OrlandoContraAlum Posted October 15, 2012 Share Posted October 15, 2012 Yup, Members quit for really stupid reasons sometimes... Sorry, not being into your corps' show is NOT a stupid reason. There is no way that I would go out on tour and put the work in (not to mention the $$$$ and a summer of my life) if I did not believe in the vehicle. Further, I would HATE to become "that guy"... the attitude problem that is always bringing others down. Not that I am saying that kids WOULD be that guy, but I can imagine that it would be pretty hard to keep that guy at bay. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OrlandoContraAlum Posted October 15, 2012 Share Posted October 15, 2012 There have been plenty of shows with music that didn't appeal to me when I heard them the first, second or even third time. But they grew on me and by the end of the season, the corps were making them rock the stadium. If shows take awhile to grow on spectators, then surely they can take time to grow on the performers. A problem is members remember the end of the previous season, when the kinks have been worked out of a show. To go from the end of the season, with the show having benefitted from hours of judges' critiques, to pre-season, when only the staff has been exposed to the show, has got to be a bit of a shock. It's hard sometimes to envision what a show will feel, look and sound like months later, and consequently, it's just too easy to judge and be wrong about the final result. And even after considering all that, only one show is ultimately going to win. Members should march because they love the corps they're in, they love the activity, they love the people they're living days on end with and they love the experience and training they're getting. Going into any corps for reasons that require having to love a show before it's even developed just opens up the door to be frustrated down the road. I agree to a point, but I offer the counterpoint that, if through the entire winter program and into spring you STILL can't get into your show, then I think that you should seriously consider giving up your spot to someone who would. Tour is hard, and if you don't believe in what you are doing, I can imagine that it would be tough to deal with the day to day BS if your heart isn't into it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kickhaltsforlife Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 I hated the music I played in 08 and 09. Had a great time with my corps members. But rehearsal time, especially just music rehearsal was boring as ####. And many people did not come back because the brass arranging was AWFUL. I came back because overall i had a good time... but I don't blame others who didn't come back, and went on to play with corps with a better musical experience. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glory Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 Sorry, not being into your corps' show is NOT a stupid reason. There is no way that I would go out on tour and put the work in (not to mention the $$$$ and a summer of my life) if I did not believe in the vehicle. Further, I would HATE to become "that guy"... the attitude problem that is always bringing others down. Not that I am saying that kids WOULD be that guy, but I can imagine that it would be pretty hard to keep that guy at bay. Maybe I'm misunderstanding you, but aren't we all in a position regularly where we put aside personal taste or preference in order to achieve broader goals for the group or ourselves? Surely there are many members every year who aren't entirely happy with the program yet can put their feelings in the background and still march, spin and play with passion. I hate to do this, but think about BD in years like 2010. It doesn't seem reasonable that everyone of them was in love with the score. So how do we explain performances that surely displayed the passion to perform the program with excellence and style? I think drum corps is almost as much about putting personal taste aside as it is about putting our talent on the line. My own theory on the original question is the answer is as complicated as human beings are. The score is an issue when the issues go beyond the score. Or in the reverse, the score isn't an issue when everything else is wonderful. When everyone is happy, individuals with complaints make their peace with the score and even find elements of satisfication where they didn't expect to find it. Drum corps runs on that promise, after all. Drum corps is nothing if not repetition and monotony amid outright inconvenience and tension. If members quit just because there was something they couldn't endorse each day, it would be pretty lonely on the bus. HH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OrlandoContraAlum Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 Maybe I'm misunderstanding you, but aren't we all in a position regularly where we put aside personal taste or preference in order to achieve broader goals for the group or ourselves? Surely there are many members every year who aren't entirely happy with the program yet can put their feelings in the background and still march, spin and play with passion. I hate to do this, but think about BD in years like 2010. It doesn't seem reasonable that everyone of them was in love with the score. So how do we explain performances that surely displayed the passion to perform the program with excellence and style? I think drum corps is almost as much about putting personal taste aside as it is about putting our talent on the line. My own theory on the original question is the answer is as complicated as human beings are. The score is an