jasgre2000

In the past 50 years, only about 15 (out of 120) D1A college football teams have won national championships. Being top heavy is certainly not unprecedented or unhealthy. In fact, it is quite common.

There really is a simple answer to why there are financial problems with some corps ... THE ECONOMY SUCKS. DCI is not unique in their problems. Nearly every similar organization, with the exception of the NFL, is having a hard time right now. Weather the storm, and things will get better.

Signed Carolina Crown. It doesn't happen overnight, but Crown has proved that you can go from 16th to 10th to 7th to 4th to 2nd . . . in a handful of years. The idea that corps are locked into certain positions, never to move up or down, is just not true. Corps can get better, and corps can get worse.

Couldn't agree more with these two points. Instead of sharing revenue based on some unscientific estimation of draw, give everyone an equivalent base appearance fee and then give cash prizes for placement ... like the PGA. As for advertising ... that is probably my biggest beef with DCI. I know people think that this is a niche activity that won't ever expand, but I think that is untrue. Drum Corps is exciting, moving, creative, artistic, culturally invigorating, etc. You can't tell me there aren't tens of thousands of people out there that wouldn't love going to a drum corps show, if they only knew what it was. If ordinary people will pay a significant amount of money to go to the opera or a ballet or modern dance recital, you can't tell me there aren't some that wouldn't pay to watch a DCI show, even if they haven't participated in drum corps. If the current smaller stadiums sell out, then move to a bigger stadium. I bet there are many college stadiums across the country that would allow DCI to move in for a reasonable fee. DCI needs to do a better job at marketing, and they need to do a better job at creating a promotional model that will allow people to taste DCI without paying an arm and a leg. And theater shows are not good enough. No theater show is even close to the experience of seeing a show live. If DCI can get more people in a stadium watching a live show, they will add a lot of new fans. Maybe they need to do some free or cheap exhibition shows, to widen the fan base. Not full competition performances, but give people a taste. There is a lot of untapped potential out there.

Crown is a perfect model for corps to follow, and proves that you can move up in this activity. The suggestion that the lower level WC corps are stuck there forever is just not true. They can move up, and as they become more competitive they will be rewarded with better financial stability.

That should be so, because the "stronger, richer corps" are the corps that are persuading people to pay a lot of money for tickets and internet streams. Which show do you think will have a larger audience? One featuring the Blue Devils, Cavaliers, and Cadets? or one featuring the Teal Sound, Pioneer, and Cascades? This is simple basic economics 101. Supply and demand.

