Amps

[JoeDz]

Baseball is an excellent example.....but let's look at how it's NOT an example of "not broke,etc....":

The designated hitter rule changed baseball in the American League....... YOU be the judge

High school baseball went further adding "courtesy runners" for the catcher so he would have time to put on his gear..... also you can re-enter a game after being pinch hit for......

High school and college also allowed composite (metal) bats.

These rules have not improved baseball, they have watered it down. Further, the game is no longer as safe due to metal bats (although metal bat manufacturers "dispute" that claim....no kidding?)

But there are those who insist that change is necessary..... I remember the college professor I had who claimed that "everything" should be changed.

SO:

Let's:

Let each state decide on the actual date in November (or after October 15th or before December 15th) to hold elections......

Your can show up for work at any time as long as you put in your total hours.......

Contestants in the "Strong Man" competition may use a lever, fulcrum, pulley, or electric lift.

Common' folks....add your own personal comparsion to the amplification in drum corps.

Edited August 8, 2010 by JoeDz

[GUARDLING]

Not a big baseball fan myself But no matter how the rules change base ball is basball. isnt it? You hit the ball run to a base DONE ...!!!..lol..you cant compare Drum Corps to it. Music changes every year, visuals change. DO you want them to stay the same from year to year GOD I hope not. As to the statement the other poster made about the 20 yr DCA fan and ticket buying. YES that is true but let me put something out there.

What happens when the fan of today maybe well into their 50s or 60s or whoever isnt around to buy a ticket. IF you dont start letting in the people of today there will be no tomorrow. Everyone knows this in other activities WHY NOT DRUM CORPS. I am not saying change everything or that I like it all BUT It's not mine to own. JMO

[donincardona]

Not a big baseball fan myself But no matter how the rules change base ball is basball. isnt it? You hit the ball run to a base DONE ...!!!..lol..you cant compare Drum Corps to it. Music changes every year, visuals change. DO you want them to stay the same from year to year GOD I hope not. As to the statement the other poster made about the 20 yr DCA fan and ticket buying. YES that is true but let me put something out there.

What happens when the fan of today maybe well into their 50s or 60s or whoever isnt around to buy a ticket. IF you dont start letting in the people of today there will be no tomorrow. Everyone knows this in other activities WHY NOT DRUM CORPS. I am not saying change everything or that I like it all BUT It's not mine to own. JMO

well in reality it is the people of today. i don't own it . i'm no longer involved or go to show's. it's not what i want anymore. i follow the scores but really it dosen't matter. i ain't drum corps............it's more band and soon there won't be any difference. i will never pay for another ticket and that's just how i feel. no hard feelings i just don't like the direction the activity has gone . and there are a lot of people that feel the same way.

[GUARDLING]

well in reality it is the people of today. i don't own it . i'm no longer involved or go to show's. it's not what i want anymore. i follow the scores but really it dosen't matter. i ain't drum corps............it's more band and soon there won't be any difference. i will never pay for another ticket and that's just how i feel. no hard feelings i just don't like the direction the activity has gone . and there are a lot of people that feel the same way.

You are right alot of people do feel that way and alot the other BUT as someone who has their foot maybe in both generations of this activity I find it sad a little that there cant be more cross over generationally. Maybe it is, maybe whats here on DCP is not as significant as alot say...maybe it is, who knows but when the new cant learn from the older and vice versa it's a sad day. Theres alot IMO to be learned on both ends. The good and bad for that matter.

[pearlsnaredrummer77]

Ive also been in almost as long as you but i hope Drum Corps never stagnates to the point of not being open to new visuals, music, and yes even stuff I may not like on the field. Creativity is not a bad thing and IMO the only way things contiue on without dying.

I don't think anyone can call DCA stagnent. There has been considerable change over the past decade. However, it seems many people object to fundementally changing the activity via the use of amps, and especially new instrument families. There is no need for DCA-which continues to provide innovation-to follow DCI down a wrong-headed path. We all want innovation I suspect, but prefer it be made with percussion and brass instruments.

Edited August 8, 2010 by pearlsnaredrummer77

[pearlsnaredrummer77]

Not a big baseball fan myself But no matter how the rules change base ball is basball. isnt it? You hit the ball run to a base DONE ...!!!..lol..you cant compare Drum Corps to it. Music changes every year, visuals change. DO you want them to stay the same from year to year GOD I hope not. As to the statement the other poster made about the 20 yr DCA fan and ticket buying. YES that is true but let me put something out there.

What happens when the fan of today maybe well into their 50s or 60s or whoever isnt around to buy a ticket. IF you dont start letting in the people of today there will be no tomorrow. Everyone knows this in other activities WHY NOT DRUM CORPS. I am not saying change everything or that I like it all BUT It's not mine to own. JMO

Well, I've seen the people of today both on the field at DCA shows and in the crowds. DCA corps are far younger than say in the 80s. Alliance, Corps Vets, Bush, look at the faces and these folks are young-not all but youth is the movement. These newer members seem pretty proud of their organizations and circuit sans the synths.

