caviesfan8p

My biggest complaint is that the video clips of the various corps are not equitable in that some (like Cavies and Glassmen) start almost at the first downbeart whereas others (like Crown and Cadets) include 45 seconds of drum majors walking to place or waiting for the corps to finish setting up before saluting. Can't they edit the clips so that you get two minutes of actual show from EVERY corps?

No, more like a very obvious parody of those who want to stick their heads in the sand and see no change whatsoever (whether uneducated or "having several degrees" as someone else mentioned). And it's not hard to find them on this board. This idea came to mind after reading Hopkin's blog about yet another group of fringe crazies who are harassing him for the show The Cadets are doing this year. I mean, even if you want to see no changes to "traditional drum corps" there is a way to have a constructive conversation about the topic and then there's those who will fill pages of this forum with their negativity and some who even go as far as harass the people involved.

Funny how few words I had to change in this description of the book Fahrenheit 451 to make it appropriate to our times... Fahrenheit DCI is a frightening vision of the future where firemen don't put out fires--they start them in order to burn the directors and designers of drum corps shows that don’t comply with the “obvious and entertaining” laws. Fahrenheit’s vividly painted society holds up the appearance of entertainment as the highest goal--a place where traditional concepts are good, and creativity and new ideas are bad. The Fire Captain explains it this way, "Give the people contests they win by remembering the words to more popular songs.... Don't give them slippery stuff like philosophy or sociology to tie things up with. That way lies melancholy." Bradbury's novel details the eternal war between censorship and freedom of thought and continues to be relevant today more than ever. In Bradbury's future, changes to traditional drum corps are illegal and happily so--citizens are too busy watching tapes of the same “ideal” shows over and over again to care about the loss of creativity. Our star begins the novel as a fireman who enforces the temperature of the title--that at which “creative” show designers/directors burn--but then transforms and tries to show his society the mistake of censorship and closed minded thinking.

Someone posted last week about Crown's "suspense" moment from 6:10 to 6:40 in their APD. It's right after the softer section with the trupmet and mellophone duet. Man that's sweet!

The Glassmen have their first show after the European trip on Friday in Elizabeth, PA. Where do you think they’ll place? I'm guessing the placements and approximate scores will be: 1. The Cadets 83.75 2. Phantom 81.85 3. Crown 80.00 4. Boston 79.60 5. Glassmen 76.50 6. Crossmen 73.40 7. Spirit 72.90 8. “The” Magic 65.25

Hey, I'm the biggest Cavies fan as well, but give The Cadets their due. YOU might not have liked last year's show but winning EVERY caption INCLUDING both general effect captions does not indicate a poorly designed show lacking in integration. Why people feel that integration means that the color guard has to be mingled into the corps proper for most of a show is beyond me.

Exactly what I thought - there was something almost "sqaure" about Phantom's show that makes it feel dated. I think part of it is that the drill just seems like you've seen it all before. Musically it feels like there is too much transition music that just fills the gaps between the main songs. Other than color guard, this looks and sounds like a championship contender corps, they were simply given a show that doesn't have the guns, flow or impact to win nowadays.

While it does appear that the Cadets' brass caption head could have been rude and uncooperative, it's also possibel that he was given instructions from someone else earlier that this request would have made impossible. But it seems like he could have at least said he couldn't move because of "x" reason or went to ask a drum major if they could move. Regardless, you should not take the heresay word of one person (even if it is your son) as being the complete story (remember, there are always two sides). And if you're really angered by it, inform George Hopkins about it don't just come here and give a corps a bad name over heresay! If his kids aren't representing the corps well, George will be the first to apologize and reprimand the kid(s) involved. I caution you from making an opinion about a group of people becasue of the way one person in that group acted. So, even if the Cadets' horn caption head was rude and inconsiderate in any way, disliking the entire corps and everyone involved is immature and inappropriate.

You mean you can't let something you disagree with to go by even once without a comment? I wish we could once stay on the topic, which, I believe, is a request for reports from anyone who actually experienced one of there performances in person this weekend, and could keep the "I hate" comments to threads about the specific topics of amps, voices, etc. For just ONCE I'd like to read a thread that can stay on-topic and thoughtful.

On paper, The Cadets have arguably the best chance of winning this year with no staff changes, the continuation of a cutting-edge concept/design, and their willingness to take chances with things like solo vocals and props (whether you like them or not, it takes “big ones” to take these high-level risks). I think their biggest risk is the possibility that Mark over-designs the show. Several others have a good chance as well but aren't bringing anything new to the table, which seems to be one factor the judges are looking for from a champion in this new era. While I’m sure the Cavies show will be spectacular and performed very well, it really is just another Frameworks or Spin Cycle type show with just a different name, plus it will likely take a year or two for the new and old staff to gel. My brothers will flame me for this one, but I also think their drills have started to lose their uniqueness with other designers incorporating some of the Gaines concepts and Gaines own drills becoming variations on the same themes. But I’ve seen nothing on the field yet, so MG might come out with very different moves from anything he’s had them do in the last six years. The Blue Devils are basically doing Gangster Chronicles II and don’t tend to be successful innovators so will probably only win by outdistancing the others in execution. However, they are probably so ###### off from their 2005 placement that they’ll be The Cadets’ most likely contender. Phantom has a history of not being able to design two really great shows in consecutive years and have staff changes. The Bluecoats, while making significant strides, have not yet reached the level of design, difficulty and execution that is required of a champion (watching the rebroadcast of the 2005 show at the Showcase last week really showed off all the problems with marching, especially their intervals). While many have offered other names, from Crown to Blue Stars, that could possibly win, I don’t see anyone else with a significant possibility of victory. This includes Santa Clara who will be lucky to hold their 2005 position with an entirely new staff and other strengthening corps at their level.

