What do the Scouts need to do to become more competetive?

[Tom Brace]

It's interesting to see all of the ideas on here....some good...some not so good. I'll try to remember as many as possible.

1.) Sorry ladies...it ain't gonna happen.

2.) I believe I remember someone calling out the corps for being afraid of tradition. ARE YOU SERIOUS?! DID YOU EVEN WATCH THIS YEAR'S SHOW?! If you did...I must assume that you completely missed the COMPANY FRONT coming on to the field. Or maybe the 5 FLEUR DE LIS didn't jump out enough for you. Could it possibly be that you missed out on the HIGH MARK TIME after the hit in the closer. Finally, maybe you missed out on the MELLOPHONE LICK AT THE VERY END OF THE SHOW that was a throwback to the "good 'ole days". If you were at one of the shows that the Scouts happened to play the encore, did you not stick around or did you really miss out on the LAST NOTE OF ICE CASTLES? I hear it was held for something like a minute or a minute and a half in St. Peters, Missouri. The drum major even pulled his cell phone out and made a call (holding the phone up to the audience and the horn line before crescendoing again and finally cutting them off. Come on man...there is plenty of tradition in that corps. Maybe if you would've went out by their trailers after their performance (instead of watching corps 9-14) and talked to some of the members or gone to one of their rehearsals to observe what was going on instead of reading the rumor-mills....then maybe....just maybe you could see some tradition in that corps. Oh and I must appologize if you do happen to be blind and couldn't actually watch the show...but I guess that would be unneccessary at this point seeing as you couldn't be reading this right now. So I'll stick with my original statements.

3.) THE RIGHT STAFF! The instrumental staff were basically all new to the world of teaching in a drum corps setting and I dare to say that the greater percentage would say that the horn line (musically) was the strongest part of the show. The visual staff just needs time (and retention) so that their new style of teaching can be set and then there will not be variation in technique.

4.) As for not saying the drill writer's name...I'm not afraid to do it. His name is ALAN JOANIS and he wrote a terrible visual book. Kevin Nix was brought in to fix it all and I must say that it was much, much better.

5.) Did someone say play to the judges more than the crowd and Scouts in the same sentence? Wow...talk to the kids in the corps and talk to the staff...see who they'd rather please. 9 people in green shirts and khakis or the 40,000 screaming fans who may as well be throwing their own babies on to the field? I sure as hell know what I would pick.

That is all that I can remember at this point. Please feel free to write back with any and all comments. Thank you.

Wow...you make it sound like YOU actually have some decision making power and will store these ideas up...think about them and decide what to do next. I didn't know Jeff Spanos played mellophone in addition to the drums but hey, it wouldn't surprise me.

Just so you know the difference...the 2005 show...when you watch the DVD...that's a woman out there during the Madison show. Just helping you out. Sometimes a guy needs help with that sort of thing.

Now on to the rest of wht you posted...I was in Tempe and I pay my money to see drum corps shows not to hang out in the parking lot. I went to the Scouts trailer AFTER the show but all the members were gone...scattered to the winds and the In and Out Burger. I wanted to tell them thanks and I hoped the appreciated the treat my niece and I worked on all day Friday and into Saturday morning. We were glad to do it. It was her first drum corps show and she loved it.

Finally, you need to understand...the Scouts are very unique...they are a specialist in Darwin terms...Now before anyone gets all wierd about a Darwin reference...in this...I believe he is spot on...generalists tend to survive better than specialist. A species (from the same source word by the way) that depends their entire life on a particular plant to survive and fails to adapt...perishes. A generalist can survive on several different plants and so is therefore less suseptible to extinction.

The Scouts are currently a specialist. They draw from only 1/2 of all young people who audition (minus one woman from two years ago) and as such are at a competitive disadvantage from the audition standpoint.

So, it means they must work harder and make themselves more attractive to the men who wish to march there. Now...and I'm not saying that this is the person you would want in your corps, but let's face it...of the 1/2 you get to choose from a certain percentage want to pick a corps that has a high likelihood of winning. So, after this year's finish, you may not see many of these folks auditioning for Madison..and you might be ok with that...that's ok...right?

But then there's the guys out there that...I know..I can't believe I'm saying this...don't like the Madison Scouts. Then there are the guys who can't afford it. Then there are the guys who geographically can't make it. So we've cut the pie down further.

Finally, there are the guys who's chops just aren't there yet. The 3s we used to call them...or the Cs. They need more experience before they can make the Scouts.