There's really no need for DCA to slavishly follow DCI with the amps & synths, which follows BOA, which follows WGI (or some similar order). DCI is in a deep enough stew as it is-how many corps are left? This after nearly 2 decades of the Mr. Hopkins Pontiac G6 brain trust "fixing" the activity by turning it into marching band and bleeding corps, patrons and shows....

The argument about young people not coming if there are no synths is untenable. It's a DCI staple argument that doesn't really work. If you go to DCA shows, the crowds are always a good mix of people ranging in ages from little kids, teenagers, Gen X and the dominant baby boomers. Agreed, ex-marchers, seem to form the base crowd. But the point is that DCA attracts a very mixed demographic. I don't think any of these people are not going to come to DCA shows if there are no synthesizers or the pit is not amped. I don't think this issue is as salient as the pro-synth crowd likes to pretend.

I think the greater danger here is if DCA loses its distinctive identity. I suspect that would be more dangerous to the circuit than any potential losses from being synth and amp free.

You cannot survive if you lose your identity and alientate your base.

Edited August 8, 2010 by pearlsnaredrummer77

[GUARDLING]

Well, I've seen the people of today both on the field at DCA shows and in the crowds. DCA corps are far younger than say in the 80s. Alliance, Corps Vets, Bush, look at the faces and these folks are young-not all but youth is the movement. These newer members seem pretty proud of their organizations and circuit sans the synths.

There's really no need for DCA to slavishly follow DCI with the amps & synths, which follows BOA, which follows WGI (or some similar order). DCI is in a deep enough stew as it is-how many corps are left? This after nearly 2 decades of the Mr. Hopkins Pontiac G6 brain trust "fixing" the activity by turning it into marching band and bleeding corps, patrons and shows....

The argument about young people not coming if there are no synths is untenable. It's a DCI staple argument that doesn't really work. If you go to DCA shows, the crowds are always a good mix of people ranging in ages from little kids, teenagers, Gen X and the dominant baby boomers. Agreed, ex-marchers, seem to form the base crowd. But the point is that DCA attracts a very mixed demographic. I don't think any of these people are not going to come to DCA shows if there are no synthesizers or the pit is not amped. I don't think this issue is as salient as the pro-synth crowd likes to pretend.

I think the greater danger here is if DCA loses its distinctive identity. I suspect that would be more dangerous to the circuit than any potential losses from being synth and amp free.

You cannot survive if you lose your identity and alientate your base.

I was with ya all the way till you last few lines. I Agree about synths , I dont care for them myself, But I still think they will come to DCA sooner or later .Many of my friends teaching seem to want them at least to some degree but I dont agree with the identity thing. I think it has changed many ways over they years and the basis is still there and I think will always be there. Designers have demanded more in DCA to come on board and to some degee got it. To me. JMO...DCA or drum corps in general should be ever evolving, of course with respect to the roots of the activity but not held back by them.

I totally agree with you about how young it has got in DCA over the past few years , when you look on here and the post is about someones kid in DCA and their Screen name is CONTRA DAD..OR CYMBAL MOM and posting in the SR> or all age area. it's crazy......lol ( Disclaimer: just picked those names out of the air. if there is someone dont be oofended..lol )

[brucej]

Wow - what a fascinating thread (no sarcasm intended, please don't assume there to be any). I hadn't planned on reading all 13 pages but I learned a lot of things about the activity that I never knew. There'an amazing amount of lore out there and it would be great to have someone with real journaling skills capture these memories before they are gone.

My personal take on the amp thing is that one the genie is out of the bottle, it's out. I have not yet seen a show yet I thought was greatly enhanced by the addition of electronics but that's not to say that someday there won't be. The skills of the arrangers and performers are there but the coneceptualizations just haven't arrived. I can see it being used to add sounds that are too expensive or incovenient to put in place for one season's use but not to replace or augment a brass or percussion line's performance. I don't think that that would be a valid use; if the section itself cannot cut it, then it should not be faked. Add a special effect here or there, maybe, if done with taste. Used with soloists? No thanks, I prefer the natural sound.

[Jeff Ream]

Even though I support the electronics concept, there are two things I don't get..... several people (myself included) have addressed this on the DCI side of these forums.

1) Miked brass soloists. Makes no sense to me whatsoever. For many years, I've never had a problem hearing a drum corps soloist playing without the "assistance" of a microphone.

2) Use of the synth bass on the low end. There are DCI corps fielding, what, 16 (or more) tubas/contras, but they still feel the need to "enhance" that low-end sound? Again, makes no sense to me at all.

Edited to add: I see Gary also has addressed this low-end synth thing with his post above mine. A corps with 20 tubas, using low-end synth. Senseless.

2B...why corps dont get nailed for balance issues because of the thunderous goo on the low end.

[Jeff Ream]

Seperate the two,amps and electronics.Most negative comments are on the electronics side and some of those fears are way out there.Amplifying the mallet instruments(keyboards only) in the pit has merit, as longs as, that is it.So limit the instruments that are allowable,limit the output by the amps,and nothing else. It could be helpful to bring out the sound of the pit.

agree to a point. the problem is once the first speaker is plugged in, they will want more