Belleville Black Knights

[Dave Scott]

Bellville Black Knights:

A very strong Mid West junior corps in the late 1950s and early 1960s. Perenial finalist at VFW Nationals finishing as high as "fifth" in 1961.

Managed to defeat, at one time or another in that era all of the national contenders. Onr of the first drum corps to perform an "Original" piece of music, their "Concert piece", "Sherwood Forest", which was named after their director the late Mr Forest Cresson.

They are greatly missed.

Elphaba

WWW

I was always under the impression that "Sherwood Forest" was an original composition and so stated in the article I wrote for the book "A Drum Corps History" published by Steve Vickers. Turns out the song was written by big band leader Bobby Sherwood and was called "Sherwood's Forest". A recording can be found on the cd "Malcolm Laycock presents Bobby Sherwood The Issued Recordings 1942-1947".

[BariBrian]

Without a doubt, the coolest most "Bad-A##" uniform to ever take the field!

Absolutly the coolest looking corp to ever take the field,, and what a BIG sound

[onceuponatime]

There is no way to describe the impact the Black Knights' uniforms had on a person viewing them for the first time. The beauty of the uniforms would literally take your breath away. I was a 14 year old Cadet standing on the inspection line in Central Park, New York City, 1952 (I assume it was Legion Nationals), and they were lined up facing us, waiting their turn behind the Madison Scouts. Not only was I a 14 year old, particularly naive Cadet, but I believed that God himself had designed the Cadets' uniform (I still do). It was, therefore, a real shock for me to see another uniform obviously designed by someone with divine connections. All they had to do was stand there, and I was hooked. They had turned me into a lifelong fan, and I had yet to hear or see them perform.

Over the years I did have the pleasure of watching many of their performances, as well as their intense in-state rivalry with the Cavaliers; and it was one of the great joys of my life that I was there while it was happening. The Cadets and the Black Knights (not to leave out our good friends the Cavaliers) developed a solid friendship as we often traveled to their home show, and on at least one occasion they traveled back east to our home show in Garfield. It's hard not to develop a deep personal regard for members of other corps with whom you have shared not only the field of competition, but a high level of personal, and often individual, respect and regard.

Mr. Forest Cresson was a true gentlemen of the old school, in the Bill Kemmerer (Director of the Cadets) mold. I seem to recall that at some point in their history they were sponsored by the Order of DeMolay, a youth affiliate of the Masons. I do remember that when we traveled to one of their contests Mr. Cresson not only housed the Cadets in the Masonic Lodge there (a real unusual experience for a Catholic Church sponsored corps), but also provided us with guides drawn from the ranks of the Black Knights. We were always treated with the utmost respect and courtesy and friendship, which was returned in full measure by the marching members of the Cadets to the marching members of the Black Knights.

Obviously, I still hold them in very high regard. Several years ago they auctioned off an older set of their helmets as a fund-raiser. I purchased one and it still occupies a place of honor in my home.

I do not remember what music they played or their field programs (not because it wasn't memorable, but mainly because it was too many years ago). Rest assured though, they were good, #### good. That much I do remember. I'm glad someone opened this thread, and rekindled my memories of a corps I always admired and respected. If you never had the opportunity to see the Black Knights standing in a line, looking like ten million dollars, you missed the thrill of a lifetime.

I'd just like to add one other memory to this already far-too-long post. In 1952 Madison was still wearing the official

explorer boy scout uniforms. Since they were lined up directly in front of the Black knights I was struck by the simplicity of the Scout's uniforms against the ornate and strikingly beautiful Black Knight's uniforms. To this day I remember that the Scouts did not suffer in any way by their juxtaposition to the Black Knights. Each uniform held its own, and in its' own way left a lifelong impression on a 14 year old Cadet, a memory that has endured for 58 years.

[Dave Scott]

There is no way to describe the impact the Black Knights' uniforms had on a person viewing them for the first time. The beauty of the uniforms would literally take your breath away. I was a 14 year old Cadet standing on the inspection line in Central Park, New York City, 1952 (I assume it was Legion Nationals), and they were lined up facing us, waiting their turn behind the Madison Scouts. Not only was I a 14 year old, particularly naive Cadet, but I believed that God himself had designed the Cadets' uniform (I still do). It was, therefore, a real shock for me to see another uniform obviously designed by someone with divine connections. All they had to do was stand there, and I was hooked. They had turned me into a lifelong fan, and I had yet to hear or see them perform.

