G-horns Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 I've had corps guys who read bari parts in Treble Clef (those would be transposed, like the other Bb parts) and also transposed tuba parts (for Bb fingerings); and then, on the other hand, legit players who read concert pitch, in Bass Clef. So, I routinely print the parts both ways. Sorta like the kid in school who started on trumpet and moves to baritone horn. They start reading treble clef baritone and are oblivious to the fact that their parts always need to be transposed by the arranger or the band director. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruckner8 Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 Not exactly. They are the same length, though. And the same fingerings (partials). So, they actually make a marching instrument in F, same length as current F Mello (6 feet), and call it a French Horn? I guess it's logical in an "F Alto" way (Schmidt triple), but that seems useless for outdoor activities. I wonder if they sound like Horns at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martybucs Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 Not being knowledgeable about tubas, what does it mean when you see BBb tuba or CC? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruckner8 Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 Not being knowledgeable about tubas, what does it mean when you see BBb tuba or CC? Just like trumpets in Bb or C...the Bb one is a step lower. (a little longer horn). The reason we use "BBb" or "CC" (two B or two C) stems from the fact that so many different tubas exist in multiple octaves that we got in the habit of calling the "lower ones" "Double-B-Flat" to differentiate it from the tenor tubas in Bb (bari/euphs). There is a "Triple B-Flat" Tuba (BBBb), an octave lower than today's tubas in Harvard's collection. http://images.google.com/images?hl=en&...mp;aq=f&oq= Note also that this practice of adding letters to denote lower octaves comes from old organ building methods, where they'd use C for "Great C" (two lines below bass staff...lowest key on organ keyboard...8-foot C...fundamental organ pitch!), CC for Contra C (octave lower...the fundamental of a CC tuba), CCC for sub-contra C, etc. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Middle_C Need anymore useless low brass or organ info? lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martybucs Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 Just like trumpets in Bb or C...the Bb one is a step lower. (a little longer horn).The reason we use "BBb" or "CC" (two B or two C) stems from the fact that so many different tubas exist in multiple octaves that we got in the habit of calling the "lower ones" "Double-B-Flat" to differentiate it from the tenor tubas in Bb (bari/euphs). There is a "Triple B-Flat" Tuba (BBBb), an octave lower than today's tubas in Harvard's collection. http://images.google.com/images?hl=en&...mp;aq=f&oq= Note also that this practice of adding letters to denote lower octaves comes from old organ building methods, where they'd use C for "Great C" (two lines below bass staff...lowest key on organ keyboard...8-foot C...fundamental organ pitch!), CC for Contra C (octave lower...the fundamental of a CC tuba), CCC for sub-contra C, etc. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Middle_C Need anymore useless low brass or organ info? lol Now, that was interesting. I clicked on the link for the BBBb tuba - that is insane! Can't imagine how hard it must be to play that bugger. Did you know that Galileo made his telescope from organ pipes? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MikeD Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 Did you know that Galileo made his telescope from organ pipes? Now THAT is the "Music of the Night" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martybucs Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 Now THAT is the "Music of the Night" It was the first playing of, "I Can See for Miles and Miles". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 Just like trumpets in Bb or C...the Bb one is a step lower. (a little longer horn).The reason we use "BBb" or "CC" (two B or two C) stems from the fact that so many different tubas exist in multiple octaves that we got in the habit of calling the "lower ones" "Double-B-Flat" to differentiate it from the tenor tubas in Bb (bari/euphs). There is a "Triple B-Flat" Tuba (BBBb), an octave lower than today's tubas in Harvard's collection. http://images.google.com/images?hl=en&...mp;aq=f&oq= Note also that this practice of adding letters to denote lower octaves comes from old organ building methods, where they'd use C for "Great C" (two lines below bass staff...lowest key on organ keyboard...8-foot C...fundamental organ pitch!), CC for Contra C (octave lower...the fundamental of a CC tuba), CCC for sub-contra C, etc. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Middle_C Need anymore useless low brass or organ info? lol The only big difference is that tuba music written for a particular key horn doesn't have to be transposed to be read by a different key horn, as bass clef doesn't transpose (as it's already technically a transposition). Don't forget the French C tenor tuba, a pitched a step above a euphonium. Do forget the Wagner "tuben," which is not a tuba. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brassomaniac Posted June 2, 2009 Share Posted June 2, 2009 Sorta like the kid in school who started on trumpet and moves to baritone horn. They start reading treble clef baritone and are oblivious to the fact that their parts always need to be transposed by the arranger or the band director. Exactly. The strangest part in the folder is the Tuba part transposed up a step, in Bass Clef, so players can use the trumpet fingerings they're used to, from bugle corps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruckner8 Posted June 3, 2009 Share Posted June 3, 2009 Exactly.The strangest part in the folder is the Tuba part transposed up a step, in Bass Clef, so players can use the trumpet fingerings they're used to, from bugle corps. I've never heard of that reason, lol. "C is played OPEN. PERIOD." Once and for all: Bass Clef Tuba parts are in C. The note written is the note sounded. If someone has made a custom part to solve a personal problem, that's cool! But you'll never see a commerically available piece for band or orchestra with bass clef transposed tuba parts! Sure enough, I *have* seen situations where Music Majors who play on CC Tuba in college, and then show up to camp (where BBb tubas are the only option), have a slight learning curve for the Bb fingerings! ("oops, Bb is open...not C anymore!) That lasts about 5 minutes. After all, they played on BBb tubas their entire lives before majoring in Tuba! They have to learn different fingerings for F Tuba and Eb Tuba too! (or learn to sight-transpose, like horn and trp players) It comes with the territory. Even if a composer specifies "F Tuba" (as I have done), the part and score will be in Bass Clef C. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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