parkbench

Nice job, Tom, And, Brother, your name was cited many times this past weekend at CAC drill camp ... for all the "Blair moments" we've got (e.g., 16 man Bully roll after crabbing across the field; snareline push up to 'front sideline' sizzling with oldschool Battle Hymn ending, etc.). Wish you were on field with us but then whom better to have producing a shots that will be our keepsake of the effort. Bring on 888!

SW Florida LEE County prospects may have major conflict for the weekend due to (mandatory) Ft. Myers Edison Parade of Light -- Saturday. I know my son is reporting to school mid-afternoon; which basically shoots down run up to North Port area. With that said, a couple kids asked me (a known drum corps dad; nothing to do with band program besides dedicated booster and son participating) if percussion slots or representatives will be covered ?? The Pioneer web site didn't say specifically but gives impression the Florida connection is focused exclusively on brass/guard.

JimF, I had to smile at your post -- this was personally the right 'cause' at the right 'time' and I simply got 'the bug to pick up sticks in a more constructive manner' after re-connecting with Drum Corps as my son (teens) got hooked on it. After 20 some years of volunteering with Boy Scouts, this that and the other, and community involvement, it was simply "me time" with guys and an activity I think is fun (with a 'get out of jail for the moment card' from spouse). The Cavaliers effort is a one-time Anniversary event (in this time period of our history) with intimate ties to a few key objectives (endowment dollars and strengthening the 'A' corps volunteer base) plus celebration and honor of Don Warren's 80th Birthday as founder. Thus, the participants on the field (and behind the scenes are exclusively FMM's. Interestingly, I've been awed by the number of people that want to put on the Green and march whom for one reason or another, didn't, couldn't or simply because of the Corps history (pre and early DCI) let alone modern success.

Steve (27th Lancers), W O W I agree, the materials archiving and chronicalling the 2-7 Alumni event is simply incredible; if not required reading for anyone aspiring the drum corps genre'. Particularly important to me is the obvious comradery, work ethic exhibited. We are just getting moving with our 08' efforts but I can relate to many of the things demonstrated in the film. Just WOW. ("feeling" a VERY large snareline and massive contra line behind you certainly is worth the blisters!). Thank you for keeping that material alive.

First, to all responders thus far, thanks for great feedback; mostly confirms what I've been sensing. To Jeff (Madalumni), I'm not comfortable posting the CAC888 show out of respect to my brothers, staff, and fine-tuning / PR in the works. Not trying to be secretive or melodramatic. But I'll hint I'm certainly incredibly pumped after 25 years to be playing and marching stuff representative of before, during and well after my time strapping up -- and with buddies close as well as in our legend pages right thru recent times. Needless to say, we're abiding by a couple mantra's of some of our leadership -- "just don't suck" (Mike Lorenz), "Don't settle for great, be friggin awesome" (Jeff Fiedler). The only diff is we can legally reduce the swelling in the hands awith them wrapped around cold mugs of beer after rehearsals! And that's the bottom line for doing it. To reconnect and have a blast in this short life.

I'm really curious how folks react or respond to subject given several presentations at DCI over recent past -- 27th, Bayonne, Madison, Kingsmen, BD/SCV and as word getting out for 2008, Cavaliers 60th Anniversary Alumni Corps. Have you (or will you) stuck around to watch the shows at Semi's or whatever local venue exhibited? Did this draw you (as alum, rabid fan, etc.) to the/a show or back after some absence out of curiosiity? What do you expect to see? based on "some" memory or association of something with one corps or another) for example Malenguena by powerful Madison hornline and soloists, incredible rifle line by Kingsmen, etc. Did you appreciate or recognize the evolution of style of music, marching, drill, etc. demonstrated by the corps (or is that what you wanted?) Does anyone care beyond the alums or FMMs (if even they retain or maintain loyalties) -- or is this an exercise in connecting those alums & fans for fundraising, volunteer base, pride, or simply one last harrah at youth by mostly 40-50yr olds to the potential embarrassment of organization. How do the newer fans/corpspeople react to these -- interesting to see history? or a disservice and fuel to changing movement? Just really curious -- yes, I'm invested in marching with my FMM brothers this year, but questions stem from interesting 'camp' discussions on who beyond our own following real cares, the 'show' selections (drill, style, music, uniforms/identity hallmarks, etc.) and will hang in the stands to watch. And doing some simple observation past few years on "interest" in this sort of thing, it was weird how few "hits" or comments showed up here on DCP, DCI or on YouTube, for example.

