drumkid

First let me say I'll take 83 Bridgeman over 2008 Cadets. Second, let me apologize if it seemed like a dis. Allow me to clarify. I am not talking about the actual instructing going on at the corps level in general. I am referring to the level of student coming in to audition and this has everything to do with those whom have already donned a uniform. I am saying because of dc's past the bar has been raised. People received quality training in drum corps then went home and taught others what they learned. My MS/HS drum instructors marched SCV & VK. I learned so much more from them than I learned from my band directors. The knowledge base and talent pool are ever-increasing. It should be taken as a compliment that the activity has been pushed to this level. cheers, DK

Good call Adam. Most drum corps drumming employed index FF because we need to freeze the stick at playing position after a downstroke. The best way to do that was to have as many fingers as possible behind the fulcrum to squeeze the back of the stick into the palm. Now that kids are better trained and DC instructors are coming from outside ranks we are seeing a greater variety in approach. Seriously, check out jazz drummers wailing away "triple beat" on a ride cymbal. dk

My problem with what you said is that it reeks of myopia. I understand the difference between opinion and fact, and the only fact discernable from your post is that you don't understand middle finger fulcrum. I appreciate the idea that you may be looking for more information to train yourself, but your post reads like standoffish defensive posturing. And yes, I did jump off the deep end rather hastily and for that I apologize. However, when you make comments such as "I think they look like they were never taught the proper way to play drums", it appears to me that over your 30 years you were only ever taught ONE way to play drums. To me that is wrong. Besides, you marched. You know how it works: they are playing that way because somebody is TEACHING them to play that way. Do you see the contradiction? You really don't know how to manipulate your fulcrum? Really? Also, you say "happy it works for you", like I am the only person that can play MFF, further adding to the divisiveness of your post. All I'm asking is that you consider for a moment that there are other approaches to our craft and that they could be equally "right". What is this, religion? good luck with your quest for knowledge, DK

get a dictionary and/or hire a private instructor.

it looks like you have good instruction going on and the line has bought in. yes a portion of the book is linear, but that is a great approach given the numbers. very solid. LH attack issues as well as LH doubles when played following a RH single (eg: LH double during grandpa RllRl) enjoyed it! good luck, dk

to clear up DRUMAJOR: it was rotate vs. hinge. what needs to be understood with regard to kinesthetics of traditional grip is keeping the thumb in line with the radius bone throughout. i notice most struggle to define thumb placement and reasoning. the thumb should be treated as an extention of the radius. moving the thumb off line results in a loss of energy. dk

"odd", "awkward", and worse yet: "stupid". you want awkward: how about choking the heck out of a stick to prevent rebound in the name of uniformity or wearing a shiny helmet with a boa mohawk. i know, i know... taking offense to a forum post... i just pooped in my pants a little. anyway, you're getting a response out of me so congrats. [/fun time] the following pertains to drumming on surfaces that kick back hard (ie not keyboards) there are two balance points to consider: the balance point of the stick and the balance point of the fulcrum (both of which are fulcra so let's not argue semantics). the balance point of the stick is just that: the point on the sick that divides weight distribution evenly. there is downward pressure at the bead and at the butt of the stick. this is usually aft of center. backing up the stick further we come to the fulcrum balance point. the fulcrum balance point attempts to balance downward AND UPWARD pressure (force vector from rebound) with respect to the BEAD while in motion. that balance point is the sweet-spot. most of us have done this before: balance the stick where you think the fulcrum should go then drop the bead on the head and watch the stick bounce itself to equilibrium (ie resting on head). if it lands heavily and dies quickly, then you are too far back. if it seems to float and not make solid contact, then you are too far forward. the sweet-spot is where there is balance with the force of the rebound up and gravity pushing down. moving your fulcrum (in either direction) away from the sweet-spot sacrifices rebound balance. moving it forward gives you finer control (eg: holding a pencil toward the lead, or moving one hand up a baseball bat to bunt), while moving it back gives more directional force (ie stronger downstroke; eg: holding the bat toward the hilt to clear the green monster). what we are trying to do with our fulcrum is create side-to-side pressure at the sweet-spot. dealing with the "side-to-side" determines wich finger (if not both: see "tri-point" fulcrum) we will put to use. middle finger fulcrum has two clear ergonomic advantages. 1) by shifting up a finger on the fulcrum it moves the sweet-spot of the stick closer to the rotation point of the wrist and balance point of the hand by moving it both back and in. this helps greatly in smooting out multiple rebound srtokes... check out any jazz cat rippin multiple strokes on the ride: smooth as silk, and usu done from middle finger fulrcum. 2) it is a more natural fit for your hand. [there is a second part to this equation that we need to understand before going further with 2: part of this method involves keeping the stick fairly close to being in line with the arm so that arm motion (yes, it is acceptable to move your arms when you play; maybe not at your high school or back in your day, but we are not discussing those situations) and stick motion are in near the same plane.] try this: hold your hand up ~ fingers extended and palm facing you. now, starting with your pinky (and keeping in mind that we are going to "line the stick up" with our forearm) wrap your fingers into your palm stopping after the middle finger (don't wrap index). from here you should find that you thumb connects very readily to your middle finger which would be the side-to-side pressure of your fulcrum. your index finger now acts as more of a guide, not unlike the middle finger in traditional grip. just like anything remotely dangerous: do not attempt unless under the guidance of a trained professional, lest you find yourself posting forum fodder with verbiage apropos of a petulant 7 year old. sincerely, big dummy doo-doo face.

