Why all Mellophones?

[G-horns]

that is a very strange combo...unbalanced...a good rule of thumb is to have as many baritones/euphoniums as sopranos (trumpets)...typcial set up:

Trumpets/sopranos=24

Mellophones=14

baritones=16

Euphoniums=8

Tuba/Contrabass=12

the high brass being top heavy is way unbalanced...the depth and volume come from mid to low brass.

So I guess Phantom Regiment breaks the rules by using all Euphs to get their nice sound.

IMO, the depth and volume are more dependant upon the key of the arrangement, the voicing of said arrangement and the tuning and intonation skills of the musicians. In an interview several years ago, Slide Hampton was asked how he got a small ensemble to sound huge. He told the interviewer that he'd write the harmonies with large intervals between voices and insist that the musicians play in tune.

[DaKman]

So I guess Phantom Regiment breaks the rules by using all Euphs to get their nice sound.

IMO, the depth and volume are more dependant upon the key of the arrangement, the voicing of said arrangement and the tuning and intonation skills of the musicians. In an interview several years ago, Slide Hampton was asked how he got a small ensemble to sound huge. He told the interviewer that he'd write the harmonies with large intervals between voices and insist that the musicians play in tune.

i wouldnt say they are breaking rules (there are no rules when it comes to outfitting your ensemble with whatever you think is best...just so long its not clarinets)...i would say in a perfect world, All euphoniums would be my choice....loud horns! but wimps beware...this is not a beginner horn

that is interesting about Slide's methods...espeically larger intervals....one of the Wayne Downey secrets is to write Jazz band method for the Blue Devils...octave doubling on trumpets...3 to 4 part Sax parts for mid voices, use baris/euphs for trombone/tuba...and tuba/contra for bass pattern. he also writes larger intervals with harmonic support in another brass family.

[JF_the_Elder]

This old French Horn player used the same mouthpiece he used for his concert horn.

I am beginning to wonder if anyone has actually tried to play a french horn in a contemporary drill show. There are some things that won't work like a very long step size but I think there's quite a bit that a french horn embouchure can survive.

Are there any recent junior corps french horn players out there?

well, if 94-97 is recent, then yes

[mchromik]

Interesting discussion. I think the secret to success of the all mello mid section lies with the arranger. To be honest I wasn't to enamored with the mello when I first came to it in 85' after spending a season on G Flugel. But in 86' Jim Prime became our arranger at Star and we were exposed to a different concept in middle voice. His love of the mello shows with his emphasis and use of the middle. Rather then interesting 'color' between the more important voices, the middle was brought up to at least equal footing with the soprano and tenor voices. It became more of a true brass choir. The middle became the place to be with demanding technical parts and wonderful melodic sections. Of course others had similar ideas but the arrangements Jimmer and Michael Klesch and the strong mello lines that played them in Star and The Cadets seem to have greatly influenced todays arrangers and brass instuctors.

Personally I think the all mello line makes the most sense because of it's flexability. The frenchie has a wonderful sound, but as pointed out is quite a challenge, especially with todays visual demands. The flugel is far easier, but doesn't seem to 'pop' like the mello or frenchie. The mello is a great compromise when played on a true mello mouthpiece and written for within its boundries. Dark and vaguely 'french horn-like' at times, Bright and somewhat Alto Sax like when called for. It all comes down to the arranger and horn line method. The combo of simplicity, availability, and flexability pretty much explain why the mello dominates todays lines. I can see using some other horns for solos or special circumstances, but the all mello setup seems to be the way to go middle-wise day in and day out.

[BMBob]

Well put.

[acockson]

Having marching French horns as a part of your middle horn presentation is almost impossible to argue successfully from a practical standpoint. They are generally not as powerful as the smaller and lighter mellophones, they are certainly more difficult to play (even if you manage to find one that is constructed properly), and they would probably tend to "muddy the waters" if treated incorrectly in scoring and application.

