Jeff Ream Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 Data (ticket sales, merchandise sales, donations, etc.) doesn't support older fans having as much of an impact on the financial sustainability of DCI or individual corps as they think they do. . This is the only point I will disagree with you on. Older die hard fans are the ones that will attend multiple shows, many a great distance from home. These are the fans that bought albums, then got all the cassettes, then all the cd's. they had everything on vhs, then converted it all to dvd. These are the fans with dozens of tshirts, and willingly write checks to sponsor kids, often drop cash into the gas jar, rally others to arms to help donate to corps for issues like truck fires, new food truck campaigns etc. These fans DO have an impact. They willingly pay full price to go to shows, not get the band program discount to go to a show because their buddies are going. These are the guys, in my aera, that hit up every show in Allentown and NJ, West Chester, and even MD if some are scheduled. These are the fans that are leaving. These are the fans DCI needs to reach out to and woo back as they continue to go for the kids. Why? A kid will see the show closest to home. That's a one time income producer. The diehard is a multiple time income producer every season. say a diehard spent $500 on DCi and all things related a season, and you lost 20 like him. That's $10k lost income. How many kids doing a one off show do you need to make that up? a lot more than you think, when you add in the fact they didn't even pay full price for their ticket Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
geluf Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 (edited) And we have once again come to the old DCP standby: "My era was better!" "No, MINE was!" "No, mine IS!" DCP: Literally Every Thread Is Dinosaurs Vs. Youngins Edited April 19, 2011 by geluf Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 One other random point... Let's go back 20 years to 1991.... There were 28 corps in Open (Div I) compared to 23 last year in World Class. There were 33 corps in A/A60 (Division II/II) compared to 26 last year in Open Class If you look at raw numbers of kids participating in World class drum corps now compared to 10 years ago... what is often overlooked is the increase of members from 128 to 150. In looking at the current number of World Class corps, that is a difference of basically 4 corps of 128 performers, meaning a loss of 4 World Class corps from years ago still would result in the same number of potential participants. So, since 1991, we are basically down one corps worth of participants in World Class. In other classes it is difficult to say, but most of the current corps in Open Class have more members than the A/A60 (Div II/III) corps of 1991, and are MUCH better run. Again... drum corps is NOT dying. no drum corps is not dying. but very few corps march a full 150. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 I actually think fewer corps, but corps of higher quality is a good thing, and we should not mourn the loss of a lot of little poorly run, poorly staffed corps. Again, quality is more important than quantity. Part of the demise of a lot of smaller corps can also be attributed to the increase in quality and experience offered by marching bands across the country. Why would a kid ever go to a small regional corps that traveled less and offered a lower quality of experience then their school marching band? Also, going all the way back to before DCI was founded... these might as well be two different activities. Great as they were in their day, there is nothing about the activity in those days that has much relevance or appeal to kids these days. Many kids these days struggle to even connect with stuff from the 1990's. fewer corps leads to fewer alumni which leads to fewer fans. or in other words, has us where we are now and makes it worse Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruckner8 Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 Disagree. Visual difficulty is higher, but how much on an absolute scale? Meanwhile, music (especially after the watering down of parts during the season) was in some ways more difficult in the 1970s. Meanwhile, today's top corps have more (and more focused) rehearsal time. No one in the 1970s could even dream of having 11 weeks of full-time drum corps (i.e. three weeks of all-days and an eight-week tour). I'd say the ratio is roughly equal....always has been. OK, you're determined to conclude that all instruction, talent and opportunity are equal across generations. That the only reason drum corps is universally perceived as better now (except for you and cowtown) is that there's more time, lol. Cool. Have you heard the early recordings of the Master Works? Here's a 1917 recording of Philadelphia/Stokowski playing Brahms' Hungarian Dance #5. http://www.stokowski.org/sitebuilderfiles/171024_Brahms_Hungarian_no_5_H.mp3 That sounds like a high school orchestra when it comes to matching pitch and note lengths. Musical? We can barely tell! (There's even a worse recording from 1906 on that site, but part of point was to show the "improvement." Yikes.) If I follow your logic, the reason orchestras sound better today is because they rehearse more, right? It can't be because today's conductor's have better ears (Who would criticize Stokowski? [i would]). It can't be because subsequent generations HAVE heard the awful early recordings and thought "####, I don't really want to sound like that garbage." It can't be because today's musicians are better trained. It can't be because of 1000 other advances in time... It has to come down to more rehearsal time, lol. When we both know that orchestras today, thanks to the unions, hardly practice at all. I guess the fact they play Beethoven 5 2-3 per year counts as extra "rehearsal time!" There are many examples, legends even, of Bruckner Symphonies being premiered unsuccessfully after TEN rehearsals of 3+ hours. Today's orchestras premiere new works, 10x as difficult, on FOUR OR LESS rehearsals, max 2.5 hours long! IMO, the recordings themselves are the sole driver of improvement. Each year, the standard is set a little higher. Each year, every drum corps person sits down and listens very critically to past performances, and say to themselves "how can I make this better?" Every member, since recordings have been made, has listened to corps that THEY THEMSELVES perceive as better than their own corps (we are not to judge why), and said to themselves "What can I do differently to get to that level or beyond?" (ANS: Improve myself for MY corps, or improve and jump to THAT corps.) It's a built-in self-efficacy situation. One that haters of the TOC try to marginalize. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruckner8 Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 And we have once again come to the old DCP standby: "My era was better!" "No, MINE was!" "No, mine IS!" DCP: Literally Every Thread Is Dinosaurs Vs. Youngins I openly admit that today is LOT better than 1984, no doubt about it. And in 1984, I was very aware that it was lot better than 1974. I attribute it to better talent (staff, memberships, creative teams); whilst audiodb attribute it to more rehearsal time! All good. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 I'm talking about since the advent of DCI. Anything prior to that has little relevance to the present. The 80's barely even have any relevance to now. a charter member was a parish corps. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 One point to add... regarding WC corps that drop out... emphasis should be placed on creating groups that will remain stable. I think the current World Class is becoming continually more stable from an operational stand point as time moves on. I think that will only improve to the point where this should no longer be an issue. so that's why 8 of them wanted shows only for themselves and wanted extra pay too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 Sports teams move all the time. They lose some sponsors, gain new ones. Lose some old fans, gain some new ones. so that's why the A's moved. they were packing them in in Philly (not) and KC (not). Oh and the Raiders moved because they were seeling out in Oakland. Oh wait they were. But they weren;'t in LA. oh and yes the Colts. lest we forget that one. do you really follow sports?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Ream Posted April 19, 2011 Share Posted April 19, 2011 And we have once again come to the old DCP standby: "My era was better!" "No, MINE was!" "No, mine IS!" DCP: Literally Every Thread Is Dinosaurs Vs. Youngins and you have those of us in the middle. the are many great things today. there are many great things from the past tossed away too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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