Why would Cadets go from Pittsburgh to Buffalo for a clinic?

[And in first place~]

A silly question maybe but it has me baffled. I went to the show last night in Monroeville, PA at Gateway H.S. After I got home, I read where the Cadets were to travel to Buffalo after the show to do a clinic today, June 27. Yesterday morning, Hop checked the weather forecast for Buffalo, saw that rain was expected in Buffalo from 10:00 a.m. to 10:00 p.m. Consequently they decided to cancel the trip to Buffalo and stay at Hampton H.S., north of Pgh., today. So why would they go all the way from Pittsburgh to Buffalo just to do a clinic and practice? Their next show is in N.J. Friday night so it's not like they have a show anywhere near Buffalo. I'm just curious. With fuel costs and all I just don't see what the benefit is for them to go all the way up to Buffalo for a clinic. Especially when we so often hear or read about corps needing money-I know, I know corps have needed money since day one. I'm just wondering what I'm missing here. Looks like an all day rain here in the Pgh area today so the Cadets will have to deal with rain here as well. Not sure what corps do on rainy days. I don't think they could get much done outside.

[drilltech1]

I know nothing official but speculate based on knowing the Cadets, having dealt with Mr. Hopkins for years, and knowing NY.

The Cadets, through their base company, YEA, sponsor USBands, formerly known as USSBA, a high school marching band circuit of over several hundred units nationwide. Yet USBands, USSBA has little presence in the State of NY where Education Dept. rules from both the State government and from local boards of education put severe restrictions on high school travel and such. It is easier for a unit from, let's say L.I., to travel the nine hours to Buffalo than to leave the State of NY and travel 40 miles to NJ or CT, etc. (Remember charter bus companies charge more every time you cross a state boundary; something to do with federal rules, etc.)

For years, Hopkins has been trying to make inroads into NY marching band which is dominated by the NYS Field Band Conference with an annual championship each Halloween weekend at the Carrier Dome in Syracuse. For a while USSBA had a presence on L.I. (the most populous area of the State with 95 H.S. in 2 counties), but lost a good number of these bands to NYSFBC.

A clinic at the NFL stadium in Buffalo would allow entry into that end of NYS marching band population.

Additionally this year the Tournament of Champions' finale will be held in that stadium, a few days before DCI championships.

By having a clinic there, the Cadets would benefit from exposure to the stadium where they won the 1990 DCI championship. This would compensate for losing the opportunity to use Giants Stadium/Met Life Stadium at the Meadowlands.

BD uses the stadium at Minneapolis where the Regional will be held to host a clinic the day before the Regional. Yes, horn angles to the box are adjusted by BD just as I suspect that Cadets would do the same at Buffalo. Crown, Cavies, Cadets, etc. have rented the Papa John Stadium at Louisville at times for clinics, rehearsals, and adjustments for the same reason: a larger venue which allows the corps to prepare for their Dome appearences at Indy, Atlanta, San Antonio, etc.

This is all my speculation based on long time experience with the internals of these high level corps. A clinic for h.s. kids is more than just a clinic.

[charlie1223]

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Edited June 27, 2013 by charlie1223

[normy diploome]

I know nothing official but speculate based on knowing the Cadets, having dealt with Mr. Hopkins for years, and knowing NY.

The Cadets, through their base company, YEA, sponsor USBands, formerly known as USSBA, a high school marching band circuit of over several hundred units nationwide. Yet USBands, USSBA has little presence in the State of NY where Education Dept. rules from both the State government and from local boards of education put severe restrictions on high school travel and such. It is easier for a unit from, let's say L.I., to travel the nine hours to Buffalo than to leave the State of NY and travel 40 miles to NJ or CT, etc. (Remember charter bus companies charge more every time you cross a state boundary; something to do with federal rules, etc.)

For years, Hopkins has been trying to make inroads into NY marching band which is dominated by the NYS Field Band Conference with an annual championship each Halloween weekend at the Carrier Dome in Syracuse. For a while USSBA had a presence on L.I. (the most populous area of the State with 95 H.S. in 2 counties), but lost a good number of these bands to NYSFBC.

A clinic at the NFL stadium in Buffalo would allow entry into that end of NYS marching band population.

Additionally this year the Tournament of Champions' finale will be held in that stadium, a few days before DCI championships.

By having a clinic there, the Cadets would benefit from exposure to the stadium where they won the 1990 DCI championship. This would compensate for losing the opportunity to use Giants Stadium/Met Life Stadium at the Meadowlands.

BD uses the stadium at Minneapolis where the Regional will be held to host a clinic the day before the Regional. Yes, horn angles to the box are adjusted by BD just as I suspect that Cadets would do the same at Buffalo. Crown, Cavies, Cadets, etc. have rented the Papa John Stadium at Louisville at times for clinics, rehearsals, and adjustments for the same reason: a larger venue which allows the corps to prepare for their Dome appearences at Indy, Atlanta, San Antonio, etc.

This is all my speculation based on long time experience with the internals of these high level corps. A clinic for h.s. kids is more than just a clinic.

I would agree with much of what the above poster speculates. Such a move mimics what YEA has done in Texas where it now parallels UIL and BOA.

