drumcat Posted October 31, 2007 Author Share Posted October 31, 2007 I am wondering how the "class" designations might be affected by a format such as this, for both semi-finals and finals and for the next year.How many corps are you having compete in semi-finals? If you had an "Open" class corps who came in 16th or 17th in the open Thursday pre-lims, that corps should then perfom in the "World" semifinals? Should such corps be then classified with "World" corps for the following year? And what happens with "Open" class semi-finals? You would have "World" corps competing for the "Open" Class title? Then would such corps would be classed "Open" for the following year? Or do you mean when you say "all" that after prelims everyone goes back to their original class for semi-finals and finals? Thoughts on this? No one changes places or classes. Say your top open corps gets 16th overall. OK, bonus for them. They haven't won anything yet, other than they see how they are on world sheets, and the top seed for Open on Friday. That corps on Thursday in World that came in 17th will get a bump the next night in World, up to 16th. No "world placements" are handed out to anyone in open. In other words, an open corps in this example will not make Semis because it isn't there on Friday when Semi spots are decided. They will know they may have been able to get there, but they are not eligible. In that case, both corps "win", since the top open corps knows where it stands, and the world corps doesn't miss out on its rightful semifinal spot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldguard Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 Let me be a bit more specific. Thursday would be every open corps, then every world corps, in prior seeded order. The show would be an exhibition of sorts; all it would decide is Friday seeding for each class. No one falls in or out of class.The 17 on the cinecast are the same, and there is no change to order because the open corps are there. They just go on before, on world sheets. The interesting part is that this would also seed Friday's Open show, based on world sheets. Thanks for the clarification and sorry if my questions muddied the waters. (Just my thoughts on some of this: I still think I like the idea of the open Thursday format, although personally, I would be in favor of allowing corps who have proven themselves on Thursday to compete on Friday in World Class. I do not, personally, believe that a corps who might move from "world" to "open" semi-finals would be "falling." I just think they are being given the opportunity to compete with other corps performing at a similar level for an annual award. I am really have not decided how I feel about changing classes under such a system for the following year. I am inclined to think maybe it would be best. It starts a corps off in the spring at the level they are currently achieving and under such a format they would be free to move back at the end of the year. A corps that is struggling financially might actually benefit from this for a year. Also, it recognizes and increases the opportunities for those corps who are achieving and may be ready for the next challenge. ) Thanks for a poll with such a interesting concept. Carry on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldguard Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 No one changes places or classes. Say your top open corps gets 16th overall. OK, bonus for them. They haven't won anything yet, other than they see how they are on world sheets, and the top seed for Open on Friday. That corps on Thursday in World that came in 17th will get a bump the next night in World, up to 16th.No "world placements" are handed out to anyone in open. In other words, an open corps in this example will not make Semis because it isn't there on Friday when Semi spots are decided. They will know they may have been able to get there, but they are not eligible. In that case, both corps "win", since the top open corps knows where it stands, and the world corps doesn't miss out on its rightful semifinal spot. Again, thanks for the clarification. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drumcat Posted October 31, 2007 Author Share Posted October 31, 2007 Thanks for the clarification and sorry if my questions muddied the waters. (Just my thoughts on some of this: I still think I like the idea of the open Thursday format, although personally, I would be in favor of allowing corps who have proven themselves on Thursday to compete on Friday in World Class. I do not, personally, believe that a corps who might move from "world" to "open" semi-finals would be "falling." I just think they are being given the opportunity to compete with other corps performing at a similar level for an annual award. I am really have not decided how I feel about changing classes under such a system for the following year. I am inclined to think maybe it would be best. It starts a corps off in the spring at the level they are currently achieving and under such a format they would be free to move back at the end of the year. A corps that is struggling financially might actually benefit from this for a year. Also, it recognizes and increases the opportunities for those corps who are achieving and may be ready for the next challenge. ) Thanks for a poll with such a interesting concept. Carry on. A corps that is struggling would actually *not* benefit from going down to Open. That's the reason that we don't have a soccer-style relegation system. World corps are paid more for their show appearances, and have more road to travel. Moving down isn't really a benefit. I've always been intrigued with the idea of a relegation, but it's clearly not a good idea to place the level of the organization based upon the way they run their business. That's why there is no more corollary between performance and class; they aren't related in any meaningful way. Kids on the field can achieve, or not, and it has very little to do with how well the org is run or funds are raised. If they were for-profit groups, I'd be *all over* it. But since they're non-profits, it's important to run it as such. It's not a popular answer, but it seems to be the right one right now. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldguard Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 A corps that is struggling would actually *not* benefit from going down to Open. That's the reason that we don't have a soccer-style relegation system. World corps are paid more for their show appearances, and have more road to travel. Moving down isn't really a benefit. ... Actually, you are right in this respect. I've always been intrigued with the idea of a relegation, but it's clearly not a good idea to place the level of the organization based upon the way they run their business. That's why there is no more corollary between performance and class; they aren't related in any meaningful way. Kids on the field can achieve, or not, and it has very little to do with how well the org is run or funds are raised.If they were for-profit groups, I'd be *all over* it. But since they're non-profits, it's important to run it as such. Were performance fees more equally distributed to all corps ... which is how I personally think it should be ... this would not be the case. It's not a popular answer, but it seems to be the right one right now. :) Under the present structure. However, it highlights the need for change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CoHmempho04 Posted October 31, 2007 Share Posted October 31, 2007 So we were complaining that the field was horrible last year??? Let's add 3 more hours of drum corps to that field and see how many fall. Orlando did an Open class finals then world class finals all on the same field with open class prelims and semis on a totally different field. You want to add even more to it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drumcat Posted October 31, 2007 Author Share Posted October 31, 2007 So we were complaining that the field was horrible last year??? Let's add 3 more hours of drum corps to that field and see how many fall. Orlando did an Open class finals then world class finals all on the same field with open class prelims and semis on a totally different field. You want to add even more to it? Indy is FieldTurf, bro. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldguard Posted November 2, 2007 Share Posted November 2, 2007 No one changes places or classes. Say your top open corps gets 16th overall. OK, bonus for them. They haven't won anything yet, other than they see how they are on world sheets, and the top seed for Open on Friday. That corps on Thursday in World that came in 17th will get a bump the next night in World, up to 16th.No "world placements" are handed out to anyone in open. In other words, an open corps in this example will not make Semis because it isn't there on Friday when Semi spots are decided. They will know they may have been able to get there, but they are not eligible. In that case, both corps "win", since the top open corps knows where it stands, and the world corps doesn't miss out on its rightful semifinal spot. It is interesting to see how close the vote is on this idea. I'd like to see a few more people tell us how they feel about this concept. :) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluecoats88 Posted November 2, 2007 Share Posted November 2, 2007 If you were still cutting the corps down to a semi final number for friday then I might like this thought. but having all corps compete again on friday kinda just makes this a useless show. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drumcat Posted November 2, 2007 Author Share Posted November 2, 2007 If you were still cutting the corps down to a semi final number for friday then I might like this thought. but having all corps compete again on friday kinda just makes this a useless show. Are all shows before finals useless then? Do you have to vote someone off the island to be not a "waste"? I guess if you really wanted to, you could eliminate some QF corps from the show results, but I think that's a bad plan. Maybe SF is based on Friday's scores, but QF is a two-day average? I get your point, but I'd hardly call it a waste. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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