gottalovit

Does anyone know if Seymour Butts is returning to staff this year? I know he is alway active during INT's performances. I saw him at a couple of shows this year, but at that time according to him, they were still planning on doing the Helen Reddy tribute medley. I'm just not sure I understand why they would leave such a solid concept to do a Neil Diamond show, but I suppose if anyone could pull it off, it would be INT.

To start off, this is not to point fingers at anyone or blame anyone in particular for any given situation. This is just wondering how in the world something could come to this. Although on second thought, maybe there should be some blame put somewhere for these situations. I have always heard the horror stories of certain corps not providing balanced meals for their corps. I have heard that some corps were so poor, other corps food trucks were feeding them. I was at a souvie booth in Madison this year, and one of the girls working was telling me the corps she was in a few years back was so bad off, other corps had to feed them. I have a really good friend that has been involved with corps for over 45 years, and he said this used to be a very common thing. The corps he works with has helped feed many other corps over the years. So the question is, HOW IN THE HECK DOES IT GET THIS BAD? Where are the parents in all of this? How can the corps even be on the road if they don't have money for food? I am the last person to ever want to see a corps fold, but if the corps doesn't have money for food, or to get to the next location, what are you even doing out on the road? I mean, you are risking serious side effects having these young men and women marching in 100+ degree weather, and then not getting them the proper nutrition. I know no corps wants to fold, or quit early in the season and risk losing members in the upcoming years, but where is the concern for all the wonderful people involved? What are the corps directors, staff members, board members, volunteers and parents thinking during these situations? I think if a corps I was involved with ever had that kind of problem, I would want them to return home,( hopefully a few of the members would be able to fill last minute holes somewhere else), where they could focus on finances for the upcoming year/s. I honestly don't know how some of these kids even managed to function doing 12-14 hour days with little food. My heart goes out to these young members over the years that have had this happen. I just hope we don't hear horror stories like this again.

I love Crown because they are awesome. They have been steadily improving over the last 2 decades. I have loved every show of theirs except one(I wasn't thrilled with Bohemia-it was performed great, just didn't care for the music) I think their design team has done a fantastic job, and the people representing their corps have been amazing. Talking with their souvie people this year, all they cared about it seemed, was pleasing the fans. They weren't worried about scores or placements. I mean, I am sure they are excited to place well, but talking to them, they are more concerned on what we, the fans, want, more than what the judges like. I think they exhibit class on and off the field, and they put out some of the most enjoyable shows that I have seen in the last decade. The last 3 years, they have had a show that was in my top 4 favorites of the year. I remember preseason hearing and seeing clips of their 2008 show. I really thought this show was gonna bite the big one. I thought it was going to be lame and cheesy. I wasn't expecting to like it anywhere near as well as the last 2 years shows. But then I saw it live, and loved it, and saw it a week later, and loved it even more. This turned out to be one of the biggest and best surprises of the 2008 season. It also doesn't hurt that I used to live in the same town with 2 of their staff members. And having known of the class of this family since the late 80's, it doesn't surprise me to see them on staff with such a wonderful group representing DCI so well. Congrats to Crown and all they have accomplished over the last few years. I can't wait to see what they put on the field for next year.

Wow. I just listened to the rest of the 99 BOA CD and 2 bands did Blue Shades by Tichelli(SCV99 and Crossmen 99), and one of the bands that did it also did Boston Crusaders ballad from either 01 or 02, and Niagra Falls(Cavies 2000). And another band did Channel One Suite, and the exhibition college band did Blue Devils 94 Corea show.

This morning as I was sorting CD's, I ran across the 99 BOA championships CD. I hadn't really listened to this one since I bought it last year at the DCI Normal show. I get to the 2nd track, and I hear the SCV New Era show done by Center Grove IN, done a couple of years before SCV did it. And a few tracks later , I hear Plymouth Canton MI doing the closer by Bluecoats, a couple of years before Bluecoats did it. I guess maybe DCI corps are copying BOA just as much as the other way around. Whether or not the corps staff heard these before they wrote their show, or were oblivious to BOA , it was interesting. The New Era show was pretty close, including the New Era chant.

