torn8o

For the sake of those of you who think this whole thing is some sort of "joke" and not the real Blue Devils uniform, I spoke to Wayne Downey today and it is the real thing. The corps is very excited about it and the staff has some very specific reasons why they have chosen to go this rout with the look. I am not about to quote anyone directly, but siffice it to say - they know what they are doing - just like the Cadets knew what they were doing with their unusual looking uniform (that most people also didn't like) last year. In case anyone forgot, may I remind you all that a mass amount of DCP people also liked the Cadet's show last year? Indeed, you are all entitled to your opinions and I respect every one of them based on the various backgrounds that they all may come from. However, at some point we need to stop and realize that this is the 11 time DCI world champion Blue Devils that we are talking about. Surely, they have at least a clue what it takes to make their corps look good. So, maybe we should all just back off and watch what they do in 06. Then, form our opinions based on educated knowledge from experience (i.e. meaning how the new look will be experienced from within the activity itself during an active drum corps season). Just some FREINDLY suggestions to calm the storm a little bit.

- In 1988, people upchucked when they wore black jackets with grey pants, ESPECIALLY the "grey". Today, people look back at everything about the 1988 year (including the look) with the utmost in appreciation - even to the degree of being a favorite among drum corps planet. - in 1989, word went around that they were changing the uniform again. People hoped it would go back to the old or at LEAST have the color BLUE on it (funny, I think that even those who hated the 94 uniform at first would have been GLAD to see the 94 uniform that year simply for the sake of the colors). Now, people look back with kind of an "ehh...", but at least appreciate it. - 1990, another uniform change. Only this time blue jackets but more in the style of the 88 and 89 look with tux shirts under the V- cut...but oh wait...people upchucked then at the purple trim around the cumberbund. Then in 92 and 93 people criticized them for going BACK to the silver cumberbund and sash, some even to the point of saying it was too "old school" (drum corps fans are so fickle, aren't they). - in 1994, another uniform change. This time a radical one. Still blue jackets, still back pants, STILL EVEN A V-CUT but TOTALLY different from a face value standpoint. May I remind everyone that it was the most controversial and HATED change among the current BD fans of that time! Maybe even more than 88 and 89 ever was! What now though? The answer is that people now love it. You know what, I am just going to wait and trust that the staff knows what they are doing before I go mouthing an opinion. Especially when I am only looking at ONE...tenor player as opposed to the entire corps.

Another person who definitely knows what they are talking about. Think of it this way folks, Metallica concerts (or any other rock concerts) are not supposed to peak above 110DBs according to most hall regulations. So if you have been to a Metallica concert, you know what 110 is. PLENTY of people are walking away with ear damage. So, even if ears ARE being damaged by drum corps and marching bands, it's still most likely happening under 110DBs. In fact, according to a book I'm reading on sound right this very second, considerable hearing damage can occur at anything sustained over 95DBs for more than 5 minutes solid. Now, might there be exceptions? I think so. I would love to stand in front of the Renegades with a DB meter. I can't imagine at least SOME of their moments not being above 110DBs. I'd bet they do make it passed that at times. So, I MMMAY go to bat with the above poster on that one. :) Might we at least be able to consider the possibility of 112 on the intro of their 04 show? UGH! I know. Even as loud as the Renegades are, it's still a stretch, isn't it? :) 2 DBs louder than Metallica? Yikes, maybe not. Tell you what, I'll just stick with that assumption for now and then get back to you when I bring mine to the DCA championships in September. :)

- The highest reading the hornline has reached indoors was 114Dbs. This was in a VERY VERY SMALL high school cafeteria. - The highest reading outdoors while standing right in front of the brass arc has been 107DBs. - The highest reading while the corps is on the field doing music AND drill has been 99DBs (and if we were in a full sized stadium, it would be even less than that). It's important to understand that DB readings are not proportional. In other words, 110 DBs is about twice the volume of 100DBs. Then 115 DBs is TWICE that of 110. So anyone claiming to be above 120. Well...I've made my point clear on that. :P Oh, yeah. "Lead baritones". Okay. Well, while standing RIGHT in front of the lead baritones in the cafeteria recently, they managed to BRIEFLY (VERY briefly) hit 110DBs. Now, I was standing nearly on top of them when they did it but DANG!!!!!!!!!!!

