cabalumsw

Don: Those videos are priceless and we have the Haas family to thank!

Hi Fran: It's great to hear about Barbara's progress. I pray she makes a complete recovery which I am confident she will. She needs to smack Wayne around to keep him in line as well!!!!!!!! I pity your sister. :)

Hi Dan: Mike Marsh is a really good guy. I saw him in Scranton at DCA in 2005. We watched the Alumni show together. Mike has a great baritone voice and was singing with Sky Alumni as they marched off the field. I remember at one of the first Alumni shows in Allentown, we had just got into concert and I heard someone yell out my name. I immediately knew it was Mike.

Chico was a very funny guy and a good drummer. I was with him when he first got sick at St. Lucy's final competition in 1969. He was laying down in the bus and was complaining about pain in his chest. Everyone thought he was joking around, as he always did. Then right before we were to go on, he was hanging on the backstop of a baseball field and he was crying. I knew then he was not fooling around and medical assistance was sought. At first they thought it was a heart attack and treated as such but it got worse and when he went for surgery, they found cancer in his chest and he passed away not too soon after the surgery. I used to drive up to rehearsals with Chico and it was continuous laughs. I am sure Chico would have went to Cabs if he lived.

Eddie has no sister. He has a brother, Al, who also marched with Lakesiders. Their father was Andy Schneider. Gary Thomassetti went to Madison Township HS and did march with Cyclones. He later got involved playing guitar and songing in professional bands. His brother Tony was in Emerald Lancers. Their uncle, Joe Butera, marched with Hawthorne. I was very close to Joe and several of us were with him the day before he passed away. It was very sad. My sister, Pat graduated in 1967 from MTHS and I in 1970. She will kill me for saying this but it was her that got hit with a bullwhip by some Boston Crusaders in 1968 that prompted a brawl in Bridgeport,CT. I knew Harry Ossif as well as Chico Fernandes, Eric Clark, Sammy Donato, Timmy Fogg, Fred Henry and Bill Ternylia. Chuck Dohn is currently playing quints with St. Lucy's Alumni. I saw him back in May.

Andy: Could that be Jim Carter?

Hi Bob: Small world. My brother in law is Eddie Schneider, whose father was also the Director of the Lakesiders at one point. Eddie joined the Flames and then was recruited by Bobby Hamilton with Joe Niglio, Paul Pipero, Chuck Dohn, and Paul Icker,all going to Lucy's after the 1964 season. Eddie marched with Lucy's until 1969. My sister said she knew you and your sister from high school as well. Pat Williams? Did you know Joe Eglow and Gary Thomasetti? Both were with the Cyclones. Joe was a tenor drummer and marched in Lakesiders and Cyclones and then with the Caballeros. Both passed away within the last year as well as Joe Niglio. Yes, I still live in Central Jersey. I met Tim Campbell when I was with the Cabs Alumni. Frank Kubinak was a drill instructor with Cabs when I marched with them in the 70s. Walter Kelly was my first drum instructor.

My oldest sister started in Winter Guard in the early 1960s, marching with the Sirenettes from Old Bridge, NJ and the Melodears from Perth Amboy, NJ. Watching her compete in color guard exposed my family to both color guard and drum corps. My two younger sisters and I marched with the Emerald Lancers, from Old Bridge NJ and the Little Dukes, Perth Amboy NJ. I also drummed for the Sirenettes color guard at the American Legion Nationals in 1966 and for the Sayreville Colleens in 1967. As Fran Haring, I briefly joined the Raiders of 88 weeks before they broke up and I remember Bob Love was drum instructor. I joined St. Lucy's in 1968 and then Hawthorne Caballeros from 1971-1975. I marched with Cabs Alumni from 1995-2004. My brother in law marched with the Spotswood Lakesiders, the Flames of East Brunswick, NJ ( who later became the Raiders of 88) and St. Lucy's. Ed was recruited for St. Lucy's, with several other Flames, by the late Bobby Hamilton. It was my brother in law who finally convinced my parents to let me go to St. Lucy's.

Mike: Danny Raymond was with Garfield in 1968. I remember Garfield playing very open rolls in 1969 and I, being a tenor drummer, believed I could have cut the line. Al Nichols once told me that if Lucy's had not disbanded in 1969, he was planning on leaving Garfield and joining iSt. Lucy's for the 1970 season. I was not a big fan of Tuthill after hearing his 1969 parts and what he had done to us in 1969. I remember how freaky he looked when he was judging that night. He was wearing a baseball cap and had hair sticking all out. I remember as we were coming up the field during the OTL he came from nowhere , flying through the air and jumping in front of the drum line. I have to say he won me over with the stuff he wrote for the Cabs though.

