fifer Posted August 28, 2009 Share Posted August 28, 2009 I would think that since DCI is trying to increase audience and income that adding, subtracting or moving shows would have to be included to see overall how DCI is doing on the whole, not just in the same shows as the previous year whick could have been new, old, or move shows. Scratching my head, I think that is what I mean? Maybe what I should have said is that adding a new regional would have to be looked at over numerous years to determine whether it has an overall positive or negative impact. If the new location is close enough to an old location, you will have some fans go to both, some just continue to go to the old show, and some who stop attending the old for the new/added show. Beyond looking at the change in attendee behavior from the previous year, you will have to give the new location several years to build its local fanbase as promotions get the word to more and more people in that area. So simply comparing the average audience of the 11 shows in 2006 to that of the 15 shows in 2007 is shortsighted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IntheMood Posted August 28, 2009 Share Posted August 28, 2009 I would've thought that most npos would list them as donors of in-kind donations. Separating in-kind from financial figures in the budget makes sense but cutting out the in-kind altogether is dumb.Say, for instance, a corps was starting out and needed a single payment loan to cover initial costs of start-up. That corps would be better equipped, when faced with the banker turning the loan down, if they saved room for in-kind donations to show the banker the support arm of the organization. The banker sees the loan as a lower risk because those volunteers are more likely to help in operation, management, income through sales of merch and fundraising, etc. I talked to a friend of mine friend about this today. She told me you would not believe how many NP's make that mistake. She also told me that another mistake NP's make is the general rule of Days Cash on Hand. Which should be around 60-90 days. NOT 10 days. Sustained growth is possible only when you delight customers. That means you have to be committed to continuous improvement. Dean Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
audiodb Posted August 28, 2009 Share Posted August 28, 2009 You can't simply compare total numbers as evidence of either a drop or increase in attendance. Um, actually, that's exactly how you do it. If you want a real apples to apples comparison, we would need to begin by comparing just the 11 shows that existed in 2006 against the comparable 11 shows in 2007. Then you would have to look at any difference between these numbers through a filter that includes any expected changes in attendence due to the creation of a new major regional that is located close enough to another regional to result in audience migration. Also, did any of the 11 regionals from 2006 change locations in 2007 (permanently or temporarily) and how did those changes affect attendence (and does that indicate an error in judgement of moving the show or a great decision indicated by a sizeable increase in attendance numbers for this one show - or was the change unavoidable due to a stadium closing or being renovated so it was a one-year anomoly).People are trying to way oversimplify the analysis of statistics in this entire discussion. And some are making things overly complicated. If you want a "real" apples to apples comparison, you need the overall season-wide sales revenue tallies. For those of us who aren't privy to that data, the best we can get is overall season paid attendance numbers (like DCI reported in 2006). But the only time DCI gave us that number was in '06. The comparison I presented is the most relevant and comparable one I could find amid all of DCI's press releases. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
audiodb Posted August 28, 2009 Share Posted August 28, 2009 Maybe what I should have said is that adding a new regional would have to be looked at over numerous years to determine whether it has an overall positive or negative impact. If the new location is close enough to an old location, you will have some fans go to both, some just continue to go to the old show, and some who stop attending the old for the new/added show. Beyond looking at the change in attendee behavior from the previous year, you will have to give the new location several years to build its local fanbase as promotions get the word to more and more people in that area. So simply comparing the average audience of the 11 shows in 2006 to that of the 15 shows in 2007 is shortsighted. That would be true....but we are comparing several things here: - Number of shows run by DCI increased from 11 to 15 (that could be either good or bad) - Number of tickets sold to those shows increased from 72,000 to 75,000 (that is good....was it worth the extra effort?) - Average attendance per event decreased 24% for those shows (what does that suggest about attendance trends?) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IntheMood Posted August 28, 2009 Share Posted August 28, 2009 That would be true....but we are comparing several things here:- Number of shows run by DCI increased from 11 to 15 (that could be either good or bad) - Number of tickets sold to those shows increased from 72,000 to 75,000 (that is good....was it worth the extra effort?) - Average attendance per event decreased 24% for those shows (what does that suggest about attendance trends?) This is a great example of ROA (return of Assets) if we had all the data. I would love to know if the revenue stream created with the increase of 3,000 fans covered the cost that DCI had to accrue when they operated 4 more shows. The margin would really the story. Dean Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Brace Posted August 28, 2009 Share Posted August 28, 2009 This is a great example of ROA (return of Assets) if we had all the data. I would love to know if the revenue stream created with the increase of 3,000 fans covered the cost that DCI had to accrue when they operated 4 more shows. The margin would really the story.Dean and if that margin actually mattered to DCI. It might be something they could write off to R&D expense. We analyzed a client need, we implemented a solution, solution was not as successful as we had anticipated, we are scaling back our solution... Expect maybe 12-13 shows next year. Maybe scale back the two nights in TN perhaps. Maybe eliminate one other show. Just thoughts off the top...without the cost/benefit analysis in hand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IntheMood Posted August 28, 2009 Share Posted August 28, 2009 and if that margin actually mattered to DCI.It might be something they could write off to R&D expense. We analyzed a client need, we implemented a solution, solution was not as successful as we had anticipated, we are scaling back our solution... Expect maybe 12-13 shows next year. Maybe scale back the two nights in TN perhaps. Maybe eliminate one other show. Just thoughts off the top...without the cost/benefit analysis in hand. I forgot another important piece of the puzzle. What was the toll gate(time line) DCI set for the ROA? 1 year, 2 years ect. So you may be saying they ran some kind of test. I can not fault that, if that is the case. I strongly believe in running a test first. In that case ROI (return of investment) may not be a factor if improvement is made the next time around. I happen to like mistakes for 2 reason. 1. It shows me one is willing to take risk 2. Every mistake made is a chance for improvement Dean Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truenorthdc Posted August 28, 2009 Share Posted August 28, 2009 I talked to a friend of mine friend about this today. She told me you would not believe how many NP's make that mistake. She also told me that another mistake NP's make is the general rule of Days Cash on Hand. Which should be around 60-90 days. NOT 10 days.Sustained growth is possible only when you delight customers. That means you have to be committed to continuous improvement. Dean I've always said there is no status quo...if your not growing...your dying slowly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IntheMood Posted August 28, 2009 Share Posted August 28, 2009 I've always said there is no status quo...if your not growing...your dying slowly. I really respect what you are doing ? do you have a website yet? Also would your Drum Corps be located around the Rigina or Grimsby area? I may have some info. that may help if you are. I am sorry if I misspelled the names. Dean Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truenorthdc Posted August 29, 2009 Share Posted August 29, 2009 I really respect what you are doing ? do you have a website yet? Also would your Drum Corps be located around the Rigina or Grimsby area? I may have some info. that may help if you are. I am sorry if I misspelled the names.Dean We are located in Sault Ste Marie, Ontario. Replacing the void left when the Bandettes shut down. Tried to get going last Jan. with a site up and running like other open class corps, competition, touring etc. but realized fairly quickly that I really didn't want to get into all that at that time and put on the breaks to reconsider other options. News of the new "off the steet" corps forming in NE US, Quebec, and other areas re-kindled the flame and now it's going again to start in the spring and march around 40 off the street kids in a parade corps in 2010 then expand the next year and hopefully be part of tour in NE US and provice of Quebec where a dozen or more similar corps are underway. Three to five years down the road we can and will take a good look at getting on the DCI tour but will stay true to our roots and continue to bring in 12 yr. olds and up and heavily promote and perform whenever possible locally. Also long term plans are to run 2 corps for 12 to 16 (and older for those who don't want the big tours) and 16 to 21 for an Open Class touring corps. Dream would be a World Class corps furthur down the line but finances will determine if that becomes a reality. Got to be positive and believe it can/will happen some day. Think it and you become it. I want as much as posssible to make the corps totally local kids so they will all be at rehearsals and camps and we will always have a full corps to do local gigs year round. If you have contacts in the Grimsby, Ontario area I suggest you pass on that information to HYPE (Conqueror II) in Hamilton, Ontario. They are growing and would be very happy to receive any help or information you could provide. http://conqueror2.ca/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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