The force of the rebound is so great (even at pp) that moving the right hand stroke slightly off the vertical plane is a non-factor. Moreover, the change in the playing position of the right arm now allows for easier shoulder-to-elbow movement (ie Moeller); seeing as how the elbow is not ratcheted up as far as it once was.

let's pretend we're playing matched for a sec. to define our playing position w/o teching wrist/finger (ie: german, american, tri-point fulcrum etc) do the following: 1) drop your hands to your side 2) bend at the elbow (without flaring the elbows) to raise your hands to playing level. for snare (tradish) add 3) turn your left hand over. now, with your hands level and with one stick "on top of" the left hand and one "below" the right hand you've created tilt. compare fulcra: the left is above the the right. boom, done. (KISS method) "visually" it comes down to this: ~ symmetric drum/asymmetric body (flat drum) ~ symmetric body/asymmetric drum (tilt). completely symmetric body? not quite, but... i say visually in quotes because there is certainly more to be said about a body that approaches symmetry than appearance; hence the opening demonstration. tilting the drum also allows for a more accessible Moeller stroke on the left (less constricted elbow). to suggest the right hand is now incorrect tells me all the drums on your kit are flat. no? the adjustment of the right hand is what gets overlooked most often. the stroke needs to be adjusted to be in line with the rebound vector; which is merely a fun way of saying "play perpendicular to the head". this does fight -9.8 m/s^2 slightly. the "vertical difference" explanation does show that there is no relative difference when you take a snapshot at the point of contact, however the operating difference is huge. "vd" (lol... sorry Jim) accounts for the sticks at head level but does not account for full extension. naturally the right hand can extend farther than the left thereby creating inequity. how do we solve this? easy: rotate the drum to match the angle set by the hands. or keep the drum the same and keep stretching those tendons! tilting is all about ergonomics. seriously, i tech lines both ways: it just depends on what kind of students i have and what kind of book i am writing. tilting or not has a massive impact.

wow, i am going to say it: I love this. paradox is we are judging GENERAL effect with very SPECIFIC criteria. the only criterion for GE should be... well, GENERAL EFFECT. which of course would be very subjective. so yeah... open the phone lines. and remember: there is GE and then there is actual general effect. i.e. general dc audience opinion vs general public opinion.

yes! we should all be promoting Japanese drums.

am I really the first to say... 77 Oakland Crusaders

... and to anyone suggesting 8 or fewer in the front: please give us your intrumentation. I am more than ready to give real thought to an insightful argument on the matter and not an one-liner followed by a bunch of emoticons (which has its place: see above), or an inchoate rambling of no technical value. seriously: convince me. I am responsible for fielding (writing/arranging/consulting/instructing) several groups and I just might be going about this whole thing improperly. I hope to see numbers in the 10-13 range. Is there is a full corps out there with < 9 up front?... somebody post pics and get an interview! ~gets out S&P for foot~

RN did an interesting thing and hired those that have been shredding the WGI scene in perc and guard. Shane (MCM) will have perc rippin and Jill/Robbie (NEI) ditto for guard. btw, Scouts fans might be interested in knowing that Scott Boerma is arranging the horn book.

same reason middle-age bald guys drive convertibles.

this one's easy. been lucky enough to wear a drum and put on a dc uniform for Matt Savage, Scott Johnson, Glen Crosby, Ralph Hardimon, and Tom Aungst... and all I can think of is my high school instructor back in San Diego: THANK YOU WAYNE VOOGD!

