What Happens if the Cadets win?

[DrumCorpsFan27]

I prefer my art to entertain me rather than make me talk about why it's annoying me.

[mohanico]

If the Cadets win this year, start investing in livestock futures.

The Evil Hopkins will undoubtedly start sacrificing cattle, goats, and little piggies in an effort to conjure up the demons of electronics for next years' show.

Don't forget little children.

[bedford]

Don't forget little children.

And puppies

[DrumCorpsFan27]

I have read many commentaries for the last four years and I find the whole discussion concerning the Cadets rather interesting. I have listened people complain about their production style and how offensive their story-telling is – either through voice over or props. I try to compare this to various art styles and these thoughts come to mind.

Of course Cadets changed drum corp for the better in the early eighties and we have never looked back. Star of Indiana's wonderful production of Walton's 'Belshazar's Feast' provided us the nuance and a sublime power of a true art form. Probably their defining moment of neo-contemporary drum corps art was with 'The Music of Barber and Bartok' which exposed people to music that they would never had listened to and then they brought it to the Broadway stage for millions more to see. Do we dismiss their efforts because they performed visual music that may have made some people uncomfortable?

Mozart had little acceptance during his life – yet he is considered our most revered composer. Bach was unknown throughout most of Europe, yet he is considered our Baroque giant; Beethoven couldn't even hear his own music yet he was a master genius; Wagner wrote a 16 hour opera – how's that for pushing the envelope? Stravinsky's music started a riot during a performance – how has he changed history? Have you heard Stravinsky's serialistic music? Is it less valid than Petroushka or Firebird?

Does Piccasso have a place in history? How about Klee, Monet, Chagall, Cezanne, Dali, Warhol, Pollack, Ernst et. al.? Do we dismiss them just because they created art that may have created discomfort? What about our contemporary poets and writers?

Many show themes are created from concepts of chaos, violence, sex and conflict resolution. Where would drum corps be without 'Spartacus', 'West Side Story' '007' and 'The Godfather'?

I think that many people dislike the Cadets (especially this year) because their show concepts make them feel uncomfortable – God forbid that may happen at a drum corps show. Don't want to talk about cancer, death, unhappiness, trying to find yourself – maybe because we all struggle with those same issues and we don't want to be reminded of our own worries and weaknesses.

All art needs people to push the envelope – for better or for worse. Cadets have been doing that for thirty years.

And what if the Cadets win? Will we have a riot like at the Paris Ballet during the performance of "The Rite of Spring"? It is just my humble opinion that most remarkable and memorable moments in history are not created during moments of mediocrity but rather when people are feeling discomfort. So love them or hate them, the bottom line is that I am proud of those kids – they do not accept mediocrity, they are pushing the envelope and doing it artistically.

Now, are you trying to say that Hopkins and The Cadets are akin to Mozart, Bach, Beethoven, Stravinsky, Picasso, Monet, or any of the others you have mentioned?

Drum corps is not that kind of art. They come with an annual program, present it a couple dozen times and that's it. It's gone. Poetry is saved on paper. Symphonies can be replayed by orchestras, keeping them alive. Paintings are preserved for centuries for people to see first hand.

Not drum corps performances. A couple dozen performances and it can never be experienced first hand again. So, let's quit putting The Cadets or George Hopkins (or any corps) in the same arena as those perennial greats you have listed.

Edited July 9, 2008 by DrumCorpsFan27

[Huntington Mallets]

Drum corps is not that kind of art. They come with an annual program, present it a couple dozen times and that's it. It's gone. Poetry is saved on paper. Symphonies can be replayed by orchestras, keeping them alive. Paintings are preserved for centuries for people to see first hand.

Not drum corps performances. A couple dozen performances and it can never be experienced first hand again. So, let's quit putting The Cadets or George Hopkins in the same arena as those perenial greats you have listed.

So corps can't replay charts???

....k

[KingJoeVII]

Now, are you trying to say that Hopkins and The Cadets are akin to Mozart, Bach, Beethoven, Stravinsky, Picasso, Monet, or any of the others you have mentioned?

Drum corps is not that kind of art. They come with an annual program, present it a couple dozen times and that's it. It's gone. Poetry is saved on paper. Symphonies can be replayed by orchestras, keeping them alive. Paintings are preserved for centuries for people to see first hand.

