East Coast Jazz going to D1?

[Trumpetboy]

disagree.

Div1 has changes alot since 00, and so has Div 2.

Just b/c we're labeled Div2 doesn't mean we can't be competive with Div1 Corps. Magic 02, score of 99.05, ECJ 05 score of 97.45. Only 1.6 difference. I think Spartans and ECJ show was designed just as good, as any show in DIV 1. Personally I think some DIV 1 corps should take notes from all the shows from DIV 2/3 this year.

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I know what im talking about, my corps won D2 with a score in the high 90's went up to D1 with a much better show then our winning year in D2 and placed in the bottom 18 D1 corps. Don't go off Magic's score in 02 cause in their case they couldn't score any higher in D2. Magic was a FULL D1 corps in D2 and EVERYONE knew that, If Glassmen went down in D2 this year they would have scored only a couple points higher then ECJ and Spartans but had ECJ and Spartans gone up to D1 there would have been over a 10 point gap between the corps.

[mello118]

The East Coast Jazz could not possibly have hoped to place beyond bottom 8. I accept that what they did, although relatively easy from a marching and playing standpoint, they did at an EXCELLENT level. That said, I watched them, and I also watched Semis and Finals of Division 1. Hate to break it to you, but at least with the show they had this year, they would not have broken past prelims. Everything the Division 1 Corps were doing was so much harder on so many levels, and they did them just as well or better. When your only extended step sizes are when you don't play, when you sway into your sets, and when you perform with an overall immaturity, you cannot hope to plaace well among groups who, regardless of their level of excellence, perform without those crutches. This is not tintended to be offensive to any members of ECJ AT ALL. I am NOT in any way saying that you did not work your butts off all summer and walked onto the feild with a great product. But there have been very few Division II Corps who could ever stand in Division 1. I do not believe ECJ to be one of them.

[liebot]

do you want to see the trumpet book from this summer? or how about when jeff harper (a very, very, very well respected brass judge) said that our brass book was the best book in DCI, regardless of division? i understand you aren't trying to offend members of ECJ, and i'm not that offended, it's just that you're wrong on at least that one account - i can't speak to the other music captions and i can understand that our visual was limited compared to d1 corps... but i'm going to have to disagree with you on this one thing.

[MelloHorn13]

I know what im talking about, my corps won D2 with a score in the high 90's went up to D1 with a much better show then our winning year in D2 and placed in the bottom 18 D1 corps.

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This is what most people fail to realize.... not everyone in drum corps to win. Like I said before... they go up to Div 1 place last with a score of 12.85.. SO WHAT. Just more room to improve and get better in the future.

but had ECJ and Spartans gone up to D1 there would have been over a 10 point gap between the corps.

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Says who? you?

[mello118]

I can't say that I saw your Brass book. If Jeff Harper decides to make that decision, OK. I know he knows what he's talking about. But what I'm saying is that if you had implemented a stronger visual the brass may have not been so great. But I apologize for any offense I might have caused. As a member of a Division II Corps myself I may have a little bias, however I was attmpting to give what I believed were Strong and supported opinions. My apologies.

[MelloHorn13]

The East Coast Jazz could not possibly have hoped to place beyond bottom 8. I accept that what they did, although relatively easy from a marching and playing standpoint, they did at an EXCELLENT level. That said, I watched them, and I also watched Semis and Finals of Division 1. Hate to break it to you, but at least with the show they had this year, they would not have broken past prelims. Everything the Division 1 Corps were doing was so much harder on so many levels, and they did them just as well or better. When your only extended step sizes are when you don't play, when you sway into your sets, and when you perform with an overall immaturity, you cannot hope to plaace well among groups who, regardless of their level of excellence, perform without those crutches. This is not tintended to be offensive to any members of ECJ AT ALL. I am NOT in any way saying that you did not work your butts off all summer and walked onto the feild with a great product. But there have been very few Division II Corps who could ever stand in Division 1. I do not believe ECJ to be one of them.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Obviously you dont' what your talking about. Almost everything you've stated above is untrue or your not looking at things the way they are. There wasn't anything easy about what we played. If you want I could give my Trumpet book and you tell me what was easy about it. Maybe we just played our book so good you thought is was easy. B/c there's no way a small Div 2 corps can pull that stuff off right?