Andy: Believe it or not, Manny got thrown out of Lucy's during the middle of 1969 and then joined BS. I'll never forget this. We sponsored a show in Harrison and it had rained during the day, thunderstorms. The gates had just opened for the show and Manny drives through the gates onto the field and starts spinning out on the field. As fast as he came in to the Stadium, he drove out. To say the least, he marched his last show with St. Lucy's. What a character. I believe Manny went to Sky after BS. Yes, Flowers was on drums in 1969. Sasso and Frank Pisillo were horn instructors and I believe Bob Bunz (sp) wrote some music as well. I remember the hotel. It was the Mark Inn near the airport and it is still in business. The rooms had orange wall to wall carpeting and the carpeting ran up the walls to the ceiling. I remember it being hot and humid and we worked our butts off that week believing we had a decent shot. John Flowers made a cassette for me of our performance at 1969 Nationals.

St. Lucy's started the 1969 season in winning form. Towards mid season, it was decided the corps would not be attending the Nationals in Atlanta. I remember it was sometime in mid july when Don Angelica came to Father Nativo and Mickey Petrone and suggested the corps make some musical changes to it's repertoire and convinced both to change their minds and compete in Atlanta despite reservations. Perhaps it is coincidence but after we made the changes, the corps fortunes changed in a losing way. At the Garfield Invitational, George Tuthill, at the time Garfield's drum instructor, trashed the drum line while judging the show and we never recovered after that. At the July 26th Bridgeport show, we finished second, 9/10 of a point from first place Boston. The following week Boston beat us by 7 points. The inconsistent spreads continued the rest of the season. As far as the hotel trashing in Atlanta, I am not sure of that one either. I don't remember seeing any widespread trashing of room(s). Could it just have been one room or could it have been the other corps that was staying at the same hotel that set us up. We will never know because the corps was shut down for good the week prior to the 1969 NJ State American Legion Nationals. Many in the corps wanted to march in the Wildwood parade in street clothes as a form of protest but we did not feel it was worth going to jail. Angelica happened to be judging at the States field competition and he was forced to face an angry group of St. Lucy's members who believed he set the corps up to fall. He was not very comfortable sitting up in his lifeguard stand that day. Several years later, when I was with Hawthorne Cabs, I asked Tuthill why he trashed us so bad at that show and he bluntly replied " because we sucked". I replied at least we were clean, unlike the line he instructed at Garfield. He just blinked at me and gave me a stare. LOL!

What I saw what happened with St. Lucy's and Don Angelica made me highly suspicious of his motives. It's amazing how his corps, Garfield, was the only survivor of all the older corps in the East.

Don: Yes, the intense rivalries were just like those in professional football and baseball. I experienced those rivalries in both levels of junior and senior corps. Also, every corps had it's own uniqueness. Today everything is homogenous. I am glad I went through the era I did because I would have never had the chance to march in a corps today. Natural talent does not cut it. I played by ear and that is how I how I made it through drum corps.

Back in 1972 and prior, many DCA corps had local junior corps age-outs to fill their ranks. Now that DCI has managed to dilute the field of junior corps, DCA has to rely on high school bands just as DCI. DCI age-outs are too burnt out by touring and so now DCA has become 'All Age".

Mr. Williams is the only loser in this issue. To Mr. Jamesie Melon (or is it Jamesey Melon?) and Mr. Davis? The rest is all a nonsequitur debate which could (and probably will) go on for as long as the scoring system for GE continues as it is. You both can have the last word but all I'm hearing is a couple of band/drum corps instructors trying to get a higher score for their band/drum corps. Carry on carryin' on! I'm the loser? I never said we did not make changes. I said we did not water down parts that was referred to by Mike Siglow, meant to be a demeaning and negative reference since he cannot accept the outcome of an event 35 years ago. Our changes were enhancements rather than "watered down". To say we didn't have the horses in our drum line? Our tenor, or double conga line, featured 2 guys from St. Lucy's and 2 guys from Garfield who I felt were quite capable. Mike D. knows who the two guys from Garfield were and can attest they were pretty good drummers. Jim Mallen can speak for the snare line. And yeah, I have two college degrees, an Associates and a BS from Rutgers. I am not a music major, could not read music, and am proud how far I got in drum corps!

Below is an excerpt of a thread on RAMD titled "Shades of 1972". This was a reply from Mike Siglow to some of my comments on the thread I had started. He erred in his location referral to Cleveland. If you want to read the whole thing, do a search on the topic. It was a lively debate I have to say! Mike, do you remember this? It was from 2003. One thing I do have is a good memory! Hey Mike: I was sure that we would be hearing from you! ****Just keeping everyone better informed about what really took place that year. In 72 it was the tortoise and the hare. In New Brunswick that year,we were working our ##### in the hottest of days while you guys were drinking beer and laughing at us. ****I was doing no such thing Steve. But we caught you in the end, didn't we ****It was more the trip to Cleveland where you watered down your drum parts, remember Steve? Or did that conveniently slip your mind? All year you were getting high GE drum marks but your book was over your collective heads and you were losing in execution drums big time. So rather then getting beat so badly in execution you watered down your drum parts. Bennett couldn't tell the difference, gave you the same GE drum score you had been getting throughout the season and because you were playing a really watered down book your execution mark went up as well. Did you deserve that win in Schenectady? No. Did you deserve to win DCA that year? Guess we'll never really know due to all the judging politics that took place that night. But I promised Tom P. I'd not devulge any of the particulars. Suffice to say that the point penalty for undertime was a "screw job" as well. Where did 25 to 30 seconds from the show go Steve? Guess it's very similar to the 6 minutes that the Field drum judge spent in the Brigs pit a couple of weeks ago in Providence that gave them the win huh. and we kept on running in 73 and 74. ****You guys weren't all that good in 73 and 74. It was that everyone else sucked those years and you guys didn't suck as bad as they did.