Not drum corps performances. A couple dozen performances and it can never be experienced first hand again. So, let's quit putting The Cadets or George Hopkins (or any corps) in the same arena as those perennial greats you have listed.

something I have always thought about is how to make drum corps shows repeatable...I mean there is nothing technically restricting it. Does anyone wanna get together and recreate Cadets 2000??

[KingJoeVII]

So corps can't replay charts???

....k

i think he means that corps dont just replay entire shows set for set and note for note, the way that orchestras recreate symphonies...

[CrunchyTenor]

So corps can't replay charts???

....k

Well, except for "My Favorite Things"* and "Malaguena."**

* Bridgemen arrangment redone by Sky Ryders

** Muchachos arrangement redone and expanded by Madison Scouts

Garry in Vegas

Edited July 9, 2008 by CrunchyTenor

[skewerz]

I have read many commentaries for the last four years and I find the whole discussion concerning the Cadets rather interesting. I have listened people complain about their production style and how offensive their story-telling is – either through voice over or props. I try to compare this to various art styles and these thoughts come to mind.

Of course Cadets changed drum corp for the better in the early eighties and we have never looked back. Star of Indiana’s wonderful production of Walton’s ‘Belshazar’s Feast’ provided us the nuance and a sublime power of a true art form. Probably their defining moment of neo-contemporary drum corps art was with ‘The Music of Barber and Bartok’ which exposed people to music that they would never had listened to and then they brought it to the Broadway stage for millions more to see. Do we dismiss their efforts because they performed visual music that may have made some people uncomfortable?

Mozart had little acceptance during his life – yet he is considered our most revered composer. Bach was unknown throughout most of Europe, yet he is considered our Baroque giant; Beethoven couldn’t even hear his own music yet he was a master genius; Wagner wrote a 16 hour opera – how’s that for pushing the envelope? Stravinsky’s music started a riot during a performance – how has he changed history? Have you heard Stravinsky’s serialistic music? Is it less valid than Petroushka or Firebird?

Does Piccasso have a place in history? How about Klee, Monet, Chagall, Cezanne, Dali, Warhol, Pollack, Ernst et. al.? Do we dismiss them just because they created art that may have created discomfort? What about our contemporary poets and writers?

Many show themes are created from concepts of chaos, violence, sex and conflict resolution. Where would drum corps be without ‘Spartacus’, ‘West Side Story’ ‘007’ and ‘The Godfather’?

I think that many people dislike the Cadets (especially this year) because their show concepts make them feel uncomfortable – God forbid that may happen at a drum corps show. Don’t want to talk about cancer, death, unhappiness, trying to find yourself – maybe because we all struggle with those same issues and we don’t want to be reminded of our own worries and weaknesses.

All art needs people to push the envelope – for better or for worse. Cadets have been doing that for thirty years.

And what if the Cadets win? Will we have a riot like at the Paris Ballet during the performance of “The Rite of Spring”? It is just my humble opinion that most remarkable and memorable moments in history are not created during moments of mediocrity but rather when people are feeling discomfort. So love them or hate them, the bottom line is that I am proud of those kids – they do not accept mediocrity, they are pushing the envelope and doing it artistically.

1. They are telling us nothing that we don't already know. If by uncomfortable, you mean irritated, then I guess yes, it makes me uncomfortable. The Cadets have an incredible horn line...an incredible drum line...an incredible guard...all of this is used to accent a badly performed, unjudged gimmick that would be scoffed at at any high school program. Their presentation is condescending and pretentious. And as to being reminded of our own worries....that why participate in artistic activities...to forget about our own worries.

2. All art does NOT need to push the envelope. Do you consider rock music an art? I don't see Nickleback, or Staind, or Daughtry pushing the envelope. Amazingly, a lot of people still enjoy their "artistic presentation". And yes...if the OP can compare the Cadets to Mozart, I can compare Nickleback to drum corps.

3. This use of narration does NOT push the envelope.

Is it just me, or does it seem like the cadets (the corps behind the narration) gets put on a hypothetical pedestal by anti narration people, just for the sake of bashing the narration itself??

uh...yeah. Do you blame the boy peeing in the river for the pollution, or the big chemical company dumping into the river?

I know it's been said MANY times already on these boards, but if someone has to explain your show while it happens, you designed it wrong.

Yes, it's been said...and as always...it's correct...IMO, of course.

[Pinwiz]

Cancer does not equal Badassery.

Surviving cancer > any drum corps badassery.