You be the judge. Re-write history. Part III.

[jake_the_hydra]

I think you are missing his point. I believe that he was just suggesting that maybe the reason that Cavaliers beat 2005 for the majority of the season is that the Cadets book was harder to clean, and therefore they had some catching up to do, which they had done by finals night. Conversely, the Cavaliers style is generally, at least IMO, of a type that, regardless of whether you consider it more difficult or less, is usually gonna get there earlier (for example, tone quality is going to improve a lot less over the course of a season than technical accuracy). I think he was just saying that the Cadets had more to fix, which they did by finals, and that is why they were losing for awhile.

Yes, I understand that that's what he was referring to. I thought my response made that clear and made sense in the context of the discussion, so I really don't have anything else to add.

[jake_the_hydra]

First off, Jake, you are right on. This was well said. I know that you were originally questioning my rationale for putting Cadets brass over Cavaliers, and although I didn't respond further back, I didn't feel I had to. Your point was very valid and well said.

But since all this debate is popping up, let me just say this:

My choice of Cadets brass in 2005 over Cavaliers 2002 was not easy. And when you throw a great line like BD 2004 in the mix, frankly it's downright crazy. When I chose my order of this top 12 the greatest question I had, largely because the other captions seemed easier to pick, was who would win brass, and the order that followed. I eventually had Cadets 2005 and BD 2004 tied, with Cavaliers 2002 in 3rd (due to the tie). But the spread would likely have been .1. I simply felt the Cavaliers of 2002, who were absolutely amazing in brass, would not have beaten BD or Cadets. My rationale was that Cadets had an edge in demand (which is not everything) and that they were just as clean and musical. BD had an edge in facility and demand as well. But when we talk musicality and balance and blend, we must remember that each corps goes for a unique blend and sound, and what they are looking for largely depends on the music and the type of impact. The Cavaliers are an amazing brass line with finesse, beautiful sounds, great demand, top notch training, and incredible shaping and balance. Demand should not be the end all of a great horn line, and the 2002 book had plenty of demand.

As I think about it more though, I still have Cadets just edging them, but I am not so sure Cadets 2005 would have tied BD 2004. BD 2004 was one heck of a line.

While we still disagree over "who would beat who", I do agree that your rationale and viewpoints are valid and your predicted outcome would be entirely possible in the context of the DCI judging circuit (and I don't mean that in a demeaning way).

About my points, thanks for the acknowledgement.

[Loud-is-good]

Yes, I understand that that's what he was referring to. I thought my response made that clear and made sense in the context of the discussion, so I really don't have anything else to add.

Hmm, in that case I guess you are just contradicting yourself then. If you only put stock in what happens finals week, then the fact that the Cavaliers were beating Cadets for most of the season really shouldn't matter. I guess I just thought you'd misunderstood something since otherwise your previous statements didn't make any sense taken together. Won't make that mistake again (of expecting your statements to make sense).

[jake_the_hydra]

Hmm, in that case I guess you are just contradicting yourself then. If you only put stock in what happens finals week, then the fact that the Cavaliers were beating Cadets for most of the season really shouldn't matter. I guess I just thought you'd misunderstood something since otherwise your previous statements didn't make any sense taken together. Won't make that mistake again (of expecting your statements to make sense).

No, now you're going out of your way to make what I said not make sense.

He said that the Cadets had a harder book, so therefore because it was clean (as in, precision-wise), finals week, that's why The Cavaliers beat them for most of the season. I understand this reasoning.

I said that I care more about quality of sound, balance, color, etc. . . and that in my opinion, The Cavaliers still had The Cadets on this.

I mentioned that "difficulty" of the book was not necessarily a priority for how I personally judge musical ensembles because it's something that, like I said, has a variety of factors and variables that I often don't know much about.

When I made the comment about finals week, I was simply referring to the fact that everyone has a summer to grow and learn. I can understand how you think this would conflict with what I was saying earlier.

No need to be rude about it.

[crashhelmi36]

Hey, when is the next one coming out?

[GMichael1230]

Hey, when is the next one coming out?

Out now !!

~G~

[crashhelmi36]

Out now !!

~G~

I saw, thanks. :P

Keep 'em coming!