In 1972 we went to Chicago for the American Legion Nationals and an exhibition at the first DCI Championship. We knew the show had problems so we took the 8 days together to change some of the drill and music. 2) Refutes Steve's comments that there were NO changes. [/color] Could you please show the quote where I say the you "significantly watered down your book"? Mike: The first time I encountered you and a debate on 1972 was in RAMD a few years back even before there was DCP. I don't even know if you remember but you specifically told me that we watered our parts down in Chicago. Whether it was a post or a private email, you did say that and I took exception to it. Changes are different than watering parts down. We did make changes in 1972 and fact we made changes to our show the entire year. We were playing Siboney for concert and changed it to Russian Sabre Dance later in the season. You also told me that in 1973 and 1974 we were really not that good but just that everyone else sucked more. You also chastised me for being oblivious to the politics of drum corpa and told me I was probably a young punk marching in a parade corps in 1966 when Skyliners got screwed at the Nationals. You were correct because I was a 14 year old punk in 1966 marching in a parade corps. LOL!

Hi Dan: Have not talked in awhile. How have you been? After seeing the 1969 Senior portion of the Dream being offered, I called the Haas family and asked about the Junior portion of the show. The Juniors were recorded but never converted to VHS but the original tapes are still in the can. I spoke to Jackie Haas and later Christine Hass and I was told they used two different recording tapes at the 69 Dream. They cannot find a machine to convert the tape format of the Junior show and Christine was not certain of the condition of the tapes. Those performances are priceless. It is a shame that those tapes probably will never be seen. Christine did say she would continue searching because they had family stuff on some of those tapes as well so it means a lot to them as well.

Don: They are treasures you will enjoy. The sound quality is not bad and the video is a little grainy but something is better than nothing. They recently came out in DVD. I wish they could convert the junior portion of the 1969 Dream but the owners say they cannot locate a converter and are not sure of the condition of the tapes. Tha is sad because it contains one of the last performances of St. Lucy's Cadets.

Geoff: Amen! You can also buy the videos performances of those same 5 corps at http://www.drumcorpsvideos.com. The videos are black and white but they recapture that night. I have our performance and Skyliners. I keep watching those videos over and over and it gives me goose bumps because they were indeed of a golden era, unlike the homogenized product of today.

Andy: That was always the case, even when I was marching with Cabs Alumni. I forget what year it was but we were told not to play past whatever time limit. The corps before us was playing for over 25 minutes and I remember we were getting antsy and wondering where the time limit was. Then right before we went on, Pete and Chuck Bishop tells the corps we cannot play Cherry Pink. I remember the whole corps telling Chuck to play it and asking what are they going to do if we go over. Well we did play it and the rest is history. I was just saying that you have to be careful with shirking the rules because DCA instituted the Alumni show only in the late 1990s. I remember we played the exhibition at Finals by invite in 1996 or 1997 in Allentown and then the Alumni show started small and grew every year. If there are going to be limits, they have to be applied consistently and everyone has to follow. That was the point I was trying to make.

Hi John: I guess better weather had a lot to do with a bigger crowd than last year as well!!!!!!!!! B)

Rich: I remember in Scranton when several alumni corps went beyond the time limit, including the Cabs Alumni, and Mickey Petrone was livid. DCA wants to contain the length of the Alumni show because of Finals at night and want the Stadium cleared, which is understandable. I had heard that DCA was going to impose penalties on corps not abiding by the limit in the form of not being invited back the following year. Rules are rules and if corps want to extend their playing time, perhaps they should play off the field rather than troop the stands with a streetbeat and then stopping to play.

I vaguely remember the protest. Did it have to do with illegal rifles? I really cared less about the protest. I accepted the loss and did not feel our performance was up to par. As many have said, 1972 was a fine year for DCA and we all gave the fans their money's worth. Peace to you as well!

[HAHA ... the only "performing" I did was at the tailgate party trying to keep up with Bucky!!! ... LOL ... the 16 snares Sky had out there in Clifton didn't include me (retired), Wes (wrist) and Shirley Temple (year off) ... they lost us but picked up four new snares (including Fast Frankie) over the winter .. My mistake. From the stands, at Grand Prix, I thought I saw you in the line. I did see Wes on the sidelines. I am now content seeing one or two shows a year. As far as DCA Finals, never liked the ride to Rochester, especially the twice a years back in the 70s. I was willing to go to Scranton but it looks like Rochester will be a permanent fixture now.