She was a very beautiful young woman, and I thought she did a very good job. I think her nerves may have shown a little her first year. I thought DCI was smart in getting someone fresh out of corps to help host the show. Yes Rondinaro and company know alot about the activity. Yes Cecario and DeLucia make the butt of alot of jokes. But I thought she was a wonderful addition, especially to our younger audience members. She brought a fresh perspective, as opposed to the old-fogey perspective. Not that both aren't appreciated. Another thing to consider on her stiffness. Remember what it is like to be down on the field in between performances. She is pulling drum majors/performers off right after the performance to interview them. And as you may remember from being down there, the noise level is very high, even between performances, as you have 10,000 plus people in the stands making general conversation between corps. So what alot of what you perceive as stiffness, may have been her trying to hear as she was interviewing the members of the corps. It's nowhere as easy as alot of people may think. I say bring back the young woman, she did a fine job.

Overall I thought 2007 was much better overall than 2008. The top 4 this year were great, but alot of corps such as Cadets, Bluecoats, Spirit, and Glassmen I just didn't feel were up to the level of their shows last year. This whole year just seemed to be missing something for me. But I am glad to see so many people enjoyed this whole year overall. Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed every single corps this year, like I do most years, but the level of excitement I normally feel just wasn't there this year, and it started early in the season. Normally there are 15 or 16 shows that just make me want to get their cd/dvd RIGHT NOW. This year there were only 7.

This has nothing to do with a personal view regarding Phantom. I have 2 very good friends that have marched with Phantom. I personally think their shows from the late 80's and early 90's are some amazing shows. If 93 Phantom were on the original list it would have placed higher than a couple of the championship shows of this decade. But this is all about this decade, so 08 Phantom to me isn't quite as good as the other 9 shows on this list. Just my opinion. But in all honesty, there are some absolutely amazing show this decade. But to me, and this is only my opinion, 2000 Cavaliers is the most amazing individual show I have ever seen performed. I don't expect anyone/everyone to agree with me. Yes the top 4 were great(although the top 4 from 2000 were even more amazing to me) but alot of the corps beneath them to me just didn't get me as excited as years past. Good shows, just not the same level of design as past years. so to me, it was the weakest year since 1995, from top to bottom.

I think the 2 biggest mistakes I saw since 2000 have been Cadets 08, and the Oliver show from Pioneer. Cadets 08 had potential to be a great show. Just too much narration. Totally took away from what could have been so many more great moments. Kids performed it very well, but one of the worst designed shows overall since 2000. Pioneer, the Oliver show(01 or 02?). Ok, so Pioneer usually ends up at the bottom scorewise, but they usually put on some great shows. This one was the poorest designed show of the decade. The music was extremely simple, and the drill was completely lacking. Not the kids fault, they performed what they were given well. But the designer of this show really missed the boat. One of the more noticeable flaws was the drum break. The hornline went and stood behind the doors. For almost a whole minute. This is the part where they could have had some really nice drill and saved part of the show, but no, they have the kids hidden behind the doors? I know Pioneer usually has the youngest corps on the field, but they deserved better than this show. Glad to see they have improved each year since then.

I thought 08 was the weakest year of any since the mid 90's, from top to bottom. I think they would rank in the following order. 1. Cavaliers 2000 2. Cavaliers 02 3. Cadets 05 4. Cadets 2000 5. Blue Devils 07 6. Cavaliers 06 7. Cavaliers 01 8. Blue Devils 03 9. Cavaliers 04 10. Phantom 08

