they got the concept of where their hands were supposed to be, and where the flag was supposed to be. Then, gradually, I sped it up to smooth it out, with no actual stops in the up and down positions. But often, as beginners sped up, their elbows went up, and that's when they started to get tired. I had to constantly remind them to relax their elbows, especially as the flag is coming back up on the even counts (2, 4, 6, 8, etc.).

I hope this isn't too confusing (especially if English is your second language). And someone feel free to correct me if I'm remembering this all wrong. Man, it's a lot harder to write about technique than it is to verbalize/show it!

And this doesn't even get into the technique for normal/double-fast spins; oh, that's gonna be fun to explain! (Are those the same as Peggy spins?)

Edited November 7, 2008 by byline

[byline]

I'm not sure I understand the original question, but I thought would throw this out there. I know that most groups spin at their belly button, but we actually spin in front of the chest. Our spin spot is our sternum, and we push the spin way out away from the body. This is better at building strength, because it's hard to maintain that level for long spin blocks. But more importantly, I like the way they look. Their elbows are very lifted and away from the torso, which helps the elbows to stay completely motionless. They also take up more space and look more in control by spinning away from the body. In addition, it helps them to be much more lifted in their upper bodies and to hold the length in their spine and their necks that I look for. One thing you have to watch is that they don't pull their shoulders up around their ears.

See, this is the opposite of what I taught. I preferred a more relaxed look in the body, which is why I had the girls spin at or slightly below their belly buttons (it differed from one individual to the next depending on each girl's height, arm length, etc.). I was looking for a uniform look from the stands, which meant fine-tuning with each individual to achieve that look. Elbows relaxed was the only way I could ever get the timing the way I wanted it (my girls tended to look a bit "frantic" with their elbows up all the time), and it also conserved energy for other elements.

But, as others have noted, whatever works for your guard is what works. So what worked for me may not work for others. That's why a bit of experimentation is good, to see which technique best suits your guard.

Edited November 7, 2008 by byline

[N Murphy]

How do you all correct rotating of the pole causing the silk to roll up?

I utilize the thumbs. Thumb nails should always face the chest. I have them press their thumbs up the pole, kindof like how you hold a golf club, and force them to watch their thumbs so they don't turn them right or left. Then, after the muscle memory kicks in, they dont' have to think about their thumb facings.

Pressing into the pole for flag also helps when training on rifle, as we teach them to press their thumbs down the gun when spinning.

[ATXguard]

How do you all correct rotating of the pole causing the silk to roll up?

I utilize the thumbs. Thumb nails should always face the chest. I have them press their thumbs up the pole, kindof like how you hold a golf club, and force them to watch their thumbs so they don't turn them right or left. Then, after the muscle memory kicks in, they dont' have to think about their thumb facings.

Pressing into the pole for flag also helps when training on rifle, as we teach them to press their thumbs down the gun when spinning.

pour a glass of milk into a bowl....

always look at your watch...

Never extend the thumb, it should always be wrapped around the pole to give you more control over the equipment.

How do you turn a doorknob?