In both corps I marched with - if people smoked...people smoked. Staff said nothing. Parent's who toured said nothing. No rules. No nothing. It was totally the member's choice. In Freelancers, there were usually only a small hand full. Not many at ALL actually. In Blue Devils, at least 70% of the entire corps. I was even one of them. Started when I joined the corps and stopped 6 months after I aged out.

Yeah, I can understand that. Again, it's just my style. And if he DID know me personally, he would know that I'm a little on the...oh...EXPRESSIVE side. :P My attempts to sometimes pour that personality out on a message forum may sometimes be easily misunderstood. I don't mean it to be a jerk. Leland, if you happen to turn your blocker off, I apologize. :)

Alright, I can see how perhaps the bold faced words could have made my post look more inflamatory than I meant for it to me. I guess it's just a matter of posting style. Perhaps I should learn how to use italics and underlines instead. That much is my bad and I apologize. But seriously, the name calling and insults do nothing to improve the dialog.

I just looked back at our dialog. All I see from my end is sharing information that I have learned from owning a DB meter myself. Then I look at your messages and all I see are personal attacks and insults. SOMEONE....HELP ME OUT HERE!

Dude, seriously. All I'm trying to do is explain what I have learned from OWNING one for the last number of months and doing numerous experiments and tests with it - along with READING info from professionals on the subject. Then you go off on a temper tantrum making insults and personal attacks on me. Why are you acting like this? It's totally uncalled for. "Inflammatory posts"? If you say so. All I did was share what I know about the subject.

Dude, really. I was not trying to be rude and I apologize if I came across that way. I'm just trying to make you aware of what you are saying based on first hand knowledge. RELAX! There is no need FOR YOU to resort in name calling and personal attacks. I didn't even come CLOSE to doing that to you.

So, this motivated me.... Guess what I just did???? Okay, I'll tell you. I just pulled out my DB meter. Then pulled out my trumpet. I set the DB meter ONE INCH FROM MY BELL (imagine my horn being right up to your ear) and the first thing I did was play my... Loudest possible middle C - 124 DBs Then... My loudest possible G above that - 126 DBs Then... My loudest possible high C - 125 DBs Then My loudest possible double G - 124 DBs And this guy ^^^ up there ^^^ says that the Marine Drum & Bugle Corps is 15 DBs louder than my horn being placed up to a person's ear while playing a high C as loud as possible??? So my question to Leland now is, where can we meet so that I can play one in your ear to give you something to compare that to? I don't think so. Maybe...EXACTLY that loud if you WERE indoors. THAT is believable. Not 135-141! No way! The guy who did the test either fed you a lap full of BS or your memory is a little off.

You are correct. And again, DB meters do not read above 130 ANYWAY NONE of them!

Exactly. Because as I said, the equivalent of a jet engine...AT 100 YARDS AWAY...is 120db. So yes, the so called "reading" of the Marine Drum & Bugle Corps is bogus. No offense to Leland.

HOGWASH!!!! IMPOSSIBLE!!!! Okay, since the time I started this thread, I have become the owner of one and have researched how they work extensively. What you wrote up there is absolutely impossible. 110 is the volume of a rock concert (think Metallica). 120 DBs is the volume of a jet engine taking off at 100 yards away. 130 is a gun shot at the distance of the HOLDER. Now, imagine a gun shot consistantly firing without wearing ear plugs for 10 minutes solid and YOU are saying that the Marine D&B corps is 11 dbs louder than that? And did I mention that DB levels are not proportinal. In other words, The distance between 105 and 110 is like the distance between 80-95. And that gap gets smaller the higher the DB level. There is no way in H. E. double hocky sticks that the Marine D&B corps was 11 DBs louder than a continuous gun fire HELD BY THE HOLDER! You would be instantly deaf - PERMENANTLY. Oh, and did I mention? There is not even a DB meter in existance that reads over 130 DBs So, I think you are....oh....just a little OFFFFF!

TWO people. Roger DeLoza - Freelancer Soprano soloist 87-89. Also one of my best friends and now unfortunately passed away. John Meehan - We ALL know who he is so I don't need to go into detail. He was actually an influence on me long before I ever even met him - during his BD soloist days while I was in Freelancers. This one was really more of a COVETEOUS influence. What it all boiled down to was me pointing to him during his 88 Old Black Magic solo and saying..."THAT guy right there has what I WANT!" (and a dream later to be fulfilled of being soprano soloist for the Blue Devils was born).

