Marching tympani & TimpToms

[Jim Nevermann]

Anyone remember the counter-weights that were on the Majestic Knights (MA) rigs?

I do! Drum Corps News ran a Moe Knox photo of their four-person tymp section back in 1967 or '68.

The two-per-person/drum counter-weights, if I remember correctly, were concrete-filled coffee cans with embedded metal poles, which somehow attached to the tymp shells up front. For each player, then, the poles would have been like railings on both sides of their bodies, with the poles running between the heavy weights in front and back. AND since the poles had no angular bracing to cancel the counter-weight's lateral movements, they must have bounced most annoyingly with each player's step. Remember: These were marching tympani!

Although marching tymps made the most musical sense, I always thought that double and, especially, triple bass drum sets looked much neater.

Edited March 10, 2009 by Jim Nevermann

[G-horns]

The last time I got that question, the kid who asked was playing on a marching drum without even knowing it. We had a set of four mismatched timpani and I asked him why he thought one had a hand crank instead of a pedal.

If my brain isn't too confused, I think Ludwig actually offered those crank models with the tuning guage for budget-minded school programs. Can anyone confirm that?

[Jim Nevermann]

I think Ludwig actually offered those crank models with the tuning guage for budget-minded school programs.

Ludwig did indeed, for years. Then, they simply added one leg rest assembly and two slightly larger than normal drum sling hooks to the fiberglass bowl versions, and voila': marching tympany!

[The Oz]

<snip>

However, on closer examination of that long-familiar photo, and your comment about "the other [smaller] rig", I now see that what I always THOUGHT was a demo-version of Ludwig's [then] new timp toms may, in fact, also have been a "homebrew". Why? Simple: Ludwig's timp toms [first manufactured in 1968, the same year as the photo] all had the same depth shells... which the pictured set clearly does not. The player's left drum shell is longer than the middle one.

So now, I wonder, did Flowers have that smaller set of triples custom-built from, say, drumset toms? Oz, since you were in that very drumline, what else do you recall about them... including, if you remember, the introduction of both size sets at practice? They must have raised more than a few eyebrows!

<snip again>

I can't remember the heritage of the smaller rig. (Insert age-related insulting comment here.)

I really want to say they were home brew, but the solid silver sparkle shell tells me that they didn't come from our retired inventory. If you look at the lugs, they appear to be designed from day one to have only one head. (Single-end lugs, no mounting holes towards the lower rim.)

It could well be that John Flowers received a demo set from Ludwig, or purchased some toms from them and bolted them together. The gentlemen playing them is Ron Grickes (sorry about the spelling). I don't see him on DCP, so this may remain a mystery.

By the way, some of you may recognize the tenor on the far right of the line - John Rozum.

[mobrien]

If my brain isn't too confused, I think Ludwig actually offered those crank models with the tuning guage for budget-minded school programs. Can anyone confirm that?

Yes. Machine tuned (hand cranked) tymps pre-dated drum corps use of them by at least ten years. I'm looking at a '57 Ludwig catalog, which announces them as new that year.

Some of the design features that made them attractive to the corps were already incorporated into the first Ludwig designs (the hand crank and retractable legs) - fiberglass construction came along several years later, which made them reasonable possibilities for being strapped on.

[G-horns]

I do! Drum Corps News ran a Moe Knox photo of their four-person tymp section back in 1967 or '68.

The two-per-person/drum counter-weights, if I remember correctly, were concrete-filled coffee cans with embedded metal poles, which somehow attached to the tymp shells up front. For each player, then, the poles would have been like railings on both sides of their bodies, with the poles running between the heavy weights in front and back. AND since the poles had no angular bracing to cancel the counter-weight's lateral movements, they must have bounced most annoyingly with each player's step. Remember: These were marching tympani!

Although marching tymps made the most musical sense, I always thought that double and, especially, triple bass drum sets looked much neater.

Of all the people to run into today at the New Haven, CT, St. Patty's Day Parade - Moe Knox with camera in hand. That guy never stops!

[BobB]

Jim Nevermann said:

"As for the Royal Airs' drumline, I do, now, remember a B&W ad in several issues of Drum Corps News featuring them with Ludwig tymps. Although why their drum instructor Mitch Markovitch [a former Cavie snare] didn't also add timptoms, I don't know."

Jim, I think one reason that the RA drumline stayed with single tenors was because they were one of the few that featured 'snare tenors' very effectively around that time. If you listen carefully to recordings, you'll hear them playing snare-like parts on tenor, using hard-felt mallets, or perhaps snare sticks or wooden tenors mallets wrapped with moleskin on the beads of the sticks.

....

The RoyalAirs simply weren't around any longer once timp-toms became the norm for most corps.

I remember the Royal Airs line well from '68--practically wore out my VFW recording of their show. Haven't listened to it in years, but for my money was probably the most musical line around that year. No timp toms, just 4 tympani, but it was the way they blended the tymps with the rest of the line that set them apart IMHO. As stated, the way they used tenors was a big part of it, too. Great writing by Markovich.

Related question--I wonder if anybody else remembers the Racine Scouts' attempt at "modernizing" their line in '68? They took two marching tympani, bolted them together, and had a guy (converted cymbal player) march the contraption. His "marching," tho, consisted of a trudge from the starting line to midfield, a lot of marking time (with the tympani half-grounded on 2 front legs), then another trudge to the end-line. Musically, well.........I don't think they even bothered with the tuning cranks....... Aside from that, tho, they had some great lines in the mid-to-late 60s.

[Storkysr]

Just browsed into this thread and totally enjoyed it all the way. Excellent info, Jim. You guys have great memories!

[Jim Nevermann]

...had a guy (converted cymbal player) march the contraption.

I taught & marched with Spirit of '76's drumline from 1975-79, and thus knew any number of ex-Scouts & Kilties [and Kenosha Kingsmen & Queensmen, etc]. But while I knew about that double marching tymp set, I don't remember now who played it. I'm sure I asked.

Was it "Lurch" possibly?

Edited March 27, 2009 by Jim Nevermann

[HornsUp]

while I knew about that double marching tymp set, I don't remember now who played it.....Was it "Lurch" possibly?

Naw, even Lurch ain't THAT crazy.

It was John Wilda. I ran across him last year, and he claims his back is none the worse for carrying that double tymp rig.

So of course I told him we have alumni corps now, and could give him a chance to do it again.