Phan_of_Drumming

Visual has been KILLING this corps this summer. And for the last few years, really. Sounds like an instructional/staff issue to me. If their visual were at the level of their music they'd be up there with BK. They have a rehearsal day tomorrow - maybe time for an all visual day? Bring in some outside help? I don't know what the solution is, but visual scores have dragged this corps down for a long time. Must be frustrating to be in that color guard, with how high they score by comparison.

I was too harsh. Sorry. The point remains - Madison's show lacks content compared to the corps around them. Just as they have the last few years, they'll continue to drop in the standings as the season goes on because of that disparity. This shouldn't be a surprise anymore to Madison fans (of which I am one).It sucks because it's outside of the members' control, but we've reached the point in the season where design is going to start mattering more than execution. Just like Blue Stars won't catch BK or Cavies this year, no matter how well they play their show, Madison won't keep up with Boston, Crossmen, or Stars. If they miss Finals - which wouldn't surprise me - it's 100% on the design team, just like it has been for years.

The content column of the recaps should enlighten you.It's the middle of July. Just being clean isn't going to win shows anymore. How many times do Madison homers/alums have to see this story to understand? Content matters.

In another year, with these shows, I would say there's a chance. But we've seen a concerted effort to keep scores reasonably low at major shows this year, so I would be very surprised if that happened. This is maybe the strongest Top 5 I've ever seen live. I just don't think the scores will reflect that because we don't want another 99.650.

All of that said about the show, has anyone heard any updates about the Scouts truck driver who required medical attention today? I hope he/she is alright.

Agreed completely. It's a very well done, tasty vanilla, which is...fine. But I love me some moose tracks or rocky road. Make it interesting for me, is what I'm asking.

By simple orchestration I mean the show uses the same basic chords in the same basic keys. There is little layering and environmental demand to bump up the difficulty, and what they do play is all the same thing in different contexts. To my ears, at least. This was a common topic on DCP back in 2012, when Crown had a killer brass line that basically only played variations on Bb major chords, whereas Blue Devils, with maybe a technically inferior group, went all over as far as key, as far as what types of complex chords they were playing, and all that. To try and rescue this failed art analogy, Scouts show is one very pleasing shade of yellow. I want some blues and greens and oranges and reds. It has nothing to do with whether the show is happy or sad or dark or whatever, it all is related to how they choose to express their theme. And right now they're doing so very blandly for my taste.As far as depth, I mean the show is visually bland and not terribly demanding. More could be going on, for sure. The best measure of depth, to me, is how many times I can watch a show and see or hear something new. After seeing Scouts live three times now, I feel like I don't need to hear it again. That isn't the case for groups in their tier right now - Phantom, Blue Stars, Crossmen, etc. I feel like I've gotten all the show has to offer after just a few listens. I don't mean to be taking shots at the kids - they're performing the crap out of this show. I just have a feeling we're in for another season of Scouts being Top 8-ish early season, then getting passed by more difficult and complex shows by Atlanta to end up barely Top 10, if that. I wouldn't be surprised if this show fell out of Finals. And that's not on the members, that's on the staff for not sufficiently challenging the members. There also is something to the critique that an organization which doesn't accept women using cardboard cutouts of women in dresses in their show needs to move into the 21st century. Not saying they have to let women into the corps, but the optics are not good. Just my opinion. Take it for what little it's worth.

I don't think anyone criticizes the show design because of the theme. Lack of depth, easy features, simplistic orchestration...have nothing to do with the theme.

Nobody seems to have started a thread for this one yet, so I figured I would! Small show, but the Madison/Blue Stars direct comparison should be nice, even without a full panel. Weather is perfect. Mid-60s, blue skies, absolutely no chance of rain (FINALLY). Show begins: 7 p.m. CT Performance Order: Blue Saints (7:08) Music City (7:26) Legends (7:44) INTERMISSION Pioneer (8:22) Madison Scouts (8:40) Blue Stars (8:58) Only a partial panel tonight: GE 1 - S. Bertelle GE 2 - J. Kennedy Visual Ana - J.R. Carlisle Music Ana - R. Greenwell Percussion - Jeff Queen Would be nice to have a full panel to finally get a good look at Scouts v Stars, one after the other at the same show, but no luck. Still, should be an excellent show! If you're there, let us know how it goes!

Agreed. Blue Stars may not be as loud, but they have a beautiful sound. And since the beginning of the season they've only gotten louder. The new brass caption head for Blue Stars seems to be taking a "let's build a good sound, then push the volume" approach, and I love it. I think it's more likely they make the Top 8 than drop out of Finals.

I'm not seeing Stars below Madison and Phantom. I'm sorry, but their percussion is on another level from everyone else around them in scores. Especially the pit. Also, I understand that Scouts have a feel good throw back show, but putting them above Stars in GE makes zero sense to me. My scores for tonight had Stars a half point ahead of Phantom and a solid two points above Madison. I fully expect this will be the case come Finals.

