MiamiSun76 Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 Being familiar with Wal-Mart.....I wonder if any of you who say it's evil and all....do you have first hand experience of all you say or are you just going by what the media spwews about them? So the "media" is out to get Wal-Mart? Why? Did they do this to Macy's? The fact is that the Walton family and their successors have used the "free market" to advance a right wing political and social agenda that goes far beyond their employees. When I lived in Canada, several provinces had to introduce "Wal-Mart" legislation to require retailers to adhere to basic standards of employee rights. It was called Wal-Mart legislation because everyone knew that Wal-Mart wouldn't accept the requirements and would go away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lancerlady Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 (edited) You are going to blame Wal-Mart for a third world countries use of children? You should stop thinking that we should run the world and be responsible for everyone elses actions. Child labor is dead wrong, but I can tell you that each retailer I have worked for on the coroprate level is very sensitive to child labor, and actually frequently tour the facilities that these vendors use to ensure ethical behavior takes place. We have plenty of sweat shops in America to be concerned about, than to point fingers at retailers that use overseas vendors.Lets say Wal-Mart discontinues outsourcing their goods. Then let's see how much your clothes cost you? Let's see how much your tennis shoes will cost you? How about that cell phone you are using? How about that DVD player? Without groups like Sam's club, Wal-Mart, Costco, Etcc..., Drum Corps would be allot more expensive to run. The clubs make their margin in volume which allows them to charge less for products, which helps the corps to be able to buy in bulk and save money. I could get into a juicy debate with you about unions, but the Drum Corps Planet forums aren't the place for them. Preach it! Anyway, if this debate continues they could move it to the CE forum or another forum if it bothers some, but I find it interesting that even though Walmart has donated to the drum corps community in different forms or fashions they get this "THEY ARE EVIL" rap. Walmart doesn't have Unions cause they believe in Sam's philosophy of having an "Open door policy" where you can go to management without fear of retribution about problems. I was able to use this system when I worked there many times and found this to be refreshing. They didn't retaliate against me for that. They try to work out the problem... The only issue I had with them was about their Worker's Compensation problem that they have with thier risk control department. Always trying to "bully" you into signing things if you got hurt on the job. I remedied that problem though my way. But that doesn't mean that I hate them. Every company has issues. Also, Every store is run different. It depends on the manager. When I was there I couldn't have asked for a more ethical fair store manager. He left long after I did and everytime I go in there all my friends are pretty miserable with the new management, but they need the job.... Heck if you haven't noticed alot of those bigger stores like "Best Buy" are laying off people just to save money, so they won't go Bankrupt cause they're trying to keep up with Walmart...that is at least something Walmart doesn't do, lay off folks. Edited March 31, 2006 by Lancerlady Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tone Quality Matters Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 Preach it! The only issue I had with them was about their Worker's Compensation problem that they have with thier risk control department. Always trying to "bully" you into signing things if you got hurt on the job. I remedied that problem though my way. But that doesn't mean that I hate them. Every company has issues. Also, Every store is run different. It depends on the manager. When I was there I couldn't have asked for a more ethical fair store manager. He left long after I did and everytime I go in there all my friends are pretty miserable with the new management, but they need the job.... Lancerlady. You raise an excellent point about the workers comp. I had a similar issue with another retail group after a car accident that occured during business hours, on a business trip. I think allot of folks have unpleasant run ins with workers comp across the country. It is broken and needs to be addressed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
felixh Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 You are going to blame Wal-Mart for a third world countries use of children? You should stop thinking that we should run the world and be responsible for everyone elses actions. Child labor is dead wrong, but I can tell you that each retailer I have worked for on the coroprate level is very sensitive to child labor, and actually frequently tour the facilities that these vendors use to ensure ethical behavior takes place. We have plenty of sweat shops in America to be concerned about, than to point fingers at retailers that use overseas vendors.Lets say Wal-Mart discontinues outsourcing their goods. Then let's see how much your clothes cost you? Let's see how much your tennis shoes will cost you? How about that cell phone you are using? How about that DVD player? Without groups like Sam's club, Wal-Mart, Costco, Etcc..., Drum Corps would be allot more expensive to run. The clubs make their margin in volume which allows them to charge less for products, which helps the corps to be able to buy in bulk and save money. I could get into a juicy debate with you about unions, but the Drum Corps Planet forums aren't the place for them. That's ok,...I have been in several juicy debates about unions,...and where they count.....on the front lines with managers and at the negotiating table...so that would be nothing new....and as far as child labor is concerned....child labor anywhere is bad,...that's from a fathers perspective....as far as what my tennis shoes would cost,....that's for me and my pocket book and conscience to decide....if you think that illuminating me to what it would cost for goods if outsourcing were done away with, save it.....the cost to workers in the US is far greater.....I would rather pay a little more for my tennis shoes to an employer that has sound labor practices and does not use child labor....but that's just me....you my friend, are free to spend your money however you see fit B) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
