MikeD Posted December 10, 2007 Share Posted December 10, 2007 What does that have to do with the point we are discussing, which is that it was said that drum corps is not for the audience? Part of his quote is this... Some people complain about 1993 Star, but I've met a lot of people who love that year. Just like Cadets this year, and I know a lot of people who enjoy that show. His point, and I have said this as well...is that there is no single 'audience' POV. You may say DCI is not for YOU as an audience member, but you can not speak for The Audience as a whole. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrumCorpsFan27 Posted December 10, 2007 Share Posted December 10, 2007 You stated drum corps needs to consider the audience. Seeing how every year at every show, every drum corps will reach some people, and some people it won't, I asked what shows had everybody hating them, due to modernizing drum corps and the new rules. Also, what are some local shows that have had to stop being produced due to lack of audience. Wasn't it a few years there was suppose to be a Clifton, NJ show but it had to be moved due to the large ticket sales? IDK, I could be wrong, but I thought that's why it was moved. I made the statement to the poster who wrote that "drum corps is not showbusiness." My response was that part of the education members get, since the poster says that's what drum corps is for, is that music is performance for an audience. The two go together. I never said that corps aren't considering the audience, although I do wish they would consider them more when designing the scoring system. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drumcat Posted December 10, 2007 Author Share Posted December 10, 2007 I made the statement to the poster who wrote that "drum corps is not showbusiness." My response was that part of the education members get, since the poster says that's what drum corps is for, is that music is performance for an audience. The two go together. I never said that corps aren't considering the audience, although I do wish they would consider them more when designing the scoring system. +1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrumCorpsFan27 Posted December 10, 2007 Share Posted December 10, 2007 Part of his quote is this...His point, and I have said this as well...is that there is no single 'audience' POV. You may say DCI is not for YOU as an audience member, but you can not speak for The Audience as a whole. With this I agree. The point I was discussing was that a poster said that drum corps is NOT for the audience, that the only role of the audience is in watching what they do. That's bunk. Now, whether I have an appreciation (or lack of) to what corps are doing these days is not relevant to the question of do the corps consider the audience. So, he is trying to argue with me about something I was not discussing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ssorrell Posted December 10, 2007 Share Posted December 10, 2007 Is that really true? Im just asking, but i always remember being told that member dues were well under half of what we needed to get down the road. I guess it might vary from corps to corps, and now that i think about it, dues are probably the single biggest piece of income for the corps. Doesnt really change the argument anyway...just a thought If you figure that the some of the top corps member fees are $1500 or more, with now 150 members, that equates to $225,000 in income from fees, assuming that 100% of the membership pays 100% of their fees. For a top 3 or 4 corps and probably many other Div 1 corps, that is less than half of the annual expense budget. And, the top corps can and do have incomes from souvie sales that exceed this amount. So their membership fees, while a most important element of their revenue stream, is not necessarily the biggest source of income for the top corps. You're right, it doesn't change the argument...just clarifying... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarimbasaurusRex Posted December 10, 2007 Share Posted December 10, 2007 Ah, the ignorance of this statement. If drum corps is truly about music education, then part of the education is considering your audience. If there were no audience, there would be no drum corps. The two go hand-in-hand. Perhaps if drum corps was able to sell more tickets, they wouldn't need to depend on the members so much to fund the activity. I agree whole heartedly that audience consideration SHOULD be a large part of music education (Unfortunately, at this time it is not. Been to a block buster sold out student recital lately?). But, that doesn't make my statement ignorant. Ticket revenue does not drive drum corps as it drives professional sports or theater. You are welcome to prove me wrong. Also important to note that the mission statements of the various junior corps organizations make no mention of fans as customers, nor any intent to satisfy the desires of an audience. Mission statements clearly put the emphasis on providing experience for members. I'm not saying that's right or how I want it to be. But, them's the facts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrumCorpsFan27 Posted December 10, 2007 Share Posted December 10, 2007 I agree whole heartedly that audience consideration SHOULD be a large part of music education (Unfortunately, at this time it is not. Been to a block buster sold out student recital lately?). But, that doesn't make my statement ignorant. Ticket revenue does not drive drum corps as it drives professional sports or theater. You are welcome to prove me wrong.Also important to note that the mission statements of the various junior corps organizations make no mention of fans as customers, nor any intent to satisfy the desires of an audience. Mission statements clearly put the emphasis on providing experience for members. I'm not saying that's right or how I want it to be. But, them's the facts. I agree with you. I do think that the corps should have the audience as part of their mission. I'm not saying take away from what you want to give your members, just remeber your audience is part of the equation. So, I guess we are a lot closer in philosophy than we may have thought when we started this discussion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarimbasaurusRex Posted December 10, 2007 Share Posted December 10, 2007 ...when appearance fees (which comes from ticket sales) and even souvenir sales gave corps more income than other sources... I have to doubt whether there was ever a time when contest appearance fees amounted to the majority of a corps budget, at least among the leading corps since the beginning of the touring era. Bingo and other sources probably contributed a greater percentage. And member fees in Div 1 (sorry, World Class) are WAY higher than $1500 these days. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ssorrell Posted December 11, 2007 Share Posted December 11, 2007 (edited) I have to doubt whether there was ever a time when contest appearance fees amounted to the majority of a corps budget, at least among the leading corps since the beginning of the touring era. Bingo and other sources probably contributed a greater percentage. And member fees in Div 1 (sorry, World Class) are WAY higher than $1500 these days. Re-read my statement... I did NOT say that appearance fees accounted for a majority of a corps budget, but I did indicate that appearance fees were indeed a greater source of income than monies raised from membership dues at one time. How can you doubt that? Case in point...Spirit: 1983, 84, 85, for one example. Member dues were $400. Veterans of the corps paid $100 less for each year they marched, with a maximum veteran discount of $200. But heck, for the sake of argument, let's assume everyone paid $400. Our appearance fee for each show even then was $2000. We did roughly 30 shows; that would give us $60,000 in appearance fees. Our income from the dues of 128 members @$400 would be $51,200 (when in actuality it would be more around $40K with the veteran discounts). For corps that had a bingo operation, it surely was an important fund raising element and a significant part of the revenue for the corps. And souvennir sales for a top 6 corps could come close to equaling the amounts raised through membership dues. There really wasn't one source that gave some corps a majority of their income, but rather a conglomeration of revenues coming from many different angles. And about the $1500 member fees...I did say in my original post "$1500 or more", as even some of the top corps are still less than $2000. But still, if you figure $2000 per member at 150 members, that's $300K per anum, which is still less than half of the expense budget of some of the top corps, which was the point I was making. Edited December 11, 2007 by ssorrell Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hboyce Posted December 12, 2007 Share Posted December 12, 2007 I have to doubt whether there was ever a time when contest appearance fees amounted to the majority of a corps budget, at least among the leading corps since the beginning of the touring era. Bingo and other sources probably contributed a greater percentage. And member fees in Div 1 (sorry, World Class) are WAY higher than $1500 these days. Actually my member fees were exactly $1500 this year. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.