That's five incorrect votes for Phantom. Only one person of the 16 incorrect votes showing so far has admitted to voting Madison in error. Gee, who REALLY won that poll? Just a thought for anyone doing polls like this in the future, ALWAYS note in the poll question either "Vote for who to eliminate" OR "Vote for who to win" so people who haven't done these a million times before and don't read the deatils in the first message on the thread can vote correctly.

I think you need to see an eye doctor for your selective reading. While there were lots of "oh gooly Agnes, ain't that purdy" comments about Boston's singing in 2000, I was one of the numerous people I remember complaining about that aspect of their show. They sang a cliche song, out of tune, often difficult to hear, and it lasted way too long. I actually would put Crown's song from Rent above Boston's 2000 singing for the simple fact that it lasted 1/100th as long.

Gee, if this poll were about who was better, or any other measureable aspect (and not just a popularity, or is that unpopularity, contest), then we'd certainly not have seen early eliminations of the Cavies and Cadets.

Bluecoats again - their show just didn't draw me in like the rest.

DEFINITELY CROWN!!! While I'd love the boys from Rosemont to have another title, I too would like to see some fresh names at the top. And Crown has really been the only other cutting edge, unique group out there. We need to encourage corps to try new things the way Crown has. Even with what most would consider a rather disasterous show in 2002, they were at least trying to stretch and be different. And I agree with others who have commented in different threads about how wonderful their hornlines have been of late.

I didn't go out for a hotdog, but I voted Bluecoats anyway. Not sure what it is, they performed very well, but something about their delivery has simply never "grabbed" me. Part of it is their musical arrangements. There always seem to be points in their shows where things sort of go flat. Just as an example, I much preferred The Cadets arrangement of Dancer in the Dark. The Bluecoats version had that tagged on second quiet ending that just felt like filler and did little to either end the production of that song or transition to the next song. It simply seemed to add a second (sort of dead IMHO) ending to the song that had already ended nicely.

Gee sexy, your user name indicates that you are a veteran on this board so you must have been around DCP long enough to know that quite a few posters bash before they hear. And when (and IF) they do hear, their preconceived opinions keep them from giving it a fair shake. ^0^

While they did not win (and as a Cavies fan I'm grateful for that), I still admire the 1992 Cadets. Weren't they something like 4 or 5 points back from the pack and even lost to Phantom (who ended up eighth at finals) only a week or two before finals? They surged to second place, only 1/2 point back, and I've even heard a judge say he'd have placed them first in hindsight but was just too unbelieving at the time that they really progressed so much in such a short period of time.

Dave - Any word back from Hoppy? Or anyone else know for CERTAIN which Bernstein this is?

GH's blog says that The Cadets will likely end their 2006 show with the "First Concerto" by Bernstein. Then he says something about it being "track 14". The only thing that seems to match on Amazon is the American Classics CD with Symphony #1 and "Concerto for Orchestra - 'Jubilee Games'". Does anyone know if "Jubilee Games" is also referred to as the First Concerto? If not, anyone know what he means by First Concerto (Bernstein did so many and for so many different instruments/voicings). I hope it's the Julibee Games track 14 from the American Classics CD - that has Garfield written all over it!!!

No, the cheese hats would be for Madison. For Boston, it would be Bean Pot Hats!!!

Hey, nobody was supposed to share the Cavies guard costume design for 2006 yet!!!

Actually, the point I was trying to make was not about liking "all or no changes" but was that the poster commented that the need to use amps and vocals was an indication that the creative process was going downhill. This same argument was raised in many, if not all, of the preciously mentioned changes in drum corps. I simply find the "why do you need this to be creative" argument silly. Obviously any new tool or change will open new avenues in creative expression. But even if you stripped the amps and vocals from The Cadets 2005 show, you'd still have tons of creativity. So it wasn't needed becasue the creative process was going downhill, but because the creative minds wanted more tools and opportunities to add other ideas, voices, etc. to the mix. Now if you want to say you don't like that creative direction, I'm OK with that. But don't try to dumb down the reasons why amps and vocals was introduced to just the need of a bunch of dried up old designers!

If grounded pits are so needed, then the creative process is indeed going downhill. If asymmetrical drills are so needed, then the creative process is indeed going downhill. If dancing guards are so needed, then the creative process is indeed going downhill. If Bb horns are so needed, then the creative process is indeed going downhill. If 135 members are so needed, then the creative process is indeed going downhill. If an additional 2 feet in the front boundary is so needed, then the creative process is indeed going downhill.

And what exactly is THAT supposed to mean? And is that ALL you have to say about the corps' performance?