issue when the issues go beyond the score. Or in the reverse, the score isn't an issue when everything else is wonderful. When everyone is happy, individuals with complaints make their peace with the score and even find elements of satisfication where they didn't expect to find it. Drum corps runs on that promise, after all. Drum corps is nothing if not repetition and monotony amid outright inconvenience and tension. If members quit just because there was something they couldn't endorse each day, it would be pretty lonely on the bus. HH I think that there are certainly degrees... Obviously I am not talking about slightly disliking the book. I even have experience here (Suncoast 87 was my rookie year, after all...) but I was a rookie, and I still had a good summer (not great, especially competitively by the corps' standards to that point). I am saying that if I really hated the book/show, there is no way I would go on tour. I think that it would be unfair to the corps, to the "greater good" of which you speak, to have someone in the corps that, while they may be a good person, may let the intensity of the day-to-day grind of tour negatively affect them, and therefore affect the corps. I would think that having a member who simply can't wait for the summer to be over would not be a good thing (and there were kids in that 87 corps who fit this bill). I do agree that the answer is complex, I just have a problem with the "rah rah esprit de corps" thought process that some are espousing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Detweiler Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 Each to his own. Dan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kickhaltsforlife Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 One thing we can't forget... Corps loyalty is NOTHING what it used to be. We saw most of Phantom's percussion section move to SCV because that's where their instructor went. Many go to all different corps because they want the different experiences. Different teachers, different ways of learning and teaching. Many do in fact chase the ring. That's just a few examples of why people leave corps. But people aren't all crazy about corps loyalty anymore. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OrlandoContraAlum Posted October 16, 2012 Share Posted October 16, 2012 I agree with your point Jason about corps loyalty. I just don't think that someone should be there who does not want to. As I mentioned before, I was no fan of our show in 1987, and in both 1988 and 1989 I had to deal with other corps members who most certainly did not want to be there and were going through the motions. I would much rather them have left the corps than drag others down with their negativity. Especially if you have a younger corps or one without a lot of veterans of THAT corps. It's tough. Having said that, we may have moved a bit off topic from the OP, so sorry about that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barifonium Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 (edited) entirely happy with the program yet can put their feelings in the background and still march, spin and play with passion. Perhaps, but when not all of your Three; Mind, Body, and Soul are in sync, it can be pretty damaging. It depends on your priorities (which may or may NOT be under your control based on your past) and sometimes a certain show you don't like requires you to change what makes you happy to keep yourself sane and performing at their top level. It's really a big character hurdle to get through. I hate to do this, but think about BD in years like 2010. It doesn't seem reasonable that everyone of them was in love with the score. So how do we explain performances that surely displayed the passion to perform the program with excellence and style? I think drum corps is almost as much about putting personal taste aside as it is about putting our talent on the line. Maybe it WAS quality, but how much harder and emotionally draining was it for THEM to do that if they had the opinion speculated above? ...and even find elements of satisfication where they didn't expect to find it. Drum corps runs on that promise, after all. Drum corps is nothing if not repetition and monotony amid outright inconvenience and tension. If members quit just because there was something they couldn't endorse each day, it would be pretty lonely on the bus. And if you don't find it at first, look harder. For your sanity's sake. I do agree that the answer is complex, I just have a problem with the "rah rah esprit de corps" thought process that some are espousing. Yep. Edited October 17, 2012 by Barifonium Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pete Freedman Posted October 17, 2012 Share Posted October 17, 2012 The OP may be thinking of just a show direction that the member isn't interested in, but then again some arrangements are just plain bad. Keep in mind that typically the director has no idea what to listen/look for, the parents don't know either, and most of the members don't really know. The techs know but they can't second-guess their boss. Basically, there is very little oversight on the writing in drum corps! This was certainly true in the small corps I was in, but I get the sense that it is true even in some top 12 corps. The director finds out the problems when the scores and tapes come in, even though half the members knew all along and couldn't say anything. Kind of odd... Directors need to find a way to detect and fix a bad show to prevent at least some of the issues the OP brings up. But how? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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