Machiavelli

Or, two nights of Prelims with only the Top 12 playing on Saturday. The problem with either the OP's idea or mine, is that the same corps (number of) will have a shot at Saturday night. No way, no how was 14, 15, or 16 getting to Saturday night this year. The current format works just fine.

Thanks! I had heard that the 2006 d line had a lot of Texans that went with CM to Cadets when he left. It could be a west coast misinterpretation!

Well said, but I think it goes beyond that. With Blue Star rising, there are a lot of really good corps within a relatively short driving distance for mid-western kids. Sure a lot of kids will fly wherever they need to, but just looking at the tiers represented in IL, WI, OH, IA, Madison and Colts will probably draw auditionees who only want to march there because they absolutely love the corps, or they will get a lower quality of talent to draw from. Texas drummers will follow McNutt to which ever corps he works, and jazzers with chops will go to BD or another top tier corps first. If they fail to make that line, they will look elsewhere. Crown will get a lot of "horses" n all sections because they are knocking at the door, that's human nature and I can't fault a kid for wanting to win. As talent filters down, spots will fill, leaving the lowest tier corps with the least amount of talent. Regardless of how well the show is designed, or how great the staff is at teaching, you can't expect mediocre talent to beat (or compete) with superior talent. The days of every town having a corps that they locals are dedicated and committed to are gone. It's an international activity that costs a bunch of money to participate. Here on California, corps can rehearse outside in good weather all year, which makes BD and SCV attractive to some winter stricken kids. I had to spend $2,500.00 for dues plus travel and incidentals, I'd want the most bang for my buck, including a sure thing for a Saturday night performance in Indy...preferably late into the evening! I hope vets don't leave Madison, but since they have to audition for a spot, and they have friends in corps who they met throughout the summer, Madison may experience a loss of vets. I know a lot of 70s and 80s era Scouts who would never have thought of marching anywhere else, but this is a different generation used to booking travel plans across the country. Loyalty is more fickle. I'm sure Chris and the staff have a plan to retain members.

1. 1976 (Everything...and Bonnie) 2. 1982 (That guard and the wings...hornline wasn't bad either) 3. 1989 (Solo not withstanding) 4. 2002 (That guard and the hair dropping out of the bowlers!!!) 5. 1992 (When a Man Loves a Woman...)

Since joining DCP, I didn't have an avatar, Tom. Come on, it's just a bit of humor. Dispute my opinions based on the content, not based on my choice of an avatar. That would be like ripping on guys for using a rainbow being pro/anti this party or that party in their signatures. I think you're one of the most logical and unemotional posters on DCP and I enjoy your takes on things, regardless of your opinion of my avatar. BTW...I liked your post about Academy 2008 and 2009. Again, intelligent and insight rather than inciteful.

I thought it was clear. Sadly, Madison just isn't very good this year when measured against the competition and the scoring criteria. They are 15th 0f 22, which makes them mediocre. It's not to stir anything up at all. In context with the subject at the time, it's realistic. I'm still a fan. Using feminim labels as pejoratives won't hurt my feelings...

Pseudo-intellectuals rely on quote from others’ original works, just as you have done repeatedly in this thread. True intellectuals generate meaningful and lasting ideas within their own gray matter. Rather than proselytizing using quotes, convince the naysayers to convert based on your won articulated passion. It should prove to be much more effective.

Congratulations to all of the I & E winners and competitors. It's impressive how much extra work these members put in above and beyond that of their fellow marching members. Special congratulations to the Madison members who placed well and who will read this thread. To you, my hope is that khoutler won't poo-poo your accomplishment by saying that all you did was earn "a subjective number assigned to you by a panel of judges". There is nothing wrong with winning. That someone else must "lose" by not winning is a fact of life. Good luck in Quarters tonight Madison and all your alumni, family, and fans. I forgot...pow.

2005 - The Carmen Project ____________Great concept performed well (Carmen should have been taller) 2003 - Gold, Green and Red ___________ Wow, what a nice change from 2002 2004 - MadiSonic ____________________ Great horn book 2001- Hot Jazz - Madison Style _________ Good horn line, weak soloists, iffy book 2000 - The Cossack Brotherhood _______ Nice points, but I didn't get it 2006 - Primal Forces _________________ Had potential, just didn't hit its stride 2007 - Unbound _____________________ Young kids trying to do their best 2002 - Conquest _____________________ Weak soloist, guard was a train wreck 2008 - La Noche de la Iguana ___________ Seemed high school bandish lite 2009 - El Relámpago __________________ I just don't like it

Superb: marked to the highest degree by grandeur, excellence, brilliance, or competence Excellent: very good of its kind : eminently good Average: a ratio expressing the average performance Mediocre: of moderate or low quality, value, ability, or performance Poor: inferior in quality or value I guess you could apply these definitions to the positions of the corps...1 - 22. I guess I was mistaken.

I never suggested they quit working to improve. That's not manly or honorable. But some people here have been ignoring the reality that Madison just isn't very good this year when compared to the competition and the trend line is not pointing up. I'm talking about maintaining realistic expectations and recognizing that all is not rosy in the land of Cheese. Asking or expecting Madison to surpass the corps in front of them now is like expecting to bench 400 in a meet when your max to date is 290. No one would realistically suggest that that was possible. My other complaint is with the limited people who seem to think squeaking into semis is special. "IT'S NOT FOR MADISON", I would shout front the highest mountain. But that's because I have a memory of the '75 corps, and '81, and '88, and '94, and '96. My memory doesn't begin in 2007. If enough people subscribe to the philosophy that placement doesn't matter, and mediocrity is acceptable, I fear that support for Madison will dwindle in these economically hard times and Madison as we know them may seek to exist. While I'm not in a position to know, I wonder who has sold a higher dollar amount of souvies; Blue Stars or Madison. Income comes with competitive success.

Great post, mobrien.

I get that...funny!

Hockey's stupid, and the OP couldn't have been more obscure with a reference!!!!! How about the Jordan rules?????? Would more people get that?

SCV adding Bottle Dance in 1982...desperate move that didn't work.