felixh Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 Ok, so I just read 8 pages of comments (mostly "walmart is evil" comments) and I have to say that it all sounds like a lot of #####ing with no action behind it. The reason small mom and pop stores close when walmart comes to town is that people stop shopping at the small mom and pops. The problem isn't that there is a Walmart in the area, it's that people (in aggregate) prefer Walmart to small stores. If you want Walmart to stop expanding, or go away, or just change their business model, just don't shop at Walmart. As bad as this sounds, in a capitalistic society the best way to facilitate change is through money. So if you hate Walmart, don't shop there. If you already don't shop there, there is nothing more you can effectively do. It has been made abundantly clear by many people that Walmart is a less than optimal company ethically. Beating that point further is not pragmatic. I have found that opinions are not easily changed if drastically new information isn't presented. People know what Walmart does, yet they still shop there. That is not going to change. quote name='boilerman_05' date='Mar 31 2006, 06:47 AM' post='1348220'] "Ok, so I just read 8 pages of comments (mostly "walmart is evil" comments) and I have to say that it all sounds like a lot of #####ing with no action behind it." But their is action on my part boilerman....I don't shop at Walmart,...and you are correct to say that it the best "action"....as for everyone else you can shop wherever you like B) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
felixh Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 As soon as anyone has a gun put to their head and is dragged kicking and screaming into a Walmart as a shopper or employee, then I'll be concerned about these "abuses." Until then, it's just a bunch of "they won't unionize!" whining. Walmart succeeds because they're putting the customer as their number one priority, giving them what they want: a wide variety of products and brands at low prices. Don't like Walmart? Don't walk in the door. Agreed, but unions don't whine....we take action...that is why many workers enjoy things like weekends off....vacation time....maybe a paid holiday once in awhile and maybe even a decent wage....all gained by union fighting and blood through out the years....how quick some forget B) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
felixh Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 Preach it! Anyway, if this debate continues they could move it to the CE forum or another forum if it bothers some, but I find it interesting that even though Walmart has donated to the drum corps community in different forms or fashions they get this "THEY ARE EVIL" rap. Walmart doesn't have Unions cause they believe in Sam's philosophy of having an "Open door policy" where you can go to management without fear of retribution about problems. I was able to use this system when I worked there many times and found this to be refreshing. They didn't retaliate against me for that. They try to work out the problem... The only issue I had with them was about their Worker's Compensation problem that they have with thier risk control department. Always trying to "bully" you into signing things if you got hurt on the job. I remedied that problem though my way. But that doesn't mean that I hate them. Every company has issues. Also, Every store is run different. It depends on the manager. When I was there I couldn't have asked for a more ethical fair store manager. He left long after I did and everytime I go in there all my friends are pretty miserable with the new management, but they need the job.... Heck if you haven't noticed alot of those bigger stores like "Best Buy" are laying off people just to save money, so they won't go Bankrupt cause they're trying to keep up with Walmart...that is at least something Walmart doesn't do, lay off folks. This is just unbelieveable...I think the rose colored glasses should come off now...if you were unfortunate to have to go back to work at a low wage job at Walmart and decided you wanted a union to represent you...your next step would be out the door...even though it is your right under federal law to organize without retribution from your employer....there are again many documented cases of workers who have been unfairly targeted by Walmart management for utilizing there federal right to organize...not every issue is resolved as easy as you say....once they draw the line it's either you or them...B) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ben Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 OK????? Would you have anything tangible to add that would help me to understand why it would be bad, besides the worn out replies about lawsuits and such? would you want to be connected with a company like enron right now? i think walmart is heading there in the eyes of a lot of americans. that tangible enough for you? anyone who works in retail, regardless if it is for good ole sam walton, knows the tricks of the trade that walmart uses. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liam Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 (edited) I know this is likely futile -- but in an attempt to get back on topic .... Forget about Wal-Mart. Let's pretend the original poster had said Target or KMart or whatever. The point is why haven't these organizations been approached on a national level for sponsorships/discounts/freebies/etc? The individual stories posted here show that the willingness to participate by these companies is there -- why hasn't this been leveraged by DCI or groups of member corps on a permanent/national level? This is an area that I think corps and DCI/DCA as a whole have not pursued to its full extent. The combined purchasing power of the corp members and fans is quite large -- large enough to exert significant leverage on all kinds of companies for discounts/advertising/etc. Not necessarily tour related only, but any national company that can see the value of being "Official This or That of DCI." I'm sure there are many individual success stories along these lines, but I guess I wish that there were more overall emphasis by DCI/DCA/etc to help the activity as a whole in this way. Edited March 31, 2006 by Liam Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lancerlady Posted March 31, 2006 Share Posted March 31, 2006 (edited) This is just unbelieveable...I think the rose colored glasses should come off now...if you were unfortunate to have to go back to work at a low wage job at Walmart and decided you wanted a union to represent you...your next step would be out the door...even though it is your right under federal law to organize without retribution from your employer....there are again many documented cases of workers who have been unfairly targeted by Walmart management for utilizing there federal right to organize...not every issue is resolved as easy as you say....once they draw the line it's either you or them...B) Rose colored glasses? No, I'm not wearing them, and I have moved on from Walmart. I wasn't making a low wage at Walmart because I was in Accounting...counting their money. But I don't need the union to represent me. I did the smart thing and got a lawyer who was certified in Worker's Compensation and took care of the problem. Does that sound like I have the glasses on? Nope didn't think so. I'm just very open minded. While I know there are some problems with the company I don't blame them for everything. Things need to be addressed one thing at a time. Every company has issues....keep on blaming this one for all the problems if you want, but I choose to think they have helped the community alot in the long run....that's just me... Edited March 31, 2006 by Lancerlady Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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