I already got it down with exception of sucking at the eggbeater -- tried to teach it to you guys Friday nite anticipating potential meltdown -- I say in jest of course given our emotional fun-packed weekend. This thread just seemed to be better place to get confrontational All in love brother!

"Use of electronic instruments (for 2009 implementation) In discussion prior to the vote, George Hopkins spoke of a presentation offered on Saturday by the Tarpon Springs High School band, which demonstrated the possibilities and logistical concerns of electronics on the field.... " I've seen Tarpon's show past few years in my kid's circuit. Gosh forbid this is preview of things to come. A actual 'stage' backfield for electronic trapset drummer, keyboard, etc. NO battery/drumline; basically a theatrical production, yet it was "scored" with/against traditional bands. Their approach is largely close or over the top of even BOA circuit groups. This is IMHO very different animal from Drum Corps... DCA / All-age starting to look more and more attractive.

Thanks, Coult, Mr. Milano, me and some 20+ other guys (and growing) comprise the 2008 Cavaliers Anniversary Corps snareline -- an awesome sight to behold in prep for this coming summers festivities. The hair under the shako (? or aussie) is much of a problem for most of us LOL. The belly's are causing some interesting banter regarding appropriate look of the old school belt and buckle with a gut tho! What's more amazing for half us in the line thus far representing 70's/80's period are our chops; gonna make the younguns drop some jaws I think. Makes the monthly rehearsal trips from South Florida back to Rosemont worth every ounce of pain coming back to speed.

I was there literally in the middle of the circus of 1971 -- snare in Cavaliers. Interesting memories of the "died T-shirts", cartoons, scathing responses from many during that year. We came out of the gate (annual Kenosha Memorial Day freezebox show) incredibly strong. We continued building and layering the pieces of the concept for another dozen shows undefeated and scoring quite high for the times. Deserved so I might add because beneath the show "concept" was a very clean and executing drumline, hornline, M&M in typical Cavie fashion. As many noted the backlash regarding how to judge the show began mid summer as we moved East, and as the West coast corps began arriving. As Coult has documented in the Building Green Machine book, as well as my FMM brother Paul Milano has posted many times, the business and politics of the moment somehow got picked up in earnest and indeed influence the judging, and IMHO, feeding the various fan base reactions to not just us, but the other corps playing with a GE oriented label that year (Madison, Garfield, etc.). But to the point, that was what was happening in front of the curtain. Behind the curtain, 1971 represented the realization that the business / touring model of drum corps finally became front and center. Troopers, SCV, Anaheim were benefiting from COUNTLESS MORE hours perfecting their shows while traveling 1000's of miles, and the discipline of both staffs and members really was obvious versus the corps whom were still operating from a local rehearsal and weekend travel model. Their shows were just that more structurally, technically and musically ahead than what was possibly perceived as more GE trickery. I recall standing by the fence at several mid-season shows watching SCV in particular, and then later, Kingsmen, saying to my mates -- wow, we're witnessing something very different here guys! It was to me, a huge transformational moment of realization that Drum Corps was about to go a whole new way. Some didn't like what then happened the next couple years as the new model under DCI started to shape itself (most of those members "left corps life" and many corps started having problems), others embraced with huge success. And some took years to reinvent and adapt. This was a great lesson for me for years to come -- I never doubted my business school profs and business instincts about keeping eye out for transformational change and the impact it could have. So, IMO, Drum Corps didn't die, it just changed and rather quickly because the forces (market, membership, sponsorship, companies involved) embraced the direction or hope of what could be. Not a bad thing necessarily. I'm still here :) soaking up the genre 40 years later. BTW, I'm most proud of our 1971 show and corps maturity. I had perhaps the most fun of my life that year.

