venkeman

And you thought people not cheering for corps they don't like is bad, people hate INT so much that they actually get up and leave when they take the field. Saw it with my own two eyes on several occasions. Honest.

Just to keep the fun going. From George's Facebook Page: ‎"2012 marks the 25th Anniversary of the Cadets Appalachian Spring show. Hmmmmm"

You're comparing Westshoremen to Cadets/YEA........ really? The biggest thing in the Cadets2 favor is that it can be marketed as a pathway to marching Cadets. Even if it just draws from the greater Lehigh Valley area, kids that may not quite have the skills or money to march Cadets will look at Cadets2 as a way to learn the Cadet way, improve their skills, and maybe showcase themselves to the staff (because the staffs are going to communicate).

DCA Junior Division: Make the age limit somewhere around 23 - 25. Market to that HS/College kid who can't afford to march DCI. And maybe expand into those areas that don't have a large contingent of all-age corps. Not only could they act as feeders for the all-age corps or even for new DCA corps, but it could provide more performing ensembles so you could have stand alone DCA shows instead of piggybacking on DCI shows. Just a thought.

(If the following point has already been stated and I missed it, I apologize.) IMHO there has been and is a division in DCI/DCA that is missing. We have World Class which is "full time" (7 days a week) junior corps. We have Open Clas which is "full time" junior corps with a more limited tour schedule. And we have DCA which is all-age weekends. What about junior corps that is just weekends, ie. the model that Cadets2 will be using, considering the age limit. I know some will say that those kids should just march a DCA corps. But what if they are looking for more of the DCI feel (kids there own age) and are turned off to DCA as being too old. (personally, I would have rather marched a Cadets2 type corps versus a DCA corps, ESP after the experience I had in a not-to-be-named DCA corps). I have read in other threads over the years about the shrinking number of corps and how the cost of running the corps have driven many under. Well, maybe this is the model for rejuvenating the activity. It will allow the junior aged kids to march and still work. It will also give the HS aged kids who can't march DCI, because of how early they start, another avenue to drum corps. And anything that gets more kids involved and more corps on the field can't be a bad thing. Again, just MHO.

:thumbup: D.) 87 is my favorite DC show ever. Please George, leave it alone. Thanks!

Point made about the top 17 not changing positions after PRELIMS, however there were changes in 19-25 from PRELIMS to semis (there were 25 corps in semis). Cascades and Vanguard Cadets flipped, Teal Sound and Mandarins flipped with Blue Devils B passing both of them. Now this can either be proof against slotting, or proof of slotting with the OC corps just confusing the issue.

The Demons take their characters a bit too far and decide that the Angels can not be allowed to win. Therefor they throw the show in favor of there fellow Devils!

Maybe you missed it, but someone busted into the Blue Devil bingo hall and stole the ATM. Thus the demons .......

Angels become confused and line up for the beginning of Blue Devils show. Demons throw a busted up ATM machine across the field.

I notice nobody is making a big deal about the fact that BD won GE Vis at the TOC finals, but finished 2nd behind Cadets at East. Cadets won GE Overall by .5 at East and TOC. So it sounds like the discussion should be (just to stir the pot) whether everyone else was scored too high. I wouldn't get too hyper about the TOC scores, because there is only one score that counts, and we'll get them Saturday night. And if the TOC scores have any influence on finals, after PRELIMS and semis, then DCI judging is in worse shape then everyone thought. (oh, and the TOC rcap is still up on the DCI website.)

The marching band camp is run by Vivace Productions (the same group that runs the Collegiate Marching Band Festval each fall at JB Crum). The camp was held last week. There were a couple years in the mid 90's when it was a DCA show.

I like what ever size is needed to accomplish to show concept. If that's 64, great. If it's 80, that's great too!

You already said that they DIDN'T field 150, and I say they did. So, while you haven't posted an exact number, I and disputing the info you did post. I know you're going to tell me that they only marched 4 because that is all that was on the field for finals. But they marched 5 for most of the season. That sort of puts an end to your entire argument. Again, if they didn't appear on the finals DVD then they don't count? Let me apply your theory to another scenario. "Major League Baseball obviously needs to reduce the numbers of players that each team can have on the rosters. I mean, how can it be a good thing if a team like the Boston Red Sox can only field a team of 12. Now some people have told me that they have a full roster of 25, but I watched the game and even taped it and stopped at several points and I could only count 12 different players." I've given you my answers to your initial 3 question hypothesis. Take it for what it is, my opinion. The only way you will get a credible answer to the 150 question is to talk to the corps directors and staffs yourself. I won't drop any names, but I did talk, briefly, to a couple about the decision on the number of horns they carried, and they all said it was their choice. And we're talking everything from 72 - 80. (And all the corps fielded 150 to start 2010.) So it had nothing to do with not being able to field the 150 max. From your arguments you seem to be opposed to the 150 rule because it hurts the smaller corps. That's fine. (Though you did say earlier that you were fine with 150.) Again, if raising the max from 135 to 150 has increased the number of kids marching world class, then I say it was successful even if they are all not carrying 150, for what ever reasons. You can keep arguing about what numbers appear or don't appear on the 2009 DVD's, but I need to go to work. Thanks to everyone for their great comments and opinions. Enough said. Have A Nice Day!

Oh, I have read all 40 of your previous posts. And I have enjoyed how you tear everyone apart who disagrees with what you want to say. And how you try to sqirm out of the question when your proven wrong. And while I was quoting the 2010 numbers, your 2009 numbers for Cadets are wrong. In '09 they marched 72 horns, 9/5/5 15 pit, 42 guard, 2 DM's. = 150. Now, again, you can come back and say that because of injuries they didn't have that number on the field at finals and only what they marched at finals counts, but for the majority of the season, those were the numbers ON THE FIELD! So they marched 150! And I would love to see you go up to a member who was injured and didn't march finals and tell them that they didn't count or wasn't part of the corps! Now, to get back to your original 3 questions: #1. A combination of A and C. Most corps are getting above the old 128 and many of those numbers are going into the guard. #2. Yes, the change was worth it. Even if the average # in each corps is 135 (I believe it is higher), that's 161 more young people who have the chance to march with a World Class corps. And even if it is just the top 5 or 6 that are reaching 150, that's still 110 to 132 more kids that get to march with the best of the best. Is that worth it, YES! #3. Is it fair the Yankees have a 206.7 million dollar payroll? Last time I checked, the DCI sheets didn't include points for the numbers of people in the corps. The corps that utilize their talents to the utmost and have in place good instructional staff and sound educational programs are going to achieve, no matter what their size. Otherwise, the assumption would be that the bigger you are the higher you finish. And that is just a canard. Now you can go ahead and tear apart my answers and say that I am wrong (you seem pretty good at that), but here's a challenge for you. Why don't you give well thought out answers to your own questions instead of posing them and then ripping everyone else apart. Have A Nice Day!