So the question is...if you are so much in the decision making position...how many holes are going to need filling next year? And are there going to be more guys trying out this year for those holes than did last year.

Recruitment and Retention 101.

As far as the staff...I expect some changes this off season but no drastic ones. And finally...many of the 40,000 you speak of...most likely closer to 20,000...weren't even in their seats when Madison performed Thursday night. And no one got to see them Saturday when there were close to 35,000 in the seats.

So...quit the puffy chesting stuff and get back to work. There's much work still to do in Madison for 2008.

[Tom Brace]

Everything above me is exactly right. OK not exactly above me, two above me now. So the show didnt make finals, it was by far my second favorite madison show, next to 97. Give them time, thats all they need, I liked the show design, and the hornline was amazing. Give the young kids time.

Second to '97???

I've got some tapes for you to watch then.

[MJN]

3.) THE RIGHT STAFF! The instrumental staff were basically all new to the world of teaching in a drum corps setting

Roger Carter was basically new to the world of teaching in a drum corps setting??? That's news to me

[toddschultz]

3.) THE RIGHT STAFF! The instrumental staff were basically all new to the world of teaching in a drum corps setting and I dare to say that the greater percentage would say that the horn line (musically) was the strongest part of the show.

That is all that I can remember at this point. Please feel free to write back with any and all comments. Thank you.

I'm sorry, you must not know jack #### about their teaching staff this year. Because if you did, you would know that your wrong.

Sorry if i'm being an ########, but give me a break and no what your talking about before you make a statement like that.

[madalumni]

Now...what is anyone on DCP doing to help out? I'm sure someone smarter than me can name a huge number of ways each of us could help them out. Would that be a better thread? What can I do to help the Madison Scouts this year?

With apologies to John F. Kennedy....

"Ask not what your Madison Scouts can do for you. Ask what YOU can do for your Madison Scouts!" :)

And Tom - I missed you at Tempe by about 5 minutes. I was at the Scouts' souvee stand

talking to Mr. Spanos about 5 minutes before the big rain storm happened! :(

I'll have to get my Kiltlifter next year. :)

[Jim Anchower]

What does everyone think needs to happen to put Scouts back in to the top 12?

Same as any other corps.

Don't suck.

[MJN]

Same as any other corps.

Don't suck.

<**>

I would hardly say that they suck.

[vferrera]

2. Lazing on a Sunday Afternoon

Lazy Sunday - with narration. "The Chronic - what? -cles of Narnia" Awesome. The could call it "Laundry Day" :)

[Einstein On The Beach]

<**>

I would hardly say that they suck.

I wouldn't say that any corps "sucks" either, that's horridly low brow. However, the Scouts WERE really weak coming out of the gate this year. Not that scores and placements mean everything, you really can't control that, but corps should be doing everything they can to be high quality performing units.

[MJN]

I wouldn't say that any corps "sucks" either, that's horridly low brow. However, the Scouts WERE really weak coming out of the gate this year. Not that scores and placements mean everything, you really can't control that, but corps should be doing everything they can to be high quality performing units.

I agree - I keep thinking back to Open House in April. Before the corps played the show, a staff member (Matt Greg - I think), was talking about how this is the first year that when the design process started, they were going at both the visual and musical aspects from the start. I don't know what the process was prior to this year, but that sounded good to me. I'm assuming that at that point (April) that he was referring to the pre-show (at the time) Uninvited and how the corps got on the field. That turned into one of the cooler drill moments for many people over the course of the season.

So, in answering the OP's question, I keep wondering - at what point did the staff determine that almost the entire drill need to be redone? Was the original drill not done with enough time left before the season started to know that there were major problems? Does more of the show have to be done prior to move in?

Even if I knew the answers to those questions, would the Scouts have been more competitive? I keep thinking 'what if' - what if they had the show that they did at semi-finals at the start of the year? Would they have played their horns or drums better/cleaner? done their guard work better?? Marched better?? I don't know for sure, but we may not have had a topic like this.

I think this year that the Scouts had one of the best stories of the year. Many people here had them dead and buried. Many people have stated the the "Madison swagger" was back. I'm sure much will be learned from 2007 by the whole organization, and am looking forward to what 2008 brings. I hope the 15th place finish doesn't turn any 07 members away from coming back, or keep any potential members from auditioning. The Madison Scouts had one of my top 2 favorite shows this year (scores and placements don't hold much weight there for me). I hope everyone involved with that corps this year is as proud of those guys as I am.