MarimbasaurusRex

What's avante garde about a mic and an amp? Do something truly avant garde with those tools and people might actually like it. There's nothing avant garde in lecturing an audience about pimply teen angst. And besides, Avant Garde folded in 86.

The Musser carriers left a big T on the chest and shoulder stripes. And you could always tell who was using the Slingerland full front fiberglass carriers cuz they were all white in front and tan on the back with a white horizontal stripe across the shoulders. Either way, the blistered forearms were murder. There's just no tan like a drum corps tan.

Perfect pitch is a myth. There is pitch memory and some people are very good at it. But, if by perfect pitch you mean nailing A=440hz, go to Europe where the pitch standard is different. Or try another culture that doesn't use a pitch standard at all. Pitch is entirely relative. If you are "perfect" but out of tune with the ensemble (which, more often than not, will be "imperfect") things won't work out too well. In the studio world, there's a name for people with perfect pitch - "Out of the band."

To say John Cage's music "sucks" is to ignore every other composer who has been positively influenced by his work, including John Lennon, Steve Reich, and hundreds of others. Without Cage, would we have the music of Glass, Adams, Stockhausen, et al? Cage opened doors. One may choose to walk through them or not. In the case of drum corps, it might make more sense to move in a logical progression toward Cage's concepts before diving into the abyss. First, maybe a little Henry Cowell, Schoenberg, and others who paved the way.

How about 11 one minute segments from Indeterminacy? ...if you know so much about mushrooms, why did you take this class? I replied, Because there is so much about mushrooms I DON'T know... Now that's narration. Speaking of prepared piano, I'm working with a pianist these days who lived with Cage for a short time and is one of only a few to have personally consulted with him on piano preparations. Check out our MusiX page.

I started out in the Millcreek Y-Hi Steppers, bitter rivals of Gary Matzak and the Dal Demons who buried us every week. Did 3 years and probably would have never gone into drum corps without that experience. Later, in 82, I taught the drum line for Mirage from Scarborough Ontario and we won NBTA. That was a full line with veteran players from Oakland Crusaders, Seneca Optimists, Bridgemen and others.

To me, the biggest problem with extended narration is that it makes everything else into background music. If you want to hear the words, the words have to be prominent or they won't be understood and the point is lost. Another issue with narration is that words for the purpose of information are usually not very entertaining. If the text itself is entertaining and it is delivered well, then it could work beautifully, even if it still puts the corps in the background. The Zappa suggestion is a good illustration. It could work simply because the words themselves are entertaining. The music is also very demanding, even as accompaniment. But, what corps would do Zappa? The good stuff is a little raw. Although I'd love to hear Dangerous Kitchen on the field. I also doubt the Zappa's would go for permission to arrange in that way. According to Ed Mann (one of my teachers and an old friend), the family strongly discourages adaptation of his work. They won't even allow his band mates to use the original sheet music, they have to do it from memory. But, I digress... Get some entertaining text... I'd love to see what Bridgemen would have done with narration - A funny thing happened on the way to the stadium, ladies and germs... and narration could be a really fun element of the show. Take it too seriously and it just gets lame.

OK, make that dance leotards. You may not care what they are wearing, because you are used to it. But, many potential fans (and funding sources!) look at it with a big question mark. Why are KIDS carrying FAKE GUNS and DANCING around? It's a fair question asked by many many people who don't post on DCP or go to drum corps shows, but instead see that kind of stuff and just turn away. People here want drum corps to grow in popularity, but then don't want to accept the many reasons why it remains a "niche" activity that is harder and harder to justify and promote.

Did you see Blue Stars guard in 2006? Guess not.

I have no idea what Strom Thurmond has to do with it, but... two decades of nonsense = little growth, if any. I understand that drum corps people "get it," but many regular folks outside drum corps circles do not. It just looks odd to put a GUN in the hands of a person in a leotard or whatever. I'm talking real world perspective.

Drum corps is a competition first. The "show" is a byproduct. Don't we all check scores every day during the season? A vast majority of the discussion is about who is in what place and why. If a corps scores lower than hoped or expected, it's the topic of conversation for days or weeks (see Madison 07). With few exceptions, drum corps by design are almost forced to play to the judges first.

Dancing with a rifle in a chiffon dress makes no sense. Marching with a rifle in a military uniform makes perfect sense. Pick one or the other and run with it. You can't have it both ways. It's a case of drum corps wanting to be progressive and "arty" yet still be a "corps." The end product just becomes a bizarre mix that doesn't make sense.

Maybe you could clarify this or elaborate a bit? Seeing a lot of *I* and *MY corps* kind of approach here. All well and good, the best corps are guided by one solid creative leader (IMO), see Gail Royer. Just wondering about the particulars of how that works with a start up and all the help/people that will be needed to make it successful. Not meaning to step on toes, just hoping for a good start and a great corps from the valley. :)

If you go a little farther back in history, corps started in the end zone and the battery was more integrated into the overall drill, as was the color guard, although it was still pinwheels and stuff. It was only a window of about 10 years (maybe less?) that saw drums doing elevator drills. It should also be noted that the reason for only going up and down the 50 was not a lack of visual imagination but a desire to have the drums stand still to better execute intricate parts. (I know most folks in the historical forum know this stuff already, just mentioning it for the younguns who might wander in.) An additional note... Likewise, with regard to execution, symmetrical drills were not just because designers couldn't think of anything else. A symmetrical drill was considered more difficult and more "exposed" because it was easy to see if one side was off. This was especially true in the days before yard lines were used. Making both sides look exactly the same was quite a trick with no field markings to follow and credit was given on the score sheets for such things. It was all about the tick. The changes came as execution scoring was phased out.