Over the years I did have the pleasure of watching many of their performances, as well as their intense in-state rivalry with the Cavaliers; and it was one of the great joys of my life that I was there while it was happening. The Cadets and the Black Knights (not to leave out our good friends the Cavaliers) developed a solid friendship as we often traveled to their home show, and on at least one occasion they traveled back east to our home show in Garfield. It's hard not to develop a deep personal regard for members of other corps with whom you have shared not only the field of competition, but a high level of personal, and often individual, respect and regard.

Mr. Forest Cresson was a true gentlemen of the old school, in the Bill Kemmerer (Director of the Cadets) mold. I seem to recall that at some point in their history they were sponsored by the Order of DeMolay, a youth affiliate of the Masons. I do remember that when we traveled to one of their contests Mr. Cresson not only housed the Cadets in the Masonic Lodge there (a real unusual experience for a Catholic Church sponsored corps), but also provided us with guides drawn from the ranks of the Black Knights. We were always treated with the utmost respect and courtesy and friendship, which was returned in full measure by the marching members of the Cadets to the marching members of the Black Knights.

Obviously, I still hold them in very high regard. Several years ago they auctioned off an older set of their helmets as a fund-raiser. I purchased one and it still occupies a place of honor in my home.

I do not remember what music they played or their field programs (not because it wasn't memorable, but mainly because it was too many years ago). Rest assured though, they were good, #### good. That much I do remember. I'm glad someone opened this thread, and rekindled my memories of a corps I always admired and respected. If you never had the opportunity to see the Black Knights standing in a line, looking like ten million dollars, you missed the thrill of a lifetime.

I'd just like to add one other memory to this already far-too-long post. In 1952 Madison was still wearing the official

explorer boy scout uniforms. Since they were lined up directly in front of the Black knights I was struck by the simplicity of the Scout's uniforms against the ornate and strikingly beautiful Black Knight's uniforms. To this day I remember that the Scouts did not suffer in any way by their juxtaposition to the Black Knights. Each uniform held its own, and in its' own way left a lifelong impression on a 14 year old Cadet, a memory that has endured for 58 years.

Wonderful story Dave! Thanks so much for sharing it with us. You are just a bit off on the year however as Forrest Creson started the corps in the fall of 1953 and their first year of competition was 1954. In those first couple years the Knights were AmVets National Champions but did not attend VFW or AL Nationals until 1956. Their highest placement at American Legion Nationals was 4th in 1958 and 2nd at VFW Nationals in 1959. Like you I was also very impressed with their uniform the first time I saw them at the Springfield, IL State Fair contest in 1960 and was proud to wear the black & white in 1966.

[jack4681]

Way, way back I used to listen to the Black Knights at the 1961 VFW held in Miami on the old Fleetwood VFW volume II. I had a buddy who had participated marching with the Cambridge Caballeros who finished 4th that night. I can remember him telling me how great Bellville was that night and how they came from nowhere to beat St. Kevin’s and the upcoming Royal Airs. From their routine that year I can remember they had a tremendous soprano soloist playing solo in the out of concert march “on the square” and a pre-exit production number of “it had to be you”. It’s hard to believe that whoever he was and if he was 21 that humid night in August he would be 69 years young now.

[Jim Anello]

I seem to recall that at some point in their history they were sponsored by the Order of DeMolay, a youth affiliate of the Masons.

I also recall there was a connection with DeMolay which existed even when Belleville qualified for DCI membership in 1973. I vaguely recall that this caused a bit of a stir given DCI's by-laws. Can anyone elaborate?

[Scerpella]

Correct me if Im wrong. Pre 1973 the Belleville uniform was a traditional cadet uniform with shako. It wasnt until 73 I think that they added the very distinctive helmets.

[HornsUp]

Pre 1973 the Belleville uniform was a traditional cadet uniform with shako.

And prior to 1963, they wore black satins with a white left sleeve to accentuate their distinctive armswing.

[ajlisko]

And prior to 1963, they wore black satins with a white left sleeve to accentuate their distinctive armswing.

1960 pic (from Corpsres.com)

[Dave Scott]

I also recall there was a connection with DeMolay which existed even when Belleville qualified for DCI membership in 1973. I vaguely recall that this caused a bit of a stir given DCI's by-laws. Can anyone elaborate?

From 1954 until the end of the 1971 season all members of the Belleville Black Knights had to join the Belleville Tancred Chapter Order of DeMolay. In 1972 the corps switched from being an all male corps to accepting girls in their mixed guard and the DeMolay membership was no longer required.