To be honest if I'm the Blue Stars I take that score and run with it. Once the sun went down - right around the end of Madison's run - everything was completely covered in condensation. At least one or two guard members slipped on the Blue Stars' stages and I'm sure the field was a mess. Going on last after a superior corps doesn't help either, but I'd attribute the big flip in scores to the field conditions more than anything else. Fully except Blue Stars to break 70 next show and stay atop Scouts moving forward. Also pretty frightening that Bluecoats' run could have been stronger if not for that. I could have seen them breaking 80.

The Blue Stars (who are housed at the show site) had to move inside for the last hour or so of rehearsal due to rain. Currently still coming down, but hopes remain high for later tonight.

Single gender corps automatically reject half of the available talent pool. I don't think it should be so easy to wave away that question.Not saying they should change their policy or that the corps isn't competitive exclusively because of that policy. But to completely ignore the challenges of fielding a full and competitive corps on half the available talent seems deliberately homer-ish to me.

Stars pulling away from Scouts AND still have more room to improve than Scouts, per recaps. Will be interesting to see where those two fit in with BAC, BK, Crossmen, etc. I can't wait for the first regional. Also a huge congratulations to Pioneer, who definitely held their own tonight and sounded quite good from what I saw! I predict the battle for Finals this year will include more corps than it has in many years (Scouts, Troopers, Crossmen, Boston, Academy, Colts, maybe Pacific Crest and Spirit? Am I forgetting any?) Such a good crop of 10-16 this year.

Last time Blue Stars and Bluecoats met with a drum judge on hand, they were only separated by one tenth in that caption. Obviously Bluecoats will take the overall score but I'm interested in seeing how the captions play out.

Typically front ensembles have two or three marimba parts and two vibraphone parts. The inside keyboard players will play one part and the outside players will play the other part.That said, there are also many moments in shows where the parts diverge from one another completely. It's not unusual to see one vibraphone player on bells, one on one vibraphone part, one on a second vibraphone part, and one on an auxiliary instrument. The same goes for marimbas. Four part harmony is not uncommon, split runs are becoming routine these days, and with the number of auxiliary instruments on the field now I wouldn't be surprised to see the number of pit performers increase before they decrease. As far as amplification goes, the more natural sound you're getting the better. This is why members are still instructed in technique that lets them play with an abnormally large sound (compared to concert playing). The amplification can only do so much. If you tried to amplify one marimba and one vibraphone to match the sound of a full keyboard line, you would NOT like the results.

Have you ever thought that mentality might be part of the problem?

If they do a standstill show it would be in exhibition, I think. No word from DCI yet. It sure would be nice to get something official.

Multiple corps are rehearsing show tunes in preparation for an indoor standstill performance. Sounds like the writing is all but officially on the wall.

After last year's show and the growth in their design this year, I don't think Blue Stars needs to be in that conversation anymore. They're in the next group up with Phantom, BK, Cavaliers, etc. Just my opinion.

I think Blue Stars get third place, with second or above in guard. Bluecoats takes this one in all other captions.

As a recent age-out, I can tell you that DCP has absolutely zero influence in the drum corps world as far as show design. DCI could keep up with posts here for customer support related to streaming stuff or the like, but if a poster here thinks they have ever influenced a field production with their comments, they are simply laughably wrong. Current members will occasionally make fun of DCP or what people post on Facebook, but that's the extent of it. People read what is posted. But there's no influence and certainly no respect given to any of it. It's a punch line more than anything else. Just the hard truth.

After getting an idea of each group's show: 1) Santa Clara Vanguard 2) Blue Devils 3) Bluecoats 4) Cadets 5) Carolina Crown 6) Cavaliers 7) Blue Stars 8) Phantom Regiment 9) Blue Knights 10) Boston Crusaders 11) Crossmen 12) Madison Scouts Finals Cut 13) Colts 14) Pacific Crest 15) Troopers 16) Spirit of Atlanta

The Blue Stars should be one of the feel good stories of DCI this year. A founding member of DCI, they fold, come back, work their way back to World Class, make Finals, get knocked out of Finals, then get BACK in, and become a contender again after their 50th anniversary. Since 2012 they've started something special over at Blue Stars. Between Saucedo's brass writing, Shapiro's guard, and the killer front ensemble...this group could be the next new champion, after Bluecoats of course! They're on their way. But of course that means they have to really prove themselves. They don't have the luxury of having a bad year get looked over, like Cavies 2012 or Phantom 2009. This is their opportunity to jump up to the table with the big boys and leave the borderline finalists behind for good. Miss that opportunity and it's back to the hovering around 12th range. If this year's show doesn't live up to its potential, they'll have to work that much harder the next few years just to stay in their 10-12 bracket. If they make this show what it can be? They could easily crack the Top 8 and solidify their position as a top corps. It's really exciting.