TimbreDeBrass Posted August 27, 2010 Share Posted August 27, 2010 I'm just going to encourage people to look at the differences in scores from night to night.... This is making me question an idea, why can't we have 1 judge do the same caption for all 3 nights? For example Phantom Regiment was 10th in Visual Ensemble and 12th specifically in Visual Ensemble excl on Quarterfinals night, and 7th overall on Semifinals night with 7th in Visual Ensemble excl., Blue Stars' brass was 6th both Quarter's and Semi's but fell to 8th overall on Finals night Quarter's http://www.dci.org/scores/recap/view.cfm?e...63-01b019e4edba Semi's http://www.dci.org/scores/recap/view.cfm?e...fc-5ddc3ed4e432 Finals http://www.dci.org/scores/recap/view.cfm?e...cda-dac41a7cf0a Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cephas Posted August 27, 2010 Share Posted August 27, 2010 Yeah, but there's not really anything we can do about that. Just enjoy the shows for what they are, and perform for the fans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
supersop Posted August 27, 2010 Share Posted August 27, 2010 I'm just going to encourage people to look at the differences in scores from night to night....This is making me question an idea, why can't we have 1 judge do the same caption for all 3 nights? For example Phantom Regiment was 10th in Visual Ensemble and 12th specifically in Visual Ensemble excl on Quarterfinals night, and 7th overall on Semifinals night with 7th in Visual Ensemble excl., Blue Stars' brass was 6th both Quarter's and Semi's but fell to 8th overall on Finals night Quarter's http://www.dci.org/scores/recap/view.cfm?e...63-01b019e4edba Semi's http://www.dci.org/scores/recap/view.cfm?e...fc-5ddc3ed4e432 Finals http://www.dci.org/scores/recap/view.cfm?e...cda-dac41a7cf0a Not looking at placements but looking at Raw scores for PR ...... subcaption 1 in Ensemble was 9.1 then 9.2 .. pretty consistent scoring at the bottom of box 5. Where they made a move in Semis was in Excellence. 8.7 up to 9.1. Now I didn't see any major ensemble tears in Quarters, but i was in the theatre ... not at the show. At this level of competition all it takes is one major gack to keep you out of box 5. A .4 improvement is pretty rare from night to night (unless you're BD :P) ... but if there were issues on Thursday, the score jump could be justifiable. 9.3 - 9.2 Quarters. 9.2 - 9.1 Semis. 9.1 - 9.0. Historically, this makes sense. It's the reduced size of field that causes the point spreads to widen. With Blue Stars being in the 8th position .. Corps in the 7th and lower positions are usually the first spots to start taking a dump in score each night. They remained box 5 all 3 nights which is a major accomplishment. Scores dropped consistently by .1 .. so each judge gave basically the same ready, the corps was fairly consistent ........ it's just how the scoring system goes as the field thins. I wouldn't call that inconsistent judging at all. It may have affected their brass score placement .. but look at those who were up in arms that Crown was 4th in brass (only 0.3 behind 1st. ... that's nodda). If you look closer at the finals recap, the brass scores were up and down in corps order .. but looking at the subcaptions, I give this judge props. There was not the usual +.1 per corps. There were some big swings between Technique and Musicality within the same corps. Example: 9.8 (2nd) 9.4 (5th) Crown ...... 9.5 (5th) 9.8 (2nd) Coats ....... If anyone should be screaming it's them .. these are total flipflop numbers from the night before whereas Cavies, BD and those blow Crown were pretty much up and down slotted. Basically, the best and worst of both worlds (or just a major disagreement with the judge from the night before. Confused enough? The rankings changed alot in subcaptions, but the numbers didn't actually move much. The judge just had to make a call on the Rank ...... whereas the RATE changed a bit from night to night. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