However...I don't think anyone has argued that they bring a remarkably different color to the tonal palette available to the discriminating composer/arranger. When we used them and I was carrying one, I think we did so to good effect, and we were certainly not the only ones to do so. (Anyone who wants to point out that this is the period before the meteoric rise in quality of Cavaliers brass performance is welcome to do so...the sound I'm describing is still there, i.e. beginning of Peterloo in '92.) Our guys balanced 8 horns against 6 mellos, as I recall, and let us know the places in the score where they wanted one or the other of the two solutions to take over. (Admittedly, most were pretty obvious...for example, anything faster than an 8th note, or the end of Gavorkna.) I'm going to gloss over the biggest problems, which were matching pitch and blending timbre on two COMPLETELY different approaches to filling in the middle of an ensemble, because I think I just explained how to take care of that (right before this...well, read it AGAIN.)

As far as general difficulty goes, I have two humble suggestions for the sceptical among you who would like to include these instruments in your program but are afraid of the result (or lack therof). FIRST, the cant in the leadpipe of my Kanstul KHB 185 was a revelation. One of my favorite pictures from my early band days is of my first high school show's closer...big finish, I'm the tip of Texas in the big U.S.A. formation out on the field, and my horn is actually pointing DOWN for the box pop.... How can you expect your kids to play well when such a basic thing is so radically different? Don't know if I can recommend bending mello pipes to accomodate normal horn players, since most of those are made out of tinfoil, but some accomodation would show vast improvements. SECOND, I spent both years flying around the DCI fields (yes I KNOW things have gotten even faster) with a Neil Sanders medium deep cup horn mouthpiece on the end of the horn. Anyone wishing to check out this phenomenon should visit Tom Greer at Moosewood Horn Requisites online. Radical alternative? Too different? No more so than a mellophone mouthpiece (if we can agree that the INNER diameter of the piece is the most important dimension.) Articulations aren't the best, but slurs are ridiculous, and you can bang it off your face all day and not have a problem.

Just some thoughts... Loved this post, looking forward to more!

[randomnoise]

Another point is that there are so many French Horn players out there that are being forced to play an instrument that is not currently being used in any concert ensemble. And many of them are forced to use a Mello mouthpiece that has no relevance to their major instrument.

[lowend]

One could also argue that if horn is that important to them, then they should be at Brevard or some such place over the summer instead of out on the field.

RE: Horn angles. I wonder how well a horn mouthpiece would respond if the shank were bent? There are quite a few jazz trumpet players that have their mouthpieces bent in the 10-12 degree range because they are downstream players and need to get their bells out toward the audience. Pat Hession with Maynard's band, and Chuck Findley are the two that I can think of right now.

[Shadow_7]

On the other side of the argument is that most marching french horns do not make good playing horns in general. I had a chance to play some Bb horns at DCI's semi's and the King Frenchie was a fairly nice horn. The yamaha french horn slotted so poorly I was left wondering why they even bothered putting valves on the thing. The King Euph was a nice playing horn, but was so awkward to hold I wouldn't want to march one. The Yamaha Euph was a decent playing horn and was much nicer to hold. Granted that I wasn't using my usual mouthpieces at the time so my first impressions could be a little off.

Having tried to march french horn last year, it is very prone to less than perfection. Especially when taking large strides, marching on bumpy turfs, or just being a little bit dehydrated. And being a downstreamer myself, a bend in the leadpipe to let you put your horn to the box without literally bending over backwards would be a good thing.

[BMBob]

I agree with lowend. If someone is on a serious track to do performance stuff on horn, then drum corps is not where he/she should be. He should be at Brevard or Interlochen or Tanglewood or something like that. While I was still considering horn performance in high school, I passed up ever marching corps because of this and instead was part of a chamber music and orchestral music camp at Florida State University. It was only after I had made the final decision to be a teacher that I marched corps. It gave me experience I could grow from in that field.