Renegade_fireman Posted September 4, 2007 Share Posted September 4, 2007 Check it, We had a great show on Sunday night, much better then Saturday. You cant really compare last years score to this one...placements from year to year really are not a way to judge a corps improvement. I think it is very safe to say that this years version of the Renegades was VASTLY improved over last years. Everyone else just really stepped their game up this year, and major props to them...especially the Hurcs. We're not mad...no worries. As for kalijah, If you really are saying that the spread between Us and Hurcs should have been 5 points...thats just rediculous. Oh and it looks like you were marching RIGHT BEFORE us, both nights...so how could you really judge that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dale Bari Posted September 4, 2007 Share Posted September 4, 2007 (edited) Check it, We had a great show on Sunday night, much better then Saturday. You cant really compare last years score to this one...placements from year to year really are not a way to judge a corps improvement. I think it is very safe to say that this years version of the Renegades was VASTLY improved over last years. Everyone else just really stepped their game up this year, and major props to them...especially the Hurcs. We're not mad...no worries. For the most part, I have seen the Renegades conduct themselves with much class while dealing with issues that no other corps in DCA has to deal with (except maybe Dream). Yes, sometimes the frustration slips out a bit, but I can dismiss that, for the most part. Scores don't have to go up from Prelims to Finals, and the two panels sometimes have strange differences in takes on their respective competitions. In 2003, all corps in Finals went DOWN in score from Prelims to Finals, except two: Brigs (2) and Statesmen (3), and the amounts they went up were miniscule. The odds of 10 corps (of 12 Finalists) having a worse show at the same time are pretty small. And, being a Brig that year, I can say that we most definitely had the better show in PRELIMS. So, go figure. As well all know (or should know) judges rank first and rate second. The order is most important, the gaps not quite so. So long as a judge gets the order right, we can expect some error in the rating part. As others have said, two panels on two different nights. I was looking at the Prelims recaps last night wondering where White Sabers had beaten LSM. The GE captions (with 2 judges each) were completely split: GE-V saw one judge put LSM up a little and the other put Sabers up a lot. GE-M had exactly the same situation, just reversed: LSM up a lot on one sheet, and Sabers up a little on the other. And that was the same corps at the same time! So, judges are human - that's hardly news. At prelims, I had Statesmen down as the most entertaining show, but I had the Renegades in second on that count, with CorpsVets and Hurricanes coming next. The "evils ones" know how to put on a show, and I was riveted the whole time. Too bad we missed Finals, it sounds like Renegades might have pushed to #1 in entertainment value for me. As far as being compared to Hurcs, Renegades ran into a corps that was, IMO, finishing its best season in as much as 25 years - and definitely the best since 1994 (my personal experience watching them). There's no shame in that either. So, I say "Congrats" to all of the competitors at this season's Championships. We sat through all 22 corps, and it was fun. The last time I enjoyed that much fun was at 2004 DCA Prelims. Edited September 4, 2007 by Dale Bari Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CVet Posted September 4, 2007 Share Posted September 4, 2007 (edited) As well all know (or should know) judges rank first and rate second. The order is most important, the gaps not quite so... This makes perfect sense in this case. As it is, it doesn't make much difference as long as the two were properly ranked, and ranking doesn't seem to be the issue here. Edited September 5, 2007 by CVet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lisard5 Posted September 4, 2007 Share Posted September 4, 2007 It's like Trevor and Sara both said - we performed a great show! We were all very proud of our performance. Were there issues? There must have been something out there that the judgest saw but honestly I'm not too concerned. Do we wish we would have scored higher? Well of course - who wouldn't? 7th would have been great with us :) hehehe The feeling of walking around the stadium after our performance and having people after people stop us and tell us that they enjoyed the performance is worth so much more than a number could ever mean. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CVet Posted September 4, 2007 Share Posted September 4, 2007 The feeling of walking around the stadium after our performance and having people after people stop us and tell us that they enjoyed the performance is worth so much more than a number could ever mean. Hear Hear! Well said. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kyle B Posted September 4, 2007 Share Posted September 4, 2007 Just out of curiosity, what is the exact score for the start of Box 5. I have talked to many people, and everyone says something different. Is it an 18.0 (180) or 19.0 (190) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJ CVmellophone Posted September 4, 2007 Share Posted September 4, 2007 B)--> QUOTE(Kyle B @ Sep 4 2007, 11:15 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Just out of curiosity, what is the exact score for the start of Box 5. I have talked to many people, and everyone says something different. Is it an 18.0 (180) or 19.0 (190) I think box 5 starts at 18.8. Just a guess though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJ CVmellophone Posted September 4, 2007 Share Posted September 4, 2007 Idea- "DCA Armchair Championships" Basic concept- While watching a DVD of prelims and/or finals, rate each corps using an armchair fan judging sheet to be created by us dcp'ers. (starting to see where I'm going with this?) Next step- Somebody with some time on their hands please further develop this idea if the dcp community thinks it is a good idea. Time to go unpack and prepare for 2008! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nutrock69 Posted September 4, 2007 Share Posted September 4, 2007 That says it all,,,,,"A) it was a difference of opinion " Thats what judging is all about. I dont like ES or Crusaders,,, But thats my opinion! That opinion was formed many many years ago. I have liked and disliked shows. I have very good and very old friends that marched w/ ES and Cru,, But I never liked the corps. Opinion! Judging has nothing to do with opinion unless it concerns an immediate opinion about the corps' performance there and now. A past opinion should have absolutely NOTHING to do with a performance score. A judge cannot have a predisposed opinion about a corps if s/he wants to be considered impartial. Your example: you may not like ES or Cru - the corps themselves - but if you were to judge a performance by one of those corps could you give them an honest score? Assume they were actually better than the Bucs on that given night - would the Bucs still win in your eyes? Would they still win on your sheets? Whether you would be honest or not, there have been judges in the past that wouldn't be. One judge I remember from the early 90's made it very clear he hated the corps I was in, and we'd see multi-point drops in his caption whenever he judged. This judge had the (dis)honor of judging finals a few years ago, where my ex-corps came in 1st in his caption in prelims, but dropped to 4th in his caption in finals - a full 2.0 point drop from that judge alone. Over the past few years I have loved watching the Renegades. They perform for the fun of it - for the fans - and really don't seem to care how they place as long as the fans loved the show. Kinda reminds me of Empire before winning took over. This year was a blast. I, personally, thought they had a better show on finals night. But I also loved the Hurcs as well. Actually, this was the first year in a while that I enjoyed just about everyone. I would have liked a better Renegades placement in finals, but I learned a long time ago that the placement matters much less than most make it out to be. The only downside I saw this year were the rude Bucs fans around us at prelims. There is no doubt in my mind that the Bucs trounced everyone, but these people refused to enjoy any corps that wasn't Bucs, and specifically jeered ES for daring to be positioned 2nd to the Bucs on the way into prelims. Now that I live near Reading, I was actually embarrassed that these people are tied to my (now) hometown corps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlbionNY Drum Line Posted September 4, 2007 Share Posted September 4, 2007 B)--> QUOTE(Kyle B @ Sep 4 2007, 11:15 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Just out of curiosity, what is the exact score for the start of Box 5. I have talked to many people, and everyone says something different. Is it an 18.0 (180) or 19.0 (190) 18 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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