3rd Glasgow BB Posted August 27, 2010 Share Posted August 27, 2010 I'm no judge but in both Semis & Finals PR really lifted their game, they seemed to find a whole new performance level that wasn't there in Quarters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Boo Posted August 27, 2010 Share Posted August 27, 2010 I'm just going to encourage people to look at the differences in scores from night to night....This is making me question an idea, why can't we have 1 judge do the same caption for all 3 nights? ... There's much to be said for having a "fresh" set of eyes and ears at each event. If you have one judge for all three nights, you might as well just have Quarterfinals and call it a season at the end of the day. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BOBSMYTH Posted August 27, 2010 Share Posted August 27, 2010 There is only one thing I hate more than slotting in drum corps - inconsistency in judging. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peel Paint Posted August 27, 2010 Share Posted August 27, 2010 (edited) I'm just going to encourage people to look at the differences in scores from night to night....This is making me question an idea, why can't we have 1 judge do the same caption for all 3 nights? For example Phantom Regiment was 10th in Visual Ensemble and 12th specifically in Visual Ensemble excl on Quarterfinals night, and 7th overall on Semifinals night with 7th in Visual Ensemble excl., Blue Stars' brass was 6th both Quarter's and Semi's but fell to 8th overall on Finals night Shouldn't there be some night-to-night variation in caption scores, if that's how they performed? Sure, you might say, but it's not how they performed, or maybe you'd say, Sure, but not this much variation. How do you know? Were you exactly where the judges were on those two nights, looking and listening to the same performance in exactly the same way? Were you where each of the judges was? (Obviously, it's not possible for one person to simultaneously see a show from the exact perspective of many other judges in different places in a stadium.) To me, night-to-night movement in caption scores reflects the reality of drum corps performance. I'd be much more suspicious if they ranked the same on all captions all three nights. Think about it this way. Assuming you're older, when you were 20 years old and doing something incredibly difficult to nail, would you have been able to do it with 100% consistency each time you did it? Or would you have had "good days" and "bad days," like the rest of us? Finally, if you expect 100% objectivity and accuracy from a system that judges artistic performance, you are surely going to be disappointed. Backing off from that is a good first step to enjoying the shows a lot more. Edited August 27, 2010 by Peel Paint Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BozzlyB Posted August 27, 2010 Share Posted August 27, 2010 Meh, over the 2010 scores and placements already. I don't like the idea of one judge's opinion ruling a single caption for all of DCI week, I think a variety of opinions has the tendency to average more accuracy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Salvatore Posted August 27, 2010 Share Posted August 27, 2010 Meh, over the 2010 scores and placements already. I don't like the idea of one judge's opinion ruling a single caption for all of DCI week, I think a variety of opinions has the tendency to average more accuracy. Right, and that is what they use for the caption awards... an average of scores recorded in Qtr/Semi/Finals. I know where you were going, however, overall placement. I disagree with averaging for determining actual placement as it should be best on that night. One compromise (reduce impact of a single judge and still evaluate that nights performance) might be to expand all the judging panels for championship week (not just GE). Of course that would translate to many more distracting shirts on the field. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GMichael1230 Posted August 27, 2010 Share Posted August 27, 2010 I'm just going to encourage people to look at the differences in scores from night to night....This is making me question an idea, why can't we have 1 judge do the same caption for all 3 nights? For example Phantom Regiment was 10th in Visual Ensemble and 12th specifically in Visual Ensemble excl on Quarterfinals night, and 7th overall on Semifinals night with 7th in Visual Ensemble excl., Blue Stars' brass was 6th both Quarter's and Semi's but fell to 8th overall on Finals night Quarter's http://www.dci.org/scores/recap/view.cfm?e...63-01b019e4edba Semi's http://www.dci.org/scores/recap/view.cfm?e...fc-5ddc3ed4e432 Finals http://www.dci.org/scores/recap/view.cfm?e...cda-dac41a7cf0a So...you are saying you would rather have slotting and predetermined placements ??? Looks like judges called it as they saw it. Corps are a group of individuals, pretty sure they arent machines, they could have different output on different nights.... Bravo to the judges for judging waht they saw, not what they were told about or heard about..... G Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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