So another marching band season is starting, and I know every year at least 1 or 2 marching bands are going to put out a direct resemblance to one or more of the corps shows. I remember the year Bluecoats did Ride, that fall at least 7 marching bands performed that song here in Iowa. In between 90 and 93, I saw no less than 21 versions of Phantom of the Opera. We have one band that does almost exact shows from corps. They did the exact One Hand One Heart of Blue Devils 98. They did an almost exact Fiddler of SCV 92. I haven't heard their musical selections yet from this year, but I'll bet it is a direct tribute(sounds better than ripoff) of a corps show. So what shows do you expect to be most copied this fall, or have you already heard of re-used musical selections that have already been announced? I have the feeling we will see at least one Samauri style show, and wouldn't be surprised if we saw a bicycle show as well. Also, which marching bands do you think have done the best shows taken directly off of a drum corps? My favorite so far was Bellevue West from Nebraska doing Cavaliers 2000 show in 02 or 03.

Maybe I didn't quite phrase it correctly. The current corps proper uniform with the skirt, reminded me of the old school guard uniforms, which were many times a variation of the old corps proper at that time.

Every time I saw Blue Devils, I kept thinking how much those uniforms with the skirt looked so much like when the guard uniforms were a variation of the corps proper uniform, with a twist. I remember in the 80s when most corps guards uniforms were just so similar to the regular uniform. And I could be mistaken, but didn't Blue Devils guard in the late 70's and early 80s use a black skirt as part of the their guard attire? I just kept waiting for the whole hornline to do a rifle toss on the 50. Overall a very nice effect though. My guess was this is a one year thing with the skirts?

Actually yes. The only corps I saw deserving of the win this year was Blue Devils. Their performance was much better than Cavaliers and Crown. Thursday night, the night of the interviews they actually had the top 4 in the right order. Actually they had most of the top 12 right, minus a couple of placements in the 8-10 range. The thing I am getting at, is they were proving the incompetency of the judging system itself. The inconsistencies are just staggering this year more than others even. Take a look at scores across the board, all year long. The spreads have been all over the place. Both in world class and open class. So either the judges are inconsistent, or they don't understand the criteria for judging. Yes, some corps are going to have off nights. But that shouldn't lower a score more than 3-4 tenths of a point, unless it is something major, and that would probably be noticeable to alot of the people in the audience, and brought up here on the boards on the occasion that it did. Read the boards from this year. This is the first year I have heard screaming for the firing of a judge. People are finally starting to track and notice some of the judging inconsistencies. Another comment on the boards that completely drives me nuts is this. A corps who places 5th or lower can't win a caption award. I have seen it countless times. The problem is, when that corps goes on, how does the judge from that caption know where that corps is going to place when there are still more corps to go on that night? That's just it, he/she DOES know. So how would you justify giving Bluecoats a 10 in percussion, if there are still 6 more corps competing that evening(that's an example, I am not saying Coats should have had a 10 in drums this year) If the Coats have the percussion section to do it, they should be awarded that perfect 10. If another corps performing later has a 10 as well, so be it. But each corps should receive the marks they earned, regardless of other corps performing. For example, let's say Spirit's brass is amazing and should be scoring a 9.8 or a 9.9 from the judge. They are seeded 15th coming in. Do you really think one of the judges is going to award them that score with 14 more corps to perform? NO Alot of people may disagree with me, but I honestly feel that caption awards should be given based on quarterfinals performances. Every corps performing should be able to win a caption award, regardless of whether or not they are in the top 12 corps. Granted, the top corps usually have the best hornlines, colorguards and drumlines, as well as show design. But occasionally you might just have a corps that happens to have one exceptional section, but the corps just isn't good enough overall to make the cut. Bottom line, the judges don't make the call, the call is already made for them. DCI, although a non-profit, still has to be run like a business, just like any corps does. So, the judges when actually asked questions, can't answer them because they simply don't understand the way judging should be done, were they actually doing it the way it was supposed to be done according to the sheets that DCI sets forth.

I am a huge Crossmen fan as well. I have loved so many of their shows over the years, and I would personally love to see them back in finals. This year, I just thought their show was a little rough. I really liked their show, but just from what I saw, I just didn't think it should have beaten the Colts, and from what I saw finals week, I would have had Colts very close in score to Scouts, a little higher than where they placed scorewise, and Crossmen a little lower scorewise than they placed. So I would personally have had them behind Colts, but ahead of Spirit by a little.

