BeachDrums Posted January 26, 2005 Share Posted January 26, 2005 Hi all. The trumpet and I have just recently met (about five months ago), so please forgive my ignorance. Could you please tell me what are the signs of reduced flexibility? Perhaps more importantly, what causes it and how can one get it back. Thanks! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoonerMellophone Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 Tension and trying to use your chops to move between notes instead of using your air. Try leadpipe buzzing some expercises and make sure that every note sounds exactly the same. You will most likely find that you are moving the pitch all over the place and not staying in the center of the instrument. Remember that it is your tongue possition that (primarily, there are other factors) changes pitch and not your lips. Try playing some of the early Arban exercises (the ones that are moving quarter notes, 14 I think, but it could be 24. I don't have my arban handy.) without moving your jaw or chops at all. Its entirely possible and you will find your flexibility will increase dramaticly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ironlips Posted January 27, 2005 Share Posted January 27, 2005 If your symptoms include cracking a lot and missing partials even though you are practicing a lot, take a couple of days off and build back slowly. You haven't been playing that long and the musclature is not that well developed. If you play on damaged chops you will do more harm than good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lukehart Posted January 28, 2005 Share Posted January 28, 2005 If you give me some more info on how you practice...specifically in terms of amount of time you have your face on the horn it might help to figure out the cause... It may seem you’ve received 2 seemly contradictory replies from other posters but one or the other could be valid depending on your specific situation... basically....reduced flexibility can be due to overplaying....or coming back on the horn after a long period of time(practicing diligently for a week...then not touching the horn for a month)....if your situation is the later, then nothing more needs to be said except practice basic flexibility exercises on a consistent basis... Overplaying is a nasty thing...and something I can certainly relate to...it is especially common for people starting out on the instrument who are very enthusiastic about the horn. Even more common for people who are converting from a non-brass instrument who are used to the idea of "the more practice the better ill get"... Other instruments do not have to keep as close eye on overplaying as brass instruments...What start out as good intentions can have a very negative effect on your playing. A common analogy in brassland is that a mouthpiece on your face is like putting a turnakit(spelling?) on an arm or leg. You basically cut off blood circulation(oxygen) to the limb and over a relatively short amount of time the muscle tissue will begin to die. This is essentially what happens when the mouthpiece is on your face in playing position. The muscle tissue needs time to rebuild. If the muscle tissue consistently never has enough time to regenerate, the player will start to notice some very serious effects on his/her playing and develop reoccurring problems...it does not matter who you are or how good you are... Louie Armstrong, Freddie Hubbard, Miles Davis struggled with these problems...and thats only a small example....many people have quit... Miles didn’t touch the horn for 5 years.... Many young players are fortunate enough to have the opportunity to rest a bit more than those professionals... Some of the symptoms of overplaying could include: Double Buzz Decreased flexibility Decreased range Decreased stamina Painful sores/blemishes/burses/swelling Inconsistencies in playing (good day/bad day) How to fix: First, I would take it very easy on the horn for a little to let your muscles heal...the amount of time is dependant on the damage done…which does not seem like much in your case…. The next step is establishing a consistent practice schedule that will allow you not to develop these types of problems again. Muscles need a chance to rebuild...so alternating between heavy and light days with one day a week off the horn is a good idea. The amount of time you set should be a reasonable amount relative to each player. Other concepts that are often lost or ignored is to take the horn off the face as much as possible. If you have 1 bars of rest...take the horn off the face and let the blood flow return to the face...ever been to a Maynard concert? ever wonder why he talks forever inbetween songs? Its to get his (and his lead players) blood flowing back to the lips before the next song....some of the time he just flat out tells the audience hes killing time...lol...anyway...if you are doing an exercise....rest for exactly as long as you played before redoing or going on while taking frequent breaks (30 min on...an hour off type of thing) Understanding when you are playing longer than what your chops can take can be a bit tricky...and why this is such a common problem....the reason is that you don’t FEEL tired...its not like you just lifted weights or ran 5 miles...if you go until you actually feel hurt...it has been much too long…what you are feeling is probably moderate bruising or swelling....the only evidence is in your playing....when your playing starts to decline is when you know when to give it a rest.... I think by now you get my point and even if you feel this isn’t the reason for your decreased flexibility, I think others can benefit from reading the post....anyway...happy trumpeting -Daniel Lukehart Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walter Posted January 28, 2005 Share Posted January 28, 2005 (edited) Two rules about trying to play after a lengthy layoff, twenty or so years: :P 1. Don't try to play like you did when you marched even if you were a soloist, build your lip slowly. 2. Don't fortget rule #1. :sshh: For those who think they should be able to play like they did "back in the day". Edited January 28, 2005 by Old Dutch Boy Cadet Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeachDrums Posted January 28, 2005 Author Share Posted January 28, 2005 (edited) Overplaying is a nasty thing...and something I can certainly relate to...it is especially common for people starting out on the instrument who are very enthusiastic about the horn. Even more common for people who are converting from a non-brass instrument who are used to the idea of "the more practice the better ill getMuscles need a chance to rebuild...so alternating between heavy and light days with one day a week off the horn is a good idea. