kusankusho Posted January 2, 2007 Share Posted January 2, 2007 Sometimes you do. There are people who actually attended the show that said they didn't know there was a huge tear, it just sounded dirty. I've been able to pick out minor tears on shows that I've never seen before, and I'm not anything special. Even new fans can tell when something's up after a certain point of coming apart. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbc03 Posted January 2, 2007 Share Posted January 2, 2007 they can win shows early season in '05 without their closer even being marched on the field....it's called "benefit of the doubt," people. Also potentially referred to as "winner's luck." In 2005 almost the entire closer was on the field at the first show. Perhaps the reason the Cadets win the early shows is because they are better. Or I guess we can make excuses and shout conspiracy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Boo Posted January 2, 2007 Share Posted January 2, 2007 I'm still curious about this paper that is due, as referenced in the thread title. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dbc03 Posted January 2, 2007 Share Posted January 2, 2007 I've been able to pick out minor tears on shows that I've never seen before, and I'm not anything special. Even new fans can tell when something's up after a certain point of coming apart. Were you at that particular show? Because if not I'll take the word of the people who were. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orpheus Posted January 2, 2007 Share Posted January 2, 2007 (edited) Agreed. I wasn't even there, but I think what happened is pretty simple. They won because they're the Cadets. They can win shows early season with The Worst Ensemble Tear In DCI History, they can win shows early season in '05 without their closer even being marched on the field....it's called "benefit of the doubt," people. Also potentially referred to as "winner's luck." Well, I was there, and I certainly didn't have any problem with the Cadets winning. Musically, I actually thought the Cadets were pretty much on fire for that point in the season. How much is one ensemble tear (as bad as it may have been ... like I said, I didn't even notice it ... I just thought the drum feature was sloppy, which is pretty good for me as I know virtually nothing about percussion) going to affect your placement if the rest of your show is (on average) noticeably superior to your competition? Edited January 2, 2007 by Orpheus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
liebot Posted January 2, 2007 Share Posted January 2, 2007 (edited) I've been able to pick out minor tears on shows that I've never seen before, and I'm not anything special. Even new fans can tell when something's up after a certain point of coming apart. You weren't there. So far two people that were at the actual show (myself included) and getting a first read on the Cadets show couldn't detect that there was a major, minute-long ensemble tear. As I said earlier, I just thought the drum feature was really really really really really dirty, which is apparently what the judges saw too by putting them down to Phantom in drums by over a point. You've also have to factor in the fact that the rest of the corps proper wasn't marching in time at that point during the show (they were carrying tables around/jumping off them etc.) and the hornline certainly wasn't playing at that point. So all you had to go off was the drumline and the pit playing, and the hornline walking around with tables. If you were there I'd trust your opinion on this one, but you weren't, and I was. I'm a pretty aware drum corps fan and my friends and I both picked up on the solo being dirty, but nobody in the stands I talked to/overheard said anything about a huge tempo tear. Edit: Also, before scores were announced I was confident Cadets had won the show. Maybe I'm just an extremely biased fan, but they were doing more than Phantom was and doing it (ignoring the drum solo, which the individ. percussion judge picked up on) better than them. Edited January 2, 2007 by TSRTS13 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kusankusho Posted January 2, 2007 Share Posted January 2, 2007 You weren't there. So far two people that were at the actual show (myself included) and getting a first read on the Cadets show couldn't detect that there was a major, minute-long ensemble tear. As I said earlier, I just thought the drum feature was really really really really really dirty, which is apparently what the judges saw too by putting them down to Phantom in drums by over a point. You've also have to factor in the fact that the rest of the corps proper wasn't marching in time at that point during the show (they were carrying tables around/jumping off them etc.) and the hornline certainly wasn't playing at that point. So all you had to go off was the drumline and the pit playing, and the hornline walking around with tables. If you were there I'd trust your opinion on this one, but you weren't, and I was. I'm a pretty aware drum corps fan and my friends and I both picked up on the solo being dirty, but nobody in the stands I talked to/overheard said anything about a huge tempo tear.Edit: Also, before scores were announced I was confident Cadets had won the show. Maybe I'm just an extremely biased fan, but they were doing more than Phantom was and doing it (ignoring the drum solo, which the individ. percussion judge picked up on) better than them. You are right, I wasn't there, but I find it hard to believe that anyone can sit through a 1 minute tear that had Hoppy wanting to stop the show and not notice it was more than just dirty. Just MHO - I wasn't there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orpheus Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 You are right, I wasn't there, but I find it hard to believe that anyone can sit through a 1 minute tear that had Hoppy wanting to stop the show and not notice it was more than just dirty. Just MHO - I wasn't there. I don't think it was really as bad as you're imagining. It was probably terrible from the point of view of the members and staff, but for the audience (and probably the judges) it just wasn't as obvious as you might think. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kusankusho Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 I don't think it was really as bad as you're imagining. It was probably terrible from the point of view of the members and staff, but for the audience (and probably the judges) it just wasn't as obvious as you might think. Yeah probably - just going on what had been said about it in a couple of threads. Descriptions seem to range from "not that bad" to horrific, probably depending on bias about the corps. I still disagree with the idea that you can't tell if it's a tear until you know the show. We've all caught on to tears on a first read, and I'd certainly expect an ensemble judge to notice, although I know we got with off with no comments on a nasty tear or two over the years. A minute just seemed like a long time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slow Adam Posted January 3, 2007 Share Posted January 3, 2007 Okay. So some people that were at the show didn't notice a tear they just thought that 30 seconds of the show was unbelievably dirty drumming. Should that not negatively affect the Ensemble Music sheet? (which they won that night). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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