Pioneer vs. ?

[violet]

Keep in mind that when you talk about in-state and even in-region recruiting, Pioneer has a number of corps within a 4/5 hour drive of them. Depending on the point in WI (or nearby state), these corps may be even closer to potential recruits:

Madison Scouts (1 hour)

Blue Stars (3 hours, more or less)

Phantom Regiment (2 hours)

Cavaliers (2 hours)

Colts (might be as many as 5, as getting across Sconnie from Milwaukee is slightly weird)

Wisconsin has 3 WC corps, and there are 3 more in neighboring states. It's a strong region for choice for students who want to stay 'local' for drum corps.

[Tom Brace]

This is the second year for the current staff. Donny Allen returned in 2009, and they moved up a place. He returned this year along with Adam Hill, the percussion caption head - this is also Adam's second year. They replaced the Color Guard caption head this year. In terms of staff, they are doing a lot of the right things. It is just going to take some time.

Their biggest problem, this year, is executing the drill. That is nothing more than inexperience.

Without slamming the current staff, I mean Adam went to college with my son. It's not a fair comparison between Madison's current staff and Pioneer's current staff. Again, Pioneer is making steps. Madison made leaps...with anti-gravity boots last off-season.

Staff's cost money, and while they are no guarantee, there seems to be a corollary between the cost, championship experience, etc. and how a corps places.

This thread is about why OTHER corps place higher than Pioneer. I believe all corps have members. All corps have instruments. I believe it is the instructional staff and what they do with the members and instruments that determines in great degree, the placement. If Pioneer wants to be a finalist, they must continue taking the steps to improve their staff. That's what it's going to take.

[PeeJay]

If Pioneer wants to be a finalist, they must continue taking the steps to improve their staff. That's what it's going to take.

Agree! And that is not happening overnight, certainly not if you want to stay financially healthy. Pioneer is one of a few World Class corps that is, owns all their vehicles, instruments and their own land & building.....

[brassensemble]

I've always had great things to say about Pioneer but...

Only 8 kids from WI and just 2 of those from Milwaukee. SHAME.

What happened to the affiliation with the Boys and Girls Club?

Tell me that you're serious when you say Pioneer recruits heavily in WI.

If you're going to train kids from scratch why not do it locally? It sure worked back when Pioneer was at the top of their game. What worked back then? Please re-visit that strategy.

Good Luck in 2010

Better Every Day

I am very serious that heavy recruiting is taking place in the Milwaukee area, as well as the state. In Milwaukee, things have changed radically in the past 20 years in regards to music. The Milwaukee Public Schools are down to about 4 bands in the entire City of Milwaukee, most of which have less than 30 members. Out of those, only 1 "Riverside High School" has a marching band that participates in the WSMA State Marching Band Championships each year. Most of the MPS high schools have dropped their band programs. The average age of the Milwaukee Boys and Girls Club members is under 13. We have looked into that, but during the past decade the interest from them has dropped, primarily, I believe, because music has taken a definite back seat (or has become non-existent) in their schools. Recruiting does take place in Milwaukee and the suburban high schools, as well as the WSMA Band Shows each year.

It used to be a common courtesy that a corps would not recruit in another corps' territory. That does not seem to be the case these days. We have other corps openly recruiting at our doorsteps. We can tolerate that, but I still get an uneasy feeling doing the same thing in another corps' area. It is a shame that it has come down to every man for himself and a disregard your brother corps.

Yes, it is much easier and more productive to recruit in areas that have strong marching band programs. They come to you having been trained well and have the built in motivation to work hard towards the goal of excellence.

Will we take inexperienced youth? Absolutely! We will train and develop them. As said in a previous post, we are not able to march dozens of snare drummers. But we will find an area in the corps where they can become successful. Yes, we have saxophone players playing baritone. We have young lady woodwind players in the color guard. If a young student comes to us with the attitude that he/she is willing to do anything and comes to all of the rehearsal camps, etc. we will find them a place in the corps.

If our goal was primarily numerical as to score and placement, we would not do the above. But Pioneer exists for the purpose of serving its youth by providing them with a wholesome experience through an excellent music / visual educational program, along with a positive social experience. Don't get me wrong. Competition is also important to our Better Every Day philosophy, but the main emphasis is on the member.