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Wow! Thank you for the post! As you stated, I am very enthusiastic about playing/learning the trumpet and I come from a history of drum playing. I DO think the more practice the better. I feel like I'm not working if I don't practice hard and perhaps, too long at this point in my learning. I ususally start out with about 15 minutes of long, low even tones. Then, I have been doing something I've never heard of anyone doing (though I'm sure others have) and that is clamping my lips down as hard as I can while blowing hard and trying to play a consistant, even, high tone as long as my air lasts. I do this about 10 times. My thinking is that it build chops and help me keep my lips together for the higher notes, when a smaller aperture is needed (and yes, faster air). Maybe this is totally a bad thing to do. I then play scales and pieces for a total of at least 1 1/2 hours a day. I didn't think this was too long to practice. However, I admit that I rarely take more than a minute rest between any thing I play. I feel like I'm cheating myself of practice time if I do. Anyway, lately, my lips feel kind of "puffy." They don't hurt and there are no sores or anything. But sometimes I actually play higher notes than I want to on pieces. In other words, my lips seem like maybe they're too firm. Does this information help? Okay, now you can scold me. Edited January 28, 2005 by GuitarMan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Murph Posted January 29, 2005 Share Posted January 29, 2005 Then, I have been doing something I've never heard of anyone doing (though I'm sure others have) and that is clamping my lips down as hard as I can while blowing hard and trying to play a consistant, even, high tone as long as my air lasts. I do this about 10 times. My thinking is that it build chops and help me keep my lips together for the higher notes, when a smaller aperture is needed (and yes, faster air). Maybe this is totally a bad thing to do. Stop trying to pinch off high notes. The way to range is long low tones and flexibilty. The lower you can play, the higher you will be able to play. It's all about the air. The flexibilty excersizes will build the chop muscles. The long low tones will build the air support. It takes more air to play low than to play high. Just my .02! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeachDrums Posted January 29, 2005 Author Share Posted January 29, 2005 Stop trying to pinch off high notes. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> Thanks for the reply, Stacy. As I've posted and as you can tell by my questions, I'm am quite green about learning to play the trumpet. I thought higher notes required a much smaller lip opening - the kind of opening one has when playing softly. I know it takes less air but much faster air for higher notes. How important are the muscles used to close the lips? If they are important, how does one exercise them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lukehart Posted January 29, 2005 Share Posted January 29, 2005 The psychological dependence on practicing is interesting thing....many people notice a decline in their playing abilities due to overplaying and attempt to cure it with more practicing....like you said..."I feel like im not working if I don’t practice hard"....I feel ya on this one... The puffiness in your lips is swelling....while it does not sound like it’s a terrible case of overplaying, listen to what your body is telling you. Give your chops a chance to rest for a few days....as with any swelling, a cold compress wrapped with a few paper towls (or a cold soda can) is a good option after your chops have cooled down to reduce swelling...don’t play for many hours after you do this As far as your practice routine, there is a seemingly unlimited amount of people that all have their own opinion on what is the most efficient/best way to practice... I think where you might be running into a problem is that you are not resting inbetween each exercise...2 hours is quite a long time to be playing with minimal rest...esp. when starting out. I enjoy doing other things while practicing like watching TV and playing on commercials....or replying to a DCP post....;-)....at very min. rest the time the exercise took. From experience ive learned that many of people switch to trumpet because they love lead trumpeting....which is great....however the tendency is to learn how to practice exercises at a dynamic no less than mf or mp....I would strongly recommend playing many of your exercises and long tones at PP... keeping tone and pitch consistent is very difficult at this level....especially when ascending into the upper register...It also lets you build muscle memory while being able to get more practice time in...take a very simple melody such as the beginning Arbans exercises that everybody is used to skipping over, and play it as quietly as possible with a legato tongue...quiet playing will help in numerous aspects of your playing and you tend to be made aware of exactly how you are tonguing and, more relevant to my point, how much pressure you are using...pressure is annoying little thing because you are usually not aware that you are using too much...applying too much will cause you to swell and fatigue prematurely...among other things...try it out...and ask yourself if you are really using only enough pressure to make a seal... As far as your practice routine I have some thoughts. It’s all about a balanced diet when playing... Here’s a story to share on this concept... the other day I was teaching(front ensemble) and the lead trumpet player from the high school was asking me for exercises...this guy is a great player with extraordinary range(A) for a high school student...I know that he only practices at loud dynamic levels because I can hear him in the practice room playing while I am teaching...when he was asking me for pointers I gave him a simple melody that couldn’t have been harder than twinkle twinkle....I told him to play it at absolute PP...his tone quality couldn’t have been better than that of a middle school trumpet player and articulation went out the door...he knew it too but the kicker is that he didn’t even know he was not capable of playing quietly...The concept of a balanced playing diet could have greatly aided him earlier in his development. Apply this concept to all levels of your playing...not only for the dynamic you practice at, but for the different types of exercises you play(tonguing, flexibility, tone ect)....set aside a given (and proportional) amount of time for each aspect...once you complete an aspect....rest, and come back and do the next... May I also suggest practicing without actually playing the horn....if you are into jazz...work on a jazz transcription....work on finger strength and dexterity...breathing exercises...there are just about 890235.3 fun things you can do while resting that would be great for your playing...I say I practice 6-8 hours a day...less than half that is on the horn... anyway...hope my comments were of some use -Daniel Lukehart Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BeachDrums Posted January 29, 2005 Author Share Posted January 29, 2005 Daniel, Thank you for taking so much time to respond and help me out. It will be difficult, but I will: *rest more between exercises and pretend I'm not cheating myself of practice time *play pp during some portion of my practice time (this will be hard for me because I'll always be thinking I'm not strengthening anything playing so softly, but at least I get more practice time in. But, if it helps "muscle memory," that's at least a benefit I can remind myself of. *Overall, I'll remember to remember dynamics during practice time *I'll work on other aspects of playing, such as fingering and reading music rhythm. *and, I'll try to include a lighter day once in a while. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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