See: this here'z why I didn't march Scouts! kidding, too funny. Awesome... never too far from State Street, are we?

18" is the standard #1 drum these days and 32" is for real men. modern day dc bass cats have snare-like chops so a reefed head is required to allow for virtuousity; and the notes that get laid down are absolutely nothing like show band stuff. honestly, what are you saying?... if you march anything smaller than a 22" then you must be a Show Band? you really can't put all of this together in your head, can you? unreal. every last player in the batterie has chops these days... not like college band in 1980 when the bass line was a bunch of snare wannabes. we used to be amazed at our bassline as they were essentially a second quad line; modern composers (thank you Hardimon/Hannum) take on the added responsibility of voicing: soprano/alto/bass = snare/quad/bass. would you want to hear pedal tones the entire time from the tubas? no, so why would we want to hear 'variations-on-a-thud' from the bass line? [$10] buy a clue. btw, the kick on my jass kit is an 18" done steelband/fusion gigs with the 'hipgig' kit w/a 16". ... on second thought [$50] deeK

i have no problem with one person per instrument. i don't want to see a snare/quad/bass line playing unison parts on electronics other than for effect. <--Zombie Nation

05 Center Grove I think. it was cool and wgi is of course the better 'arena' (pardon the pun) for electronics. i don't want to see it at dci until it more closely simulates the playing demands inherent in acoustic drumming.

umm... I was implying I didn't think they would win b/c they are coming off a 15th place showing. I think if you understood my entire (and I do mean "ENTIRE") post you would see that you are merely echoing my sentiment. And that was indeed all in fun. After you look up all the items in my post, be sure to look up "sarcasm". panties: -inawad I hope this doesn't read as rather dark, but to be sure... I'm posting here just in case others missed my original point. anything further will go to PM's. Seriously, I am looking forward to seeing Scouts; if the stars align, the markets crash, W is granted a third term, and Madison takes the title I would be very surprised. btw: Indiana hosted the Big10 Men's Indoor Track & Field meet this year... Wisconsin won.

ftw huge difference between set theory and numerology. </logic> carry on.

Great to watch and loads of fun in the lot. Didn't Hannum write his dissertation (precursor to his book maybe) on the marching cymbal? btw BrianH, nice sig... Lewis Carroll much. heh. The only corps that concerns me regarding this topic, hold your applause, is VK. Seriously though, cyms should be an integral part of the dc experience. Honestly, outside of our idiom, what good is a rippin snare line? And don't say "Top Secret" or those cadence playin mini-drumlines that keep popping up around US sports franchises... the only drums that need to be at a sporting event should be carried by a shirtless, hirsute, cooked-to-the-gills, standing-room-only, singin-his-pitchless-brain-out, face-painted mancunian standing behind the goal in Moscow five rows up and three sheets to the wind bangin the be-jebus out of 1 + 2e+ 3e+a e+ with his right hand and strangling a Chelski supporter with his left. but, yeah, i got a fever... edit for ManU dominance... Day of the Double: May 21st.

Did you really just down your whole program, or was that a preemptory self-defense-mechanism-type strike? If you're doing Corigliano's Circus Maximus, then buy two and tell me where you are performing. Best of luck! (Following a visit to the website on another browser): or Peter Pan, whatever. Either way: Do It Up!

if you want to dry out the sound (after you have cranked the heads to cut down on vibration) then tape the snares: put a few strips of elec tape across the snares. start taping about 1/4 way across the guts. still not dry enough: do the same on the other side (ie mirror image). still no: muffle the bottom head. a patch of weather stripping works great or you can tape cloth/paper towels to the head (cheap and easy). still: muffle the top head. still?... yeah sure, switch drums or play on 2x4's; those guys are so awesome, i'm sure. markdewine: i am all for warm and wet, but not in a marching snare.