So to answer you, yes, we definitely desire to train local kids from scratch. We work very hard to recruit them. We definitely promote the aspect to them that Pioneer is like a big and friendly family where everyone is important. But it seems that commitment (the amount of time and effort necessary, as well as their financial obligation to the corps) definitely limits the amount of local youth willing to participate.

It's sad because we can definitely fill the void that their schools are not providing. However, we will not give up trying!

Edited July 27, 2010 by brassensemble

[dcikon2]

The Milwaukee Public Schools sound like other urban school districts. I know of a few band programs outside the city (Wauwatosa). I am not familiar with the marching band programs in the Fox Valley or Green Bay area. Good luck with recruiting. The band programs here in Kansas aren't nothing like the ones in Texas. However, there are a few who are starting to march. I am hoping that a couple of my guard members will march next year.

[Ed from Kansas]

The Milwaukee Public Schools sound like other urban school districts. I know of a few band programs outside the city (Wauwatosa). I am not familiar with the marching band programs in the Fox Valley or Green Bay area. Good luck with recruiting. The band programs here in Kansas aren't nothing like the ones in Texas. However, there are a few who are starting to march. I am hoping that a couple of my guard members will march next year.

The problem for people that live in Kansas is the distance the kids have to travel to participate in a drum corps. The closet corps from where we live is in Denver (Blue Knights). Other than that it is a 7-13 hour drive to attend camps, etc. The music programs in Kansas, though suffering from budget cuts, are alive and well. Our 5A high school marches over 150 kids in their band.

Maybe Pioneer should relocate to Kansas, it used to be a pretty good drum corps state with the Argonne Rebels and Sky Ryders. I'll bet they could field a corps with kids from this state if the opportunity existed.

[PeeJay]

Maybe Pioneer should relocate to Kansas, it used to be a pretty good drum corps state with the Argonne Rebels and Sky Ryders. I'll bet they could field a corps with kids from this state if the opportunity existed.

Could do, but why did Sky Ryders move to Texas then....

[Tom D'Bomb]

Without slamming the current staff, I mean Adam went to college with my son. It's not a fair comparison between Madison's current staff and Pioneer's current staff. Again, Pioneer is making steps. Madison made leaps...with anti-gravity boots last off-season.

Staff's cost money, and while they are no guarantee, there seems to be a corollary between the cost, championship experience, etc. and how a corps places.

This thread is about why OTHER corps place higher than Pioneer. I believe all corps have members. All corps have instruments. I believe it is the instructional staff and what they do with the members and instruments that determines in great degree, the placement. If Pioneer wants to be a finalist, they must continue taking the steps to improve their staff. That's what it's going to take.

You always have the right answer... what corps do you teach?

[HockeyDad]

So to answer you, yes, we definitely desire to train local kids from scratch. We work very hard to recruit them. We definitely promote the aspect to them that Pioneer is like a big and friendly family where everyone is important. But it seems that commitment (the amount of time and effort necessary, as well as their financial obligation to the corps) definitely limits the amount of local youth willing to participate.

It's sad because we can definitely fill the void that their schools are not providing. However, we will not give up trying!

Maybe you could consider shifting your paradigm, or reaching out more broadly. I live in Green Bay. I have a 20 year old in the UW marching band. There's one kid in that band marching with Scouts this year, another with Kilties, a third with Colts. That's it! That's a group ripe for the picking. The economy's bad. These kids aren't exactly working plum jobs in the summer. Go get some of them! I tried talking my kid into it.....they need to hear it from you! So....don't limit yourself to the high schools.

[PeeJay]

Maybe you could consider shifting your paradigm, or reaching out more broadly. I live in Green Bay. I have a 20 year old in the UW marching band. There's one kid in that band marching with Scouts this year, another with Kilties, a third with Colts. That's it! That's a group ripe for the picking. The economy's bad. These kids aren't exactly working plum jobs in the summer. Go get some of them! I tried talking my kid into it.....they need to hear it from you! So....don't limit yourself to the high schools.

Good suggestion, thank you. Can I ask you to mail or call Pioneer if your have suggestions? Contact details on www.pioneer-corps.org