I am a huge Colts fan. I thought their show this year was awesome as well. Up until the last 2 weeks of the season, I would have definitely put Colts ahead of Scouts. However, the last couple of weeks, something changed for the better in Madison Scouts show. It finally gelled. Colts, while I thought their performance was great this last weekend, I really thought Madison had a little better show than Colts did. I really didn't see the level of improvement in Colts the last couple of weeks as the Madison Scouts showed. Now, how Crossmen managed to beat Colts I will never understand. I thought Crossmen and Spirit should have both been about 3 points back from Colts finals week.

Keep in mind I was in the theatre. There was very little applause for Phantom, and the 2 ladies a few rows down were talking about how bad their show was. These were the 2 ladies who kept laughing out loud during parts of Carolina Crown. I never did figure out what they were laughing at. Crown overall got the loudest applause of the night in our theatre, followed by Cavaliers, Blue Stars and then Santa Clara. These few corps were the only ones that recieved any kind of applause during the actual show, and not just at the end. The other corps received light applause at the end of their performances. Troopers actually received more applause during their clip, than the rest of these corps received for their entire performances.

PR had a great show. Epic, not really. As far as the year goes, I thought there were 4 great shows, a couple of very good shows, and the rest just good, or fell kind of flat. I give alot of credit to all the young performers out there, just felt the show designs were lacking. I remember going to the Madison show in late June. 13 of the World Class corps were there, and I was so excited going into it. After the show, I just felt let down. I wasn't excited by hardly anything on the field that evening. Cavaliers were awesome as always, and Crown really impressed me alot. I also really enjoyed Colts and Blue Stars that night. But the rest of the corps just left me flat. But for the first time in 16 years, I don't feel the need to order the DVD's/CD's when they come out. I enjoyed all the shows this year(even Cadets when I was able to block out the narration at quarterfinals). But I wasn't really overwhelmed by much.

I don't think it is mean, just truthful. I have been a judge for many events. As a judge, you have a certain set of criteria that has to be met to justify any score. Within that criteria is a variable for interpretation from the judge. As a judge it is up to you to be fair and unbiased, and it is up to you to be able to explain your position at any time. I know alot of people are going to be unhappy somewhere down the line at your position and scores, but they do have to be justified. So I think all of the judges questioned really missed the boat.

2008 was a good year, but not a great year. First of all, we were down to 43 corps in competition between the 2 classes. Secondly, I just wasn't blown away by anything on the field this year. Several corps had their best performances I have ever seen, including Blue Stars(I never saw their finals shows from the 70's live), and Carolina Crown. But alot of the shows, while enjoyable, just didn't excite me anywhere near the level of years past. Even the judges games amongst the top 4 during the season wasn't enough to get me pumped. I knew who was going to win before scores were in on Saturday. I knew the reasoning and logic behind it. As a businessman, I understand completely. As a fan, I am left bored and numb. Overall, from top to bottom, I thought this was one of the worst years in DCI history. I thought the kids did wonders with what they were given, but most corps were given shows that just weren't that great. I noticed it in the theatre especially. There wasn't much audience response. The only corps that received anything other than polite applause at the end were Crown, Blue Stars, Vanguard and Cavaliers. They received several moments of applause during the show. Blue Devils and Phantom received very little applause at the end, and they were the top 2 placing corps this year. Spirit, Glassmen, and Crossmen didn't receive but golf claps. I have to say, I am very glad I didn't spend the $180 in gas it would have cost me to drive to Bloomington this year.