I don't dissuage any altruism that the reason for the clinic is to advance music education. The Cadets have benefitted by many marching members and alums over the years who have come from New York State, once an area rich in drum corps units of all levels including the DCI finalists Purple Lancers from Auburn and semi-finalists like the Watkins Glen Squires, The Long Island Kingsmen, and St. Ignatius All Girls. New York has numerous high schools, many with smaller bands. It is a ripe area for multiple harvests..

Edited June 27, 2013 by normy diploome

[And in first place~]

Drill tech, thank you. Now it makes sense. I thought there must be some benefit but did not know what it was.

Edited June 27, 2013 by And in first place~

[drilltech1]

Seems there is less rain at Hampton H.S. where the Cadets are still rehearsing than the four inches of rain forecast for Buffalo.

Mere rain does not deter a Cadets outside rehearsal...as long as no lightening, hurricanes, or monsoons.

https://twitter.com/TheCadets/status/350284339696787456/photo/1

[Quad Aces]

I posted something somewhat similar last year. IIRC, in the span of three days, there was a show in Lisle, IL and then all of the corps traveled way up north to Minnesota, then all the way back down to Rockford, IL (when Rockford and Lisle are about a little over an hour apart). If DCI set up the schedule differently, they could have gone from Lisle to Rockford to Minnesota, which would have made a lot more sense. I did the math, and I think doing it the way they did, each corps "wasted" something like 750 miles of fuel.

I wondered in that post how often this stuff actually happens when planning the summer tour.

[normy diploome]

I posted something somewhat similar last year. IIRC, in the span of three days, there was a show in Lisle, IL and then all of the corps traveled way up north to Minnesota, then all the way back down to Rockford, IL (when Rockford and Lisle are about a little over an hour apart). If DCI set up the schedule differently, they could have gone from Lisle to Rockford to Minnesota, which would have made a lot more sense. I did the math, and I think doing it the way they did, each corps "wasted" something like 750 miles of fuel.

I wondered in that post how often this stuff actually happens when planning the summer tour.

What seems logical to you may be off set if the stadiums are not all available in the same order, if the days of the week are not the ones which tend to draw larger audiences, and almost as important as the stadium availability, is housing available on the days requested. Sometimes these grave factors influence what seems as "wasteful."

Follow the tour cycle this year (2013) for Cadets, Boston, and the Eastern corps. DCI has them opening the season in Rockford (Cadets) and Akron/Bowling Green, zigging them around the Mideast states of Indiana and Ohio, and then heading back East where schools do not close until the last weeks of June. (Unlike the South and midwest, Summer doesn't start back East until the July fourth weekend, not Mother's Day.) Then the corps have to travel back through Ohio and Indiana on their way to Texas before coming back East a third time (Allentown) and then back to Indiana for DCI's. This tour movement made more sense when DCI's were not frozen at Indy.

Edited June 27, 2013 by normy diploome

[Quad Aces]

What seems logical to you may be off set if the stadiums are not all available in the same order, if the days of the week are not the ones which tend to draw larger audiences, and almost as important as the stadium availability, is housing available on the days requested. Sometimes these grave factors influence what seems as "wasteful."

Follow the tour cycle this year (2013) for Cadets, Boston, and the Eastern corps. DCI has them opening the season in Rockford (Cadets) and Akron/Bowling Green, zigging them around the Mideast states of Indiana and Ohio, and then heading back East where schools do not close until the last weeks of June. (Unlike the South and midwest, Summer doesn't start back East until the July fourth weekend, not Mother's Day.) Then the corps have to travel back through Ohio and Indiana on their way to Texas before coming back East a third time (Allentown) and then back to Indiana for DCI's. This tour movement made more sense when DCI's were not frozen at Indy.

True, but we're talking traveling 750 miles to essentially go only an hour away - that's pretty extreme. Since a lot of the non-regional shows are at high school stadiums, stadium availability probably isn't as much of an issue as it might be at a college stadium.

I understand that organizing the whole tour is a logistical nightmare, but I'm willing to bet there is more room for cost savings - especially with today's economy and the cost of fuel.

[drilltech1]

True, but we're talking traveling 750 miles to essentially go only an hour away - that's pretty extreme. Since a lot of the non-regional shows are at high school stadiums, stadium availability probably isn't as much of an issue as it might be at a college stadium.

I understand that organizing the whole tour is a logistical nightmare, but I'm willing to bet there is more room for cost savings - especially with today's economy and the cost of fuel.

Exactly!

Unfortunately, there is also the problem of precedent and custom. As currently done, certain shows are always certain days/times based on the regionals being always on certain weekends. Good luck trying to change them. Note the reaction to the shift of the Georgiadome show in Atlanta by one day (usually Saturday, this year Sunday.) That is an odd movement of the corps from Tenn. across the mountains to Charlotte, onto Atlanta, and then back north towards Allentown. The lack of availability of the larger shows held in the larger stadiums dictates the movement of the little shows. The weather factor (too hot in Texas!) also influences.

The whole system would have to be re-evaluated and re-staged rather than one mere weekend.