Placing any kind of restrictions or limitations on the smaller corps just makes it harder for them. I would propose just the opposite of what's been suggested here. Lower the div 1 age to 21, raise the div 2 age to 23 and raise the div 3 age to 25, so that after someone ages out of div 1, if they want to continue to participate in DCI, they could do so by bringing their experience and maturity to a growing corps. I would also require that 50% of div 1 membership be from the corps home state or an adjacent state, with no such restriction for div 2 or 3. I would also suggest a return to the concept of "open class" where corps from every division may compete in quarter/semi finals and have a shot at finals.

Drum corps has become such a bizarre collection of disparate unrelated elements that it is beyond simple description. Best I've come up with over the years is "Field Ensemble," but that doesn't say much.

In N Out lost some of it's luster for me a few years ago when a big ole cockroach came crawling out of my fries. Blech! :sshh:

There was a LOT of complaint about the keyboards being too loud. I remember writing to DCN in response to a letter to the editor about it back in 76 or 77 (before I ever marched keyboards). I imagine some of those people might have had their heads explode if they knew keyboards would eventually be amplified on the sideline, all 10 of them!

The only controversy I recall was when they celebrated on the field after winning. It was the norm at the time to stand quietly with no expression in retreat, no matter what. Many of the older fans found them boring, especially after the Mangione years. A lot of fans were not into the extended tonalities of "heady" jazz stuff like Kenton. I also heard the "so clean they're boring" thing from some people. Not sure how that works, but for some fans their shows came off as a bit "dry" compared to corps playing more catchy music, at least until you saw them a few times and got to know the shows. Today it just seems normal, but at the time their sound was very "different." Either way, no one could deny that they were great year after year.

Think so. Can tell from the groovy 70's sideburns. Curt was my big brother in Phi Mu Alpha.

Kingsmen alumni wore them. They would know where to get a new one or might have an extra. I think it's fair to say that Mistress Kelli has earned a buckle or two in her drum corps career! And besides, lots of corps wore them back in the day. It's not just a Blue Stars thing. It's just a hunk of metal, guys. Lighten up.

I don't mind having performers talk to me, especially if it helps the show make more sense or adds to the concept. Unfortunately, it rarely does, and often that concept is lame to begin with. Obviously, the design of Cadets show was built around this ability to explain. The problem for me is this: I "got it" in the first minute and felt that they spent the next 10 minutes insulting my intelligence. We get it. I believe the Cadets talked too much. They keep talking about progress in their 1940's military academy garb. That's just BS. Come on. The Cadets were, in my opinion, the best group of performers on the field this year. But, I feel that the members' talents and abilities were USED by the Cadets administration and staff to further an agenda. Save the agenda for the board room and let the corps entertain. The narration did not entertain me. The corps did. The narration made me feel like they think I'm stupid. Some of it was just insipid. The delivery was VERY high school and often without any display of oratory skill. The content was largely unnecessary, except when it promoted the agenda. Any boob in the stands knows what a melody is, and they didn't even play anything melodic after the line The rest is just propoganda and whatever wasn't a political statement I felt was childish and sometimes condescending. I really think narration cost them a championship this year. But, I won't exclude others with similar problems. I felt Bluecoats used narration a little better, no agenda, but there was still too much of it. Again, WE GET IT, cops and robbers. Is that really so complex? Do we need to be whacked over the head with it again and again? I don't. Crown gets the most narration points from me because without it I may not have gotten the photo finish thing. But, the voice came out of nowhere, was jarring for a moment, and it was still too long. It ultimately added to my enjoyment of the show, but the whole horsey thing from the guard was way too literal. What is this? Fifth grade? At least Crown's narration highlighted something I would have otherwise missed. But, it also took away a little of my respect for one of the finest corps on the field. So far, in the last few years I have benefitted as an audience member from only about 2% of the narration I've heard. It's fine if it makes the show more cool or classy or entertaining. But, in my opinion, most of it comes off as a pseudo-intellectual attempt at entertainment. That might play fine in Bumfart, Kentucky, but not in LA.

Why does it matter to you so deeply whether some people like a particular corps or not that you feel you have to write a diatribe to attempt to "put them in their place"? Here's 3 lessons for you. 1. Get a life. 2. Different strokes for different folks. 3. Lighten up. I think most Academy honks weren't too far off in feeling that the corps was finals quality. Their score and the tight competition at that level all year attests to that. I'm as much an Academy fan as anyone because I like how they approach drum corps. But, personally, I think Blue Stars were better that night. Que sera. It's all good. HONK! HONK!

It's just amazing to me that, after all these years of putting the activity in the public spotlight, the "adults" of DCI still find a way to drop trou in front of the whole freakin world. Once you invite people to watch, you are in show business, and job one is to roll with the punches to produce a smooth and seemless event. Way to go.

It's just amazing to me that, after all these years of putting the activity in the public spotlight, the "adults" of DCI still find a way to drop trou in front of the whole freakin world. Once you invite people to watch, you are in show business, and job one is to roll with the punches to produce a smooth and seemless event. Way to go.