I keep seeing people say that DCI should "look out" for all the corps. I'm not exactly sure what people mean by that. I certainly think that it is appropriate for there to be some basic financial oversight of corps, to protect the members from getting ripped off. My understanding is that the members have to pay quite a bit of money to participate in these corps. Are the members of Teal Sound going to get reimbursed? I hope so. I think it is entirely appropriate for DCI to have some financial disclosure requirements, and for corps to be required to show they can make it through a season financially. If we weren't talking about young people, I wouldn't care as much. Adults can bear the risk of dealing with financial problems. It isn't fair to put teenagers in that situation. With that said, I don't see how the financial auditing requirements can be that extensive. Auditing isn't cheap, and doing an in depth audit of every corps every year just doesn't make sense financially. Require the corps to disclose their financial state, and if they are caught filing inaccurate documents, penalize them in some way. To the extent that people are suggesting that DCI should be "acting collectively for the good of all the corps," that WILL be the downfall of DCI if that ever becomes the policy. I love it when people here compare DCI to the NFL, as if they are even close to comparable. They aren't. The NFL is the best run competitive league in the world, and no other league even comes close. There are certain things they do that are certainly worth emulating, but there are ALSO certain things they do that no other competitive league could do. Take "revenue sharing," for example. I have seen some throw that around as a solution to financial problems of some corps. It works in the NFL, why not DCI? It won't work for DCI because DCI doesn't make money. Revenue sharing in the NFL was implemented for the purpose of competitive balance, not for the purpose of increasing revenue throughout the NFL. When the NFL decided to share 75% of its revenue between all the teams, they didn't do it because they thought it would increase their profitability ... at least not directly. They did it because they believed parity would improve the sport. It worked wonderfully. The NFL is more competitively balanced than any other sports league in America. Teams from Green Bay Wisconsin and Buffalo New York can compete for Super Bowls for this reason. Over the long run, it has paid off and the parity made the sport more popular and probably even increased revenue league wide. Sounds like a great thing for DCI to do. The only problem is that DCI wouldn't survive five years if it did it. You see, taking money from the corps that are "getting by," and giving it to the corps that are poorly managed and "not getting by," just makes it harder for the teams that are "getting by" to continue to "get by." I don't think there are any corps that are raking in huge profits. Taxing those corps for the benefit of the others will only result in less financial stability for all. Revenue sharing will not work in an activity where every member organization is struggling to get by. Is regionalism a solution? I don't think so ... at least not formal regionalism. Many corps already limit their early tour schedule regionally. As far as I know (and I very well could not know), corps aren't forced to travel all over the country. If a corps can't afford to make a nationwide tour, then they should be smart enough not to do it. Let their membership know up front what the corps is able to do, and then be financially responsible. If you can't afford a tour on the other side of the country, like Boston and Phantom apparently could this year, don't try to do it. I don't think DCI needs to impose regionalism. Now, if DCI can make it easier for smaller corps to be competitive while staying close to home, then I am all for that. But DCI does not need to be the financial babysitter of these organizations. So what is the solution? This will sound harsh, but the solution is obvious. You let the corps that cannot survive financially fail. Propping up inefficient corps is akin to throwing money into a fire pit. It doesn't do any good for anyone, except for the corps that is dragging everyone else down. I don't think the Teal Sound is "too big to fail." It is economic darwinism. Letting the weak and inefficient corps fail allows room for other existing corps, and perhaps even new innovative corps, to succeed. This has been shown in the real world over and over again. Failure sucks for those involved, but it is not always a bad thing. Those that survive will get stronger. As long as there are some safeguards to protect the members of the corps, I think this is inevitable and healthy. Just to be clear, I am not trying to make accusations about the leadership of Teal Sound. Sometimes unforeseen, and unfair, events happen that cannot be overcome. Life isn't fair. Trying to make life fair doesn't usually work. That could very well be what happened in this case. Hopefully Teal Sound can pull their way out of their current situation and be stronger for it. If not, it will truly be a sad event. That doesn't mean it wasn't an inevitable or healthy event though. We shouldn't be throwing the baby out with the bath water here. I am also not trying to say that there isn't anything DCI could do to make it easier for corps to be financially sound. There are certainly many, and I have commented on them a couple times. I think the DCI business model could use a lot of improvements. End of rant (sorry).

I'm not sure I get your point. Are you seriously comparing DCI to the NFL? We are talking about what it will take to expand the fan base, are we not?

This is key and why DCI will never grow beyond its fanatical audience. As a new fan, who is very enthusiastic, I find the fact that I cannot see full shows without paying a minimum of $50 to be very off putting. I can't imagine what a less casual fan might think. The truth is, DCI's business model is messed up. You are not going to grow your fan base with such large barriers to entry. Basically, anyone that isn't enthusiastic enough to pay for the Fan Network is pretty unlikely to be a continuing fan of DCI. They may watch a theater show every once in a while, but it is just too hard to be a fan of something you can't see. Not that there is anything wrong with this. If DCI is doing fine financially (doubtful in this economy) and wants to keep its activity relatively exclusive, they are free to do so.

I'm not an electronics hater like some here, but I think it really hurts BK's show this year. I am normally a fan, but the electronics didn't blend well with the corps, and I think that is the problem. The sound is just so much different, and frankly, the electronics make the mistakes of the corps when they are playing stick out more. It isn't simply that they use electronics that bothered me, it was that they aren't using them effectively. At least not yet. Maybe it will improve by August. I love their music selection and loved the design of their drill, but the show as a whole just left me feeling kind of blah. That could be a function of them performing after Boston, SCV, Phantom, and Blue Devils at the show I was at. They just aren't up to that level yet.

Music from There Will Be Blood by Johnny Greenwood

Was at this show tonight. It was a blast! I have to say that I absolutely love the Blue Devils show this year, which is not something I have ever been able to say before. It wasn't something that would compel to get up and cheer, but I found it surprisingly compelling and fun to take in. They are going to be tough to beat this year.

I think you completely missed the point. No one is suggesting that all Drum Corps shows be made available for free on the internet. I am suggesting make a full show or two available for people that have never heard of drum corps before, so they can get a taste of it. There is nothing greedy about that.

This is not true. You can get rights holders to sign over rights for a free sample show. People do it all the time. It will costs some money, but you can do it.