1972 Cavaliers (8-man) Dynasonic Snare Line [/img]

I don't post alot but this topic got my attention. Each corps indeed has its own personality, style, history, affluence, mystique and baggage. This is particularly palpable for the elite World Class corps; if not in reality, then in myths propogated through forums, etc. which I, from first hand experience, know weighs in to "should I march here or there" by virtue of my kid and his HS friends asking "hey, Mr. D, whattaya think of this corps or that one" (knowing where I marched). My observation is that it may take some individuals trial and error (self awareness) to come to grips with 'the right environment for them'. But the majority of young adults will probably know where their comfort zone and goals will be satisfied in the first few camps (or audition process) or certainly a season. Then maturity and personal character (versus getting pushed by peers, ego) should take over the decision process. The key to longevity and sustainability of the top programs tho is loyalty to which feelings of family, fellowship, and pride must all be nurtured. Corps' which return a nucleus of loyal members year in and year out -- for decades -- establish inner communications and behavior in its ranks regarding how things are done or evolve that members absorb and carry on. That is the drum corps experience -- and with it, at one level or another are rewards NOT necessarily climaxing in a so-called "ring" or finals appearance. Think about it in terms of Alumni organizations -- I'm fortunate and honored to be a part of a rich alumni group (The Cavaliers) to whom are a key element of maintaining the traditions of excellence and expectations of class for decades of our history. An organization cannot come to rely on the foundation of alumni support if the activity (or the organization itself) doesn't "keep" its family together. Asked another way -- 10 or 20 years from now, which corps will you be 'connected" with and cheer for and help out on tour religiously or occassionally if you were associated with several for only 1 brief year at a time? My take-away from corps life are the 10's of very close friends I still have 30+ years later and the hundreds of brothers I meet up with over the years whom are a very strong network personally AND professional (by the way). Through thick and thin, good and bad -- We Are The Corps.

1969 VFW @ Philadelphia -- Cavaliers, Kilties Two totally incredible powerhouse tradition-rich shows of their time. Midwest Power. 1971 Cavaliers Circus Show -- a groundbreaking show with theatrics, athleticism, running drill, incredibly delicate and clean drumline for its time and pure machine execution.

Oldest: 1969 -- Delta Sigma Frog (internal t-shirt in honor of Jim Rousell, Drum Captain, Cavies) Newest: 2007 -- Cavaliers, fan-submitted design, plus Colts Equinox show shirt

Thank you. Your presentations were VERY well organized and presented as a looked-forward-to service. I would hope DCP or DCI would pick up this work as a regular piece in their content next year. Bravo.

OFF TOPIC -- been meaning to connect with you for a very long time: does your corps affiliation refer to Chicago East Side Illiana Lancers? Like back in late 60's early 70's ? My dad was co-founder. And my distant uncle (Art Schmidt) was director. I was scrawny snare kid in those years before going to Cavies. Would love to compare early roots, history and acquantances.

Tusayan said: "The Cadet's narration is so bad that I ..." So, to my post earlier, if there was a more definitive adjucation criteria (e.g., "minus 2 tenths within GE caption -- negatively detracts from ...") and by virtue of such judging guidance diminished their overall score to a more balanced appraisal range, would that address your concern or issue?

From GGarrett: WOW. (IMG:style_emoticons/default/blink.gif) And the weather on this day next year will be... August 8, 2008 Indianapolis. 74 degrees, 30% humidity. 5% variance from lower level to upper level of new dome during sun-setting sequence but stable by finals (assuming "dome roof and windows" closed. But not tested yet of course. Source: National Weather Service records without adjustment for Gore Climatology Institute Global Warming Contribution factors. i.e., ideal performance conditions for DCI World's performances. Sorry, I couldn't resist.

