Who should "design teams" write for?

[Hrothgar15]

Do both. Fulfill your artistic vision while giving the fans what they want. Find a happy medium.

[Dave_G]

I've known plenty of people to say that. Infact, a friend of mine who marched the Cadets in 2006 told me that. CMMs are more honest and know what they want than people on this board give them credit for.

No question, I can't count the number of times I've absolutely ripped at least one aspect of a show I marched in any given summer after the fact. If anything, I've noticed corps members to be more critical of their own shows more then other shows they get the chance to see. It's just part of wanting to "max out" ones own performance and show.

Now back on topic, I have no problem with corps trying to "play to the crowd" (as if "the crowd" will ever agree on what exactly it is that they want anyway), but sometimes there just needs to be a show written for the purpose of writing it. Something that pushes peoples buttons and requires them to think, weather it's positively or negatively about the show, is what is nessicary to push the small sect of music and performance art that is drum corps forward.

[Einstein On The Beach]

Stuff removed cause I said so

Edited September 5, 2007 by Einstein On The Beach

[cowtown]

Something that pushes peoples buttons and requires them to think, weather it's positively or negatively about the show, is what is nessicary to push the small sect of music and performance art that is drum corps forward.

no, why would you think that?

to connect with people you do have to push their buttons anyway

and what is forward?

the world works in cause and effects more akin to tangents and than a vector or direct, liner path – imagine 5 unequal forces pushing on an orange, the orange will not go in a straight line – that’s kind of how life and art is, you win some, you lose some, 2 steps forward 3 steps back…maybe I should just walk around it and is it every art without reason, is 'just because' enough to count as 'forward'

I seem some common logical fallacies running around this site

One is, change = good…not true change can be bad too, the other

Visionaries pushing the boundaries, trying to move us forward… you could say the same about Stalin and many did

[cowtown]

you took it the wrong way, my intent was not to insult you but as I'm sure you know by not marching next year situations change, life happens and some things have to get left behind. With all the intention in the world one can never say for sure, for sure.

[rant comming, stop reading]

rant removed

{carry on}

Edited September 5, 2007 by cowtown

[year1buick]

One is, change = good…not true change can be bad too, the other

Visionaries pushing the boundaries, trying to move us forward… you could say the same about Stalin and many did

One other thing about life, and the "real" world: things seldom fall neatly into black and white categories. Most things fall somewhere within a continuum. So, just as change does not always = good, neither does static position. ("...you could say the same thing about Segregation...")

Though, I suppose it's a bit of a moot point, because there's no such thing as absolute position anyway. (Those darn unequal lines of force will always get ya...)

[Tom Brace]

Do both. Fulfill your artistic vision while giving the fans what they want. Find a happy medium.

Happy mediums end up in 16th place.

[Tom Brace]

They should write for me, the loyal 30 year plus fan that has made it to about every finals and dropped a ton of change on them – regardless of their placements over the years

But they are not writing for me, they are trying to out bando each other with their group think of acceptable composers and trends, the cliquish-follow-me nature of the current shows leaves me flat and less than entertained. You lose me, you lose my money and frankly, the kids are not cutting it as fans, they rarely have. All the generations that came after me, very few stick around and even fewer last as long as I have been around. But DCI is wrongly mistaken that I'll keep accepting whatever they offer, I won’t. And that’s why I’m so vocal about what I like and don’t like in DCI today. So there is the answer you hate and will reject – but you, the guy who won’t even march his age-out year, will you be around drum corps in 30 plus years?

I doubt it.

Now, if you want a less drum corps answer to your question, one from a person that was successful in creating and selling their music…

It depends

I started it because I enjoyed it and that was enough. Then other people enjoyed it too, we got label interest. Went into a studio with a big time producer and he changed things to make us more commercial, more appealing to the masses. We had to, see that’s part of the deal. We lost control, willingly for the opportunity – it was either that or slave at day jobs; it was a compromise I was happy to make. Until I heard the final version of our fist single, it sold well in Australia but it was almost unrecognizable to me, I was embarrassed by it. So we broke up that one, escaped our contracts without debt but a new name and minus the other ‘primary’ artist, as that would have violated our contract and then we started again but different as role changed to keep us amused.

This time I produced, more success, more acclaim but really…it was always about pleasing myself often in a stupid way too. Meaning, with lyrics, I’d try to be cleaver, show everyone how smart I was, make all sorts of allusions, metaphors and I always avoided the obvious rhyme. Yawn, thank goodness I out grew my pretentious, trying to prove myself phase here's how... while bored in the studio, a fairly regular occurrence, I intentionally wrote the dumbest, most vile song I could. It was our biggest hit (think Larry Craig). I was so sick of that song; I wrongly refused to play it for a year. I insulted and abused my fans (more so than my typical throwing raw meat and fire works at them) they paid and came to see something I had no intention of delivering. Then one day, back stage at Lollapalooza, a wiser, older rock god, friend of mine set me straight. "you have to play the hits and give the fans what they want, thats why you are here" After that, I always played the hits, I always went for the obvious line, rhyme and things went well. So yeah, it’s a give and take constantly but every artist (that’s wants to do it more than just a hobby) needs some sort of success as a sense of validation to keep them pushing on, making more art. If a band plays in the woods and nobody is there to hear them, are they really a band?

OK...this is a lot to digest...but let's see if I can make some simple points.

1. No...design teams aren't going to design for you. Because "the yous" are different in every seat in the audience. The populist approach never appeals to the artist UNLESS they are out to MAKE money. DCI is really not a profit minded entity. They are not-for-profit by their very nature. Think starving artist instead of rock star/producer pandering to the masses.

2. If you are unstatisfied...move on. It's your right. It's what your calling seems to be. Don't deny your calling. Go with it. You'll be far less frustrated. Free yourself. Take your body, soul, wealth, treasure, resources and ATTITUDE and go support DCA. They have a seat waiting for you to occupy. If DCI is so doomed as you say...well, we'll learn that lesson then won't we. You have a place that is begging for more fans...it's called DCA and lookie...there are discussion boards for that organization as well. Go...be happy. Life owes you an opportunity to be happy. Pursue happiness is a RIGHT guaranteed by our founders. I believe you should exercise your right.

Adios.

[CuriousMe]

What would you expect them to say; "Yeah I worked my tail off all summer but our show was crap."

In a word, yes. If that's how they really felt. I've had negative comments about shows I've performed...I would question the truthfulness of anyone who only had positive comments about every show they marched.

With that corps specifically, one thing they emphasize to their members is that your life is about your choices. You're not held hostage to anything you don't choose. So, yes, I think they're telling the truth, and no...I don't think they were "held hostage" by the design team. I think they chose to be a part of that show.

Peace,

CuriousMe

[stifled4mallettechnique]

Well, obviously "design teams" should write whatever they want and for whoever they want. Maybe they'll keep making money doing it, or maybe they won't. Maybe they'll care, or maybe they won't. Maybe they'll earn fame or infamy, or maybe they won't. Maybe the results of their previous work will influence their future work, or maybe they won't. Regardless of how their work is received, they absolutely have the right to create art as they see fit. (Obviously, certain forms of art would be limited by law as to how it could be presented, but I digress.)

Since the answer is so obvious, please ask the question you really want to ask. If it's "Don't you think I'm cool because I like artists that shun the public?", the answer is no. :P