Ok, I thought it was great that they interviewed the judges during the theatre broadcast on Thursday. After watching it, I was very surprised that DCI would even allow something like that. Did anybody notice how dumb and inconsistent these judges looked and sounded? When asked about different things, and how the judges were compared to each other, their answers were vague and distorted. And not one of them knew the first thing about judging. Not one of them knew the key word-CRITERIA. Not one judge uttered this word. Not one judge mentioned the criteria that is set for judging, and then how the judges react/acknowledge the performance as far as the judges sheets go-based on this criteria. Didn't anybody else watch these interviews and notice this? I think DCI just lost worlds of credibility by showing these incompetent interviews. This is the stuff they have been hiding behind for the last 20 years.

It isn't that I have anything against Phantom, but I honestly feel like their scores alot of years HAVE been a gift. There is now way in 2005 they should have had 3rd with that show. I was there live, and have watched it on video over 20 times. It was not a 3rd place show. There were at least 2 corps that should have beat them that year that didn't. 2006, there is no way that Faust was better than Godfather Part Blue. Sorry, it just wasn't. 2007 I probably would have had SCV a little ahead of Phantom, but the scores in 4th through 7th were so close that I can see any of those 4 corps placing in any of the 4 spots that year. This year, I know the audience really likes Phantom's Spartucus show, but it is definitely NOT better than Cavaliers. In 2007 I thought musically Phantom did have a better musical show than Cavies(which is rare), but in pure execution, Cavaliers were so much better. Same with this year. I can't understand how Phantom Guard is scoring anywhere near Crown, let alone beating them. There is obviously a push to get Phantom another ring, deserved or not(my opinion, that show is NOT worthy of a ring). However, even if it comes in 3rd or 4th(which it should), that doesn't mean people shouldn't like it any less. I personally think it is a great show, just not a top 2 show. Both Cavaliers and Blue Devils have what I would call championship shows. Great execution, great muscial and visual programs. It is also close, but I would put Crown ahead of Phantom in every category except drums. Colorguard to Crown by at least half a point. So, in what I have seen so far this week, I wouldn't be surprised to see Phantom win outright tonight. I probably won't agree with the decision. But as someone who has formerly judged many events, I have totally given up on the DCI judging community. I have to say I think it is as rigged as American Idol.

I wouldn't be completely surprised if the judges handed PR a gift tonight. They managed to beat Cavaliers even though they shouldn't have last night. I think they have a good chance of winning tonight even though they only deserve 3rd or 4th place.

LOL thanks for pointing that out. I did misphrase it didn't I. I mean, it has been obvious all season long that the judges had absolutely no clue in their scores. Between Debbie and Marie, along with all their cohorts, it has just been a weird season. I think DCI has just been having all this to get more attention to try to get more butts in the seats. I think they are just tired of everyone complaining all the time on how there is never any change in the top 5. As far as Crown beating Cavaliers, as much as I wouldn't mind that, I just don't quite think they have the show/performance to do it. This year anyway. But I would expect great things from them in the upcoming years. Now, I would think they could easily beat Cavies in colorguard, and possibly in brass performance this year.

A shaking up at the top could be a good thing, if it was deserved. To put Phantom at the top as a sympathy job(like 96), not good. Crown is deserving more than Phantom this year by far, from what I have seen. And their guard is getting royally banged. Their guard is FAR SUPERIOR to Phantom, not even in the same league. Phantom should be down at least 6 tenths to Crown in the guard caption. I think DCI is worried if they don't place Phantom in the top 2, they may lose them, as financially they are a wreck. The people on the board and the director don't have the common sense of a moth. Thus the lawsuit against them in the last 2 years for defaulting on their loan. Phantom means big bucks to DCI, especially with alot of Phantom alumni in the midwest, where finals will be held 7 of the next 9 years. So Phantom in 2nd means $$ to DCI. DCI, although a non-proft, is still nothing short of a business. I was talking with a good friend the other day who marched Phantom in the 90's. He said he didn't think it was right that Carolina Crown was using Phantoms old music. He also said the same thing when Colts and Pacific Crest used music in years past from an old Phantom show. Like he or Phantom owns the music or something. They pay for the copyrights just like any other corps.