LoveKathyG and Stef make very interesting points that get to (IMO) the root of the "state of the state" 2007 DCI. Parity in our venue has revealed itself in a more intellectual artsy-fartsy portpori (sp?) of offerings. Mature fans (age, exposure, historical, etc.) are having a hard time separating their emotions for sectional-based connection -- snarelines, guard stuff, power horns, drill moves, passion,... From KISS principle of BD to a more cerebral approach of Cadets to the attempts in between of whimsical (Crown, Coats) and in-your-face translation of pop / wow (Cavaliers, Colts) as well as concepts (Phantom, SCV, Boston). The "young-un's" with due respect, are still "reacting" to their gut instincts without experience (corps marching or otherwise) to dis-associate instantaneous "cool" or "wow" factors without regard for their basis. And by parity I really mean, the talent and performance 'capabilities' of the corps and the design teams is astounding. The technical expetise of the performers is almost equal in the top 8-ish. Thus, the above approaches to reaching audiences within the boundaries of the judging criteria has driven a very broad portfolio of "shows" performed excellently to those designs. e.g., BD is exceptional in THEIR production, its intent and delivery. So is Cadets, Cavies, etc. But the DCI adjucation is attempting to judge all these bags in one basket. Today, IMO and evolving since 2004, is we simply HAVE NOT put a definitive criteria for us all to agree on how the different elements will be "factored" into scoring. How do we plus-minus contribution of narration, incredible "make-up or costuming" or props of guards and corps, singing, etc. Adjucation Guidance for Narration & Props Contribution to GE (Vis & Mus) Caption: 0 Not relevant to performance +1 tenth Positively contributes to general effect of visual focus or music presentation +2 tenth Positively contributes to general effect of visual focus and music presentation -1 tenth Negatively detracts from general effect of visual focus or music presentation -2 tenth Negatively detracts from general effect of visual focus and music presentation Would this help us all to more quantitatively put some structure to our arguments? Conclusion IMO. BD is incredible at what they do. But so are Cadets at their presentation. Cavaliers simply has me awed at artistic and interpretative design and its exeution. It has become almost incomparable to judge different shows like Cadets, Cavaliers, PR or Crown or anyone else. And vice versa. And that is crux of our challenge. We've mixed metaphors and attempted to put a essentially turn it into a popularity contest. Whew, I guess I should vent more often instead of lurking in background (or NOT).

Calculations weren't exactly needed I seem to recall being the "sex gods" we were and evidently still are :) And access (i.e., fans awaiting the buses) was facilitated "in the day" that we had occassion to stay in motels or in Garfield or Troooper homes more than gym floors or sleezy places like Syracuse NY. Gosh I miss drum corps. But this is best left for the alumni forum(s) as many of our peers likely reminisce as well.

My first ever post after lurking on the parkbench here for years. So be gentle. And special thanks to Cire, Truman, NeutralNovice and others whom have contributed excellent tracking approaches and fodder for discussion and my personal enjoyment here. I borrowed mips and behavioral algorithms on the Big Blue (IBM blue that is) supercomputer for a micro-second this morning (with help of a distinquished IBM engineer buddy whom forgot more about analytics than I learned at Kellogg business school). We talked about multiple dimensions of scoring, judging, so-called psychographics, trend analysis and behavioral decision-making to create a predictive model. Without knowing a few key constraints (like specific judging panel and their peculiarities) and making some assumptive leaps, here's my guess for fun. Officially stated: IMO. [Model created to ID where Cavaliers will end up -- yes, FMM, but hopefully 35+ years drum corps experience attenuates too much bias] Caption/Position, Score & Ordinals for Cavaliers -- GE, #1 39.0 #1 Vis, #2 Mus VIS, #1 29.5 #2 Prf, #2 Ensm, #1 Guard MUSIC, #2 (or close 3) 29.1 Brass #5 (Music=5, Tech=3) Ensmb #2 (Music=1, Tech=2) Percx #5 with a 19.1 avg Total = 97.60 Cavaliers 2nd BDevils 97.55 3rd Cadets 97.40 4th SCV 97.25 5th Phantom 97.20 (Data sources: SF, QF and wt'd Regionals in that order) Personal Homer tag for my brothers and the Nation While result of semi-quantitative analysis is interesting, we already know we won by personal measures! Great season for ALL.