Is a G hornline really louder?

[Jimisback]

Wouldn't that be funny?

Does anyone know how to contact them to do this? Great idea, Jimisback!

I just did it. Just look up Mythbusters on search. It is Discovery channel. I started a post on the Div 1 thread.

Here it is.

http://dsc.discovery.com/fansites/mythbusters/talk/talk.html

Edited May 18, 2007 by Jimisback

[torn8o]

The DB meter is a good idea, but not free. :P

Right you are.

I have actually found through the years that I prefer a slow taper on the bell section, it gives me good response, tone, and seems weirdly enough more open to me.

Hmmm. Odd. I mean, the more I think (as we discuss), the more convinced I become that the faster the taper, the more open the horn is. I mean it's physics. Larger space allows for more air to move through - and faster. Makes me wonder how much we are brass players rely on perception.

Now, my bugle, (that I now find is an imposter ^0^ ),has a fast taper, but seems to also have good response - must be the hard, chrome plating.

HAHAHAHA! We could go on forever. :) Again, I base my views on physics. The more space you have for the air to move (i.e. larger bore and bell), the faster the air moves through making it easier to play loud.

Enjoyable discussing this with you. :)

Edited May 18, 2007 by torn8o

[84BDsop]

Everyone send a messege to mythbusters. Lets get this over with.

Did it weeks ago...no response....

[Jimisback]

You would have to make a robot/machine that would play the horn at the same PSI at the same note. Then increase the PSI to increase volume to see what one is louder at the same pitch. Now, creating those false lips would be hard to do. I think, heavy duty rubber bands may work. I would love to do this study. Ha Ha.

[Martybucs]

Right you are.

Hmmm. Odd. I mean, the more I think (as we discuss), the more convinced I become that the faster the taper, the more open the horn is. I mean it's physics. Larger space allows for more air to move through - and faster. Makes me wonder how much we are brass players rely on perception.

HAHAHAHA! We could go on forever. :) Again, I base my views on physics. The more space you have for the air to move (i.e. larger bore and bell), the faster the air moves through making it easier to play loud.

Enjoyable discussing this with you. :)

There was an ITG article years ago similar to this. I think they found that there was a certain resistance that was needed in order to optimize the vibrations, (or some wording like that), and the stronger vibrations contributed as much to the volume of sound as did the volume of air used.

I think.

...'nother round, please.

[Jimisback]

And if they use the same air and lips, it will all come out in the end. Or the other I mean. :)

[Martybucs]

I'm guessing most concede that a G bugle can be louder than a Bb trumpet.

Since a lot of GE or whatever it's called these days, is in dynamic impact of the show, that impact can be increased by the relative loudness of the climax of a piece of music.

Does a corps playing a G line, potentially be noticeably louder at the hits and climax of the music than a line playing on Bb trumpets, have a competitive advantage?

One would think so.

[torn8o]

There was an ITG article years ago similar to this. I think they found that there was a certain resistance that was needed in order to optimize the vibrations, (or some wording like that), and the stronger vibrations contributed as much to the volume of sound as did the volume of air used.

I think.

A theory only and I don't buy it either because it goes against the physics of accoustics. Ever played in a very open concert hall or gym and then compared it to a more dead and compressed venue with more "resistance"? The more "open" the room, the liver the sound with more increace in DB levels. The smaller and more "resisted" room deadens the sound and lessons the DB levels. Just ask anyone who is a professional sound man.

The accoustics of a brass instrument don't work any differently. Accoustics are accoustics.

...'nother round, please.

Naaah. I'm done. My reasearch and experiments have me convinced. :) You are not going to change my mind and by the looks of things, I'm not going to change yours either.

Edited May 19, 2007 by torn8o

[Martybucs]

A theory only and I don't buy it either because it goes against the physics of accoustics. Ever played in a very open concert hall or gym and then compared it to a more dead and compressed venue with more "resistance"? The more "open" the room, the liver the sound with more increace in DB levels. The smaller and more "resisted" room deadens the sound and lessons the DB levels. Just ask anyone who is a professional sound man.

The accoustics of a brass instrument don't work any differently. Accoustics are accoustics.

Naaah. I'm done. My reasearch and experiments have me convinced. :) You are not going to change my mind and by the looks of things, I'm not going to change yours either.

Oh, I'm not trying to change your mind. I agree acoustics are acoustics, however sound production is something else. I think that the word they used was "resistance feedback", (or was it feedback resistance?). That a certain amount of feedback was necessary in order for the lips to continue vibrating with optimal efficiency. I don't think that would have an impact on the acoustic value though, just the sound production and if the production is optimized by resistance feedback then wouldn't the sound also be enhanced?

Aren't there at least two different, non human factors to consider? The actual production of the sound and the environment in which the hearing or perception of the sound occurs.

giddyup!

Edited May 19, 2007 by Martybucs

[murppie]

Now granted most of you have probably put a lot more thought into this, and I'm doing this when its late and I'm tired. However, I've always felt that on most of the DVDs and recordings I've heard using the Bb horns have sounded louder than those using the G bugles. Now this might be because of different recording styles/whatever. Just an observation.