Meaghatron Posted July 3, 2008 Share Posted July 3, 2008 I think that kind of argument was made in reference to the idea that, once approved, electronics would de facto become "required" by the judges for a corps to succeed competitively. Hence, ALL the corps would have to have them, if they wanted to climb the ladder. NOT that simply having electronics would give an unfair advantage to the corps having them.The tool is just that, a tool. DCI allowed the use of Bb brass. That in and of itself didn't create an "unfair advantage". The claim has been made that their use is now required by the judging community, because they rewarded the corps who used them and didn't reward those who didn't. So, the judging created an "unfair advantage" for Bb. It might be subtle, but that distinction is important. Can the same happen for electronics? Maybe. Will it? We'll see. It is a subtle distinction. I have read posts that explain this fully, like yours, and others that have stayed with the simple "unfair advantage" explanation. Some people are more eloquent and clear with their words than others though. Thanks for giving a clear explanation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dale Bari Posted July 3, 2008 Share Posted July 3, 2008 Unexpected? I'm saying if acoustic drum corps really is superior to electronic drum corps, let's see the creative geniuses who support that theory put their bets on the table. Cavies' "Machine" showed you can be more creative and better without voice. Surely that's not the last shot if you believe in the creativity of the acoustic art. Put your best on the field and let it beat the electronic competition. That's a whole lot better than jawing about it on DCP as if electronics is some inexorable infection that will kill acoustic on contact.HH OK, now I get you. The reason that has not happened is because of what I have been pointing out for the last couple of days: amped voice has not been made a judging requirement. As soon as it is, then it will, as you say, "kill acoustic on contact." Just like happened with G vs Bb. (Of course, Yamaha helped that one along too.) We, as lowly DCP posters, cannot affect the shows that the creative teams assemble, except to reward the individual corps as best we can with our applause and donations/souvie purchases. You seem to be implying that we should just shut-up BECAUSE we can do no more. As for that idea, well, you know, there's that freedom of speech thing. (short of a gov't edict banning drum corps-related public conversation, someone will have a soap box somewhere for us to spout our opinions - just parry the inevitable <nagging teacher voice> "That only applies to the gov't" complaint.) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dale Bari Posted July 3, 2008 Share Posted July 3, 2008 No offense, but you'd be a poor spokesman for the group organizing the "shut up and play" serenades.HH Well, I'm not sure how you get that from the quote you showed, but, yes, my apathy level for crusades is pretty high. Sorry, I don't do grass-roots organizing. As many people love to point out, we fans have little influence on the direction of DCI. It's obvious that they'll do what they want, my opinion notwithstanding. If I were in charge, DCI would be somewhat different, but I'm not, so .... OK, so, yes I might join a "shut up and play" serenade, as you called it, but just don't put me in charge of it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Boo Posted July 3, 2008 Share Posted July 3, 2008 Mike, imagine a beautiful woman is giving you the best massage ever. One hour of pure bliss. Somwhere in the middle she rams a knitting needle between your 5th and 6th vertibrae. It's only a tiny thing compared to the whole massage, but will you go back again??? Well, if I was into that sort of thing... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glory Posted July 3, 2008 Share Posted July 3, 2008 Just like happened with G vs Bb. (Of course, Yamaha helped that one along too.) No way Bb was the result of judging. it was economics and ease all the way. HH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ApathyJones Posted July 3, 2008 Author Share Posted July 3, 2008 I don't think you're going to get a more authoritative answer than the one Hopkins made in the linked rules proposal. He observes that there are 2M band members and he believes that he can make them drum corps fans by presenting shows that are a superior version of the ones they perform.You may not agree, and you may have other theories about how to get new fans. But the linked article is a clear statement of the reasons why, from one of the major proponents of amps, voice, electronics, etc. What other answer are you looking for? Saying that a band kid would not be a fan of a DCI show unless it has amped vocals and electronics in it is asinine. Just because Hopkins says it doesn't make it valid. I don't know a single marching band kid who watches a drum corps show and says "Hmm, that is so different from my marching band show due to the lack of vocals and amplified saxophone solos that I can't relate and therefore I am not a fan of drum corps!" Do you HONESTLY believe that the two activities are so different that the only thing keeping 2M band members from becoming DCI fans is amped vocals and mic'ed kazoos? I would also argue that out of 2M band kids the number that would not be fans if they knew about and went to a DCI show would be a VERY small cross section. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShortAndFast Posted July 3, 2008 Share Posted July 3, 2008 Saying that a band kid would not be a fan of a DCI show unless it has amped vocals and electronics in it is asinine. Just because Hopkins says it doesn't make it valid. I don't know a single marching band kid who watches a drum corps show and says "Hmm, that is so different from my marching band show due to the lack of vocals and amplified saxophone solos that I can't relate and therefore I am not a fan of drum corps!" Do you HONESTLY believe that the two activities are so different that the only thing keeping 2M band members from becoming DCI fans is amped vocals and mic'ed kazoos? I would also argue that out of 2M band kids the number that would not be fans if they knew about and went to a DCI show would be a VERY small cross section. Ah, I see. You don't actually want to know, as you asked in your OP, "Where does this logic come from?" You want to argue about whether the logic is right or not. I'm not in any way involved in DCI Marketing, so I don't have much of an opinion on the matter. Maybe you should send an email to Hop or to Dan Acheson to share your insights? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Piper Posted July 3, 2008 Share Posted July 3, 2008 Why a DCI corps who's average age in 2007 was 19.4 would want to emulate a HS band defies my comprehention. Maybe their staff is either too young or too old. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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