DUTless drumming

[elmhurstmusiced]

I'm done...

So much to learn

Edited September 11, 2008 by elmhurstmusiced

[whitedawn]

OK. Maybe I'm just ignorant but what the heck does a DM have to do with this discussion? With all the tempo changes and movement, and a person on the field on a stand or podium or whatever. I'm with whomever said that if months of practice doesn't get you in tune and in time with those around you - gee, I don't know. Of course, as someone else has also said I'm from "the only person on the field that could make a sound with his or her mouth was the DM. They also set the tempo of the show as well - by marching.

Really.

Puppet

yeah i get all that, but the "modern" trend, if you will, is for the drum major to conduct exactly with the drumline (more specifically, the center snare's feet), and for the hornline to watch the drum major. essentially, the drumline is the tempo, and the drum major is fitting the horns in with the battery sound.

in a case where the drums are playing, but not the horns, and not all of the horns can see the drum major (this happens -- a lot), you would have a few horn players dut so that the horns who can't see can enter on time.

months of practice isn't going to fix a blind direction change and entrance at 186. the best you could do without dutting would be to either "guess" (bad idea) or "react" (worse idea).

[BigBoom]

....the best you could do without dutting would be to either "guess" (bad idea) or "react" (worse idea).

Or......"feel" and "groove." These are perhaps the most overlooked aspects of the drum corps musical experience.

Boom

[big old drummer man]

ok.

in today's high level marching activity (dci, wgi, dca, boa, etc) there are certain environmental situations where in order for the drumline to enter together from an ensemble front-to-back fashion, dutting is necessary. when the battery is back field or out on the side or both, coming in after tacit, the time given by the drum major is inaccurate. when the drumline is staged in one of those areas, playing WITH the drum major's time, they sound behind to the box. so in order to enter in time, the drumline usually gets time from duts that are placed just in front of the dm's downbeats. it isn't logical to expect the whole battery to interpret playing "ahead of the beat" exactly the same, so duts are used to unify the tempo before they enter. trust me. i've been there. i've marched. i've dutted. i've attacked clean.

dutting is not a crutch. it is a preventive tool to proactively clean ticks. don't tell me it's a crutch until you've been asked to play clean in the same environmental demands as today's top level drumlines.

now as far as YELLING duts, so that they are plainly heard from the box... that's lame.

[pearlsnaredrummer77]

I think the loud yelling of dut-dut is just a fad. A lot of people marching think it sounds cool for some reason. When the next drumline that comes along that plays ungodly clean and is verbally silent, the trend will move back the other way. Hopefully someone will be inspired by this thread and innovate.

[sday88]

I just wish some people had the nerve to walk Up to Scott Johnson, or Jim Casella, or Murray Gusseck, or Tom Aungst and tell them they are doing it wrong.

I'll do it. Where are they? Bring 'em on.

[sday88]

when the battery is back field or out on the side or both, coming in after tacit, the time given by the drum major is inaccurate. when the drumline is staged in one of those areas, playing WITH the drum major's time, they sound behind to the box. so in order to enter in time, the drumline usually gets time from duts that are placed just in front of the dm's downbeats. it isn't logical to expect the whole battery to interpret playing "ahead of the beat" exactly the same, so duts are used to unify the tempo before they enter. trust me. i've been there. i've marched. i've dutted. i've attacked clean.

I've seen this type of thing mentioned here before. This is the most ridiculous thing I've ever read. You're telling me that today's drum corps are filled with not only music majors but physics and math wizards also? To be able to figure out how early/late one needs to dut depending on where they are on the field, the temperature, the humidity, the way the wind is blowing, etc., would take someone with Einstein's IQ. It ain't gonna happen with any kind of certainty or consistency to be noticed any more than just watching the major. And even if you did do it, the sound would be together at let's say the box, but then it wouldn't be together in the first row. With the way sound travels and the limited mentality of the people in the stands, no one is going to hear any difference.

[K-Swiss]

I've seen this type of thing mentioned here before. This is the most ridiculous thing I've ever read. You're telling me that today's drum corps are filled with not only music majors but physics and math wizards also? To be able to figure out how early/late one needs to dut depending on where they are on the field, the temperature, the humidity, the way the wind is blowing, etc., would take someone with Einstein's IQ.

or months of practice

[sday88]

or months of practice

So you're telling me that months of practice take into the temperature, humidity, wind speed and direction, etc. from night to night? That's amazing! I better alert NASA, they've got a lot of potential employees in the drum corps ranks. Not possible.

[Slow Adam]

I've seen this type of thing mentioned here before. This is the most ridiculous thing I've ever read. You're telling me that today's drum corps are filled with not only music majors but physics and math wizards also? To be able to figure out how early/late one needs to dut depending on where they are on the field, the temperature, the humidity, the way the wind is blowing, etc., would take someone with Einstein's IQ. It ain't gonna happen with any kind of certainty or consistency to be noticed any more than just watching the major. And even if you did do it, the sound would be together at let's say the box, but then it wouldn't be together in the first row. With the way sound travels and the limited mentality of the people in the stands, no one is going to hear any difference.

Dutting ahead of the beat helps. While you'll never be perfect, it gets everybody a hell of a lot closer to being on the same page than if the battery enters on the DM's hands alone. It just takes practice running the sets with spatial demands to get a feel for how much ahead of the beat you need to be.

As far as drumlines go, math geeks need not apply, though I have known a few and am one myself. Temperature and humidity have no real bearing given the dimensions of a football field. From the back of the field to the front of the field is 160 ft.

At 20 Celsius and 0% relative humidity, sound travels at 1125 ft/s.

At 35 Celsius and 100% relative humidity, sound travels at 1152 ft/s

OR...over the 160 ft front to back distance... 0.142s, and 0.138s respectively, a difference of 0.004s.