1. Stop being so stingy with your intellectual property. I understand it may be difficult to deal with this issue, given the fact that you are dealing with many rights holders, but it is nearly impossible to see high quality video of full shows without paying a significant amount of money. What new fan is going to pay a good chunk of change for something that is relatively obscure and not seen before? Sometimes making money means giving some things away free. Give people an easy way to taste a decent sample of your product so they are willing to pay for more of it. 2. More shows in a larger variety of venues that showcase the top corps. As others have mentioned, have more shows throughout the season in larger population centers that feature all of the top 7-10 corps. I dont think the content of drum corps is the problem. The problem with growth is access and marketing. People simply dont know about it, and when they do know about it they are unlikely to have the opportunity to see the best shows except on a crappy internet stream that costs a lot of money. People arent going to cross those barriers to entry without already being predisposed to being an enthusiaistic fan, likely as a result of being in high school marching band. 3. Make your streaming content easier to access on more platforms. Switch to html5 so you can watch video on ipads and iphones. Create a roku app. I am fine paying for the content, but it would be nice to have it available in a more readily accessible format. Let me watch it on my 50" HD television. 4. This might be the most difficult and radical proposition, but I think drum corps would benefit a lot from associating itself with the intercollegiate system. It would probably mean a change in the age levels of participants, but I think associating with universities would help with marketing, fan base, fundraising, etc. I am not talking about football game half time sows (though that might be something that would be beneficial to growing the fanbase. I am talking about competitive drum corps between colleges, either on a school sponsored level (like NCAA sports) or on a non-official private club basis. I was in a college marching band, and while it was fun at times, I ultimately found it a waste of time. The biggest factor was lack of competition. No one had the commitment to excellence that comes with having the drive to win competitions. If colleges sponsored competitive drum corps, I think it would explode. I understand that this is very unlikely to ever even be considered, and would have a lot of drawbacks. It would certainly be something that the current corps would never do. It would have to be a whole new system. The problem with drum corps isnt that it isnt exciting or crowd pleasing. It is that no one is aware of it, and the new potential fans that become aware aren't going to pay the costs to become a fan. P.S. Just to give some context to my suggestions, I am a relatively new drum corps fan that has never participated in a corps. I had a great experience in high school marching band, which is why I am attracted to DCI. These are just some things I have noticed as I have tried to get more excited. Paying $55 to go to a show featuring only 2 or 3 top corps is a lot of money for a casual fan or new fan to pay.

Has someone else already ask this question? I'm sorry, I didn't see it anywhere. I guess you can ignore me if you would like.

Just an assumption on my part. I could be dead wrong. I don't think I am though.

I am new to DCP. I have been a casual fan of drum corp for a while, but never marched. I was in a very good high school marching band. After watching the DCI Championships this year and reading several of the thoughts on some of the shows, I had a question that I figured I would post a poll about. In the interest of full disclosure, I did not like the Blue Devils show at all this year. I did not find it entertaining or groundbreaking. I have heard some say that the Blue Devils executed their show at an incredible level. I'm sure that is the case. Was that the reason they won, or were other corps like the Cavaliers and Bluecoats performing at the same level? Was it the uniqueness of the show or the execution that gave the Blue Devils the gold medal this year?

I hope you are right, but I actually think the battle is just beginning. The renewal of Acheson was a shot across the bow, not a resolution of the standoff.

You could be right. If they do an upper level "band" thing, then there would be an easy way to differentiate DCI and keep it going.

I'll have to disagree with you there. Anything that is a "mess" for the top 7 corps in the organization (the corps that bring in a majority of the fans and sponsorships) is a "mess" for the organization.

You may be right that he is the right person to further the goals of the "NEW" DCI BoD, but do you really think a BoD that has no representatives from the top corps in the organization can really function? How is disregarding the views of the corps that bring the majority of the fans and sponsors going to bring unity and stability to an organization that seems pretty unstable right now? There is no way DCI can survive, in my opinion (I admittedly am new to the whole scene), unless both sides can resolve their differences and a new board can be formed that represents the points of view of everyone that is a member. The fact that the "NEW" board picked the very guy the top corps wanted to boot tells me that they aren't very interested in finding a resolution to the whole mess.

Do you think sponsors and fans would invest their time and resources into that over a group featuring the G7? Do you not think that several of those corps would jump over to a new organization that features the G7 in a second if they were invited? DCI may be viable if the G7 actually leaves, but it would be largely overshadowed by whatever the G7 will do. Don't know if they will actually leave, but the idea that DCI without the G7 will be as successful as it is now is just crazy. And the idea that a board without any G7 members selecting a CEO that has already been rejected by the G7 members is a sign of solidarity is similarly crazy. The DCI board members sans G7 are biting the hand that is feeding them. I don't think it makes any sense at all.