Mini Corps Rules?

[funcorpsagain]

I cannot but openly wonder if this 'affiliation' rule is wise. Minicorps seems like a a great way for a group to get started. It's reasonable cost and performance requirements seems like a far easier hump to get over then the current class A minimums. Here is where inclusion could go a ways toward growing DCA and the All Age movement in general. Maybe this is one area where Minicorps may be outgrowing it's I&E roots. Not that I am