Visually, the show was written smart. Why try to march all over the field with 36 brass and then have balance issues? and who says the drill isn't challengin is the step size isn't extended. maybe it's the situation where we marched so well that it looked easy.

I know your not tring to offend anyone. But I'm not offended at all. Just think your not good at looking at show for what it is.

I honestly thought that ECJ and Spartans could have been very competitive in the ranks of DIV 1. We may not have the numbers, which isn't all that big of a deal, but we had the design, which most DIV 1 didn't have, and the talent.

Edited September 2, 2005 by MelloHorn13

[Trumpetboy]

Obviously you dont' what your talking about. Almost everything you've stated above is untrue or your not looking at things the way they are. There wasn't anything easy about what we played. If you want I could give my Trumpet book and you tell me what was easy about it. Maybe we just played our book so good you thought is was easy. B/c there's no way a small Div 2 corps can pull that stuff off right?

Visually, the show was written smart. Why try to march all over the field with 36 brass and then have balance issues? and who says the drill isn't challengin is the step size isn't extended.  maybe it's the situation where we marched so well that it looked easy.

I know your not tring to offend anyone. But I'm not offended at all. Just think your not good at looking at show for what it is.

I honestly thought that ECJ and Spartans could have been very competitive in the ranks of DIV 1.  We may not have the numbers, which isn't all that big of a deal, but we had the design, which most DIV 1 didn't have, and the talent.

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Don't be cocky just because you won D2, I really hope ECJ goes up to D1 next year so you can see what you are up against. It's ruff in D1 and unlike D2 these corps WILL NOT let down and there is no way you will understand it until you go through it. I KNOW! I won D2 and got all types of cocky, I thought we were hot stuff (which we were) up until we went to San Antonio and got slapped in the face and realized these corps are no joke. Go watch The Magic and see how amazing they are with a FULL corps, they would have made finals or been darn close to making finals a few years ago................ 21st place.

[MelloHorn13]

Don't be cocky just because you won D2, I really hope ECJ goes up to D1 next year so you can see what you are up against. It's ruff in D1 and unlike D2 these corps WILL NOT let down and there is no way you will understand it until you go through it. I KNOW! I won D2 and got all types of cocky, I thought we were hot stuff (which we were) up until we went to San Antonio and got slapped in the face and realized these corps are no joke. Go watch The Magic and see how amazing they are with a FULL corps, they would have made finals or been darn close to making finals a few years ago................ 21st place.

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Not being cocky,I could care less if we won.

And you make it seem like there's a HUGE difference between the two division when there's not. It's just all a label. And unfortunately alot of corps are under a label that doesn't get looked at as much as Div 1.

And you have you ask yourself. Is ECJ, or any Div 2, your corps? No one here, not even me, can predict what will happen if ECJ goes Div 1. Y

Edited September 2, 2005 by MelloHorn13

[Slow Adam]

Here's a thought.... Park and Blows add more to impacts, esp in Jazz shows. But really who sits and time all of the park and blows in a show.... really.

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The same people who held a stop watch to Cavaliers in 1997 to find out they played just over 8 minutes of music...

[wayne6]

Esperanza won D2 couple of years ago, and seeing them up against other D2 corps, they look unbeatable. The next year they declared D1 and for Esperanza, it's been an uphill battle just staying competitive with other corps from the 16-22 range. Don't get me wrong, Esperanza are still a top flight corps but competition is just tough with the so called lower D1 corps. One thing I notice about their membership is that since being a D1 corps, it's barley been at 100 with this year somewhere around ninety something. ECS should really think hard about the decision moving up, put if they can average about 117-125 members with the great staff they have, 11-15 place should be attainable in 2 years.