*sigh* This is always a tough thing to talk about publicly simply due to my history with the "first corps I marched with". At the time I was marching with the Freelancers, I would have "told" you a very confident "YES"! And indeed, the Freelancers were, are and always will be ONE OF my favorite corps. What I would NOT have told you at the time I was marching with the Freelancers is that I had a secret crush on the Blue Devils. Why did I keep that so secret? *sigh* *sigh* *sigh* *sigh* You would have had to have known the animosity much of the staff and leadership had for BD and the pressure (sometimes mentally threatening by CERTAIN individuals) the corps put on people not to leave Freelancers for that corps to understand why. Needless to say...Blue Devils always HAVE been and ALWAYS will be my #1 favorite DCI drum corps! So, yes. I "started" with...one OF...my favorite corps but aged out with my #1 favorite!

That was 89. And it was more of a "ch ch". So great. You voted for the wrong year. :P

In "Wings"?!?!?!? OMG!!!! YES!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I get goosbumps every time I listen to it. You know, there IS a little easter egg of ANOTHER recording of the Freelancers singing that piece that is NOT so good though... In 1990, we made that song into our corps song and put words to it. Very nice idea - but I wish we would have thought twice about singing it on a documentary that we did for the DCI telecast and recordings in 1990. If you go back to your Legacy DVD in 1990 and find this documentary, you will see and HEAR what I mean. YIKES! I keep waiting to hear dogs howl when I hear it. Rather embarrasing and not a recording that I am rather proud of in the context of recordings that I'm on. :sshh:

Three VERY INTERESTING examples of unplugged vocals in drum corps... VK 1984 - and it WAS drum speak and done very well. VK 1987 - Various voice overs in the drum solo. VK 1987 - Similar voice overs as 87 in the drum solo. I rather enjoy my recordings of EACH of these examples.

Michael J. Fox! I've been told by many people throughout my life that I resemble him. Personally, I DON'T see any similarities - but whatever. If he wasn't available or interested in the job... Henry Thomas! That's one other that I've been told a FEW times. More so when I was a kid. Kids at school used to always call me "Eliot the E.T. kid". At least that was what my "FRIENDS" called me. I was also called some other things by a few "OTHER" kids. We will leave those out, for now. :P

You have no idea how hard I'm laughing right now. Not AT you. Just at the irony of certain things that are just so well done and well hidden that common knowledge doesn't allow itself to fester. Guess what? Horn players play and have alwayes playd drums in Blast ALSO. ***extends hand for hand shake*** Hi, I'm Torn8o and I am a former trumpet soloist AND snare line member for one of the casts of Blast. :) I can also introduce you to people who did guard (visual ensemble) and brass, V.E. and percussion and even V.E., brass and percussion. That is what is cool about blast. If you have other talents and are skilled enough in them, you get to use them also - AND get paid more money because of it. :)

I know that. I wasn't directing my response at him. Just a general note to anyone who holds that stereotype against the corps.

Would you believe it if I told you that not EVERYBODY who has ever marched with the Blue Devils does or even ever has. Would you believe it if I told you that I don't? Nor did I when I marched? Nor have I ever in my entire life? WOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! BTW, I am not meaning to sound self righteous in any way by stating any of this nor am I personally criticizing anyone who does or ever has. It's mearly by personal choice that I don't and I have always loved my friends who did, do and have despite my personal choice on the issue. I'm just tired of the stereotypes. And just to confirm that I am not trying to be self righteous about it - allow me to serve record publicly that I sure did do my share of OTHER things when I marched that could AND PROBABLY SHOULD have got me in trouble. Things that were actually FAR WORSE! ;) Those of you who marched with me...SHUT UP! :P

Brass - Blue Devils! Visual - Cadets G.E. - Blue Devils because....THEY ARE GOING TO WIN THIS YEAR!!! Percussion - Blue Devils Guard - Tie Blue Devils/Cadets

I agree with that. But, it's pretty rare that drum corps is in enclosed venues. Even if you have a few domes in the mid season, you should center your design around where you are going to be most of the time and more importantly where you will be at DCI championships - which are outdoor venues. Even if DCI moves to Indianapolis, the new stadium is apparently going to be a dome that can open OR close. I'm sure for drum corps it will always be opened unless there is rain. In a nutshell, drum corps is not going "more and more enclosed venues". There are a few domes in the context of a drum corps tour - but only a few. A very small few and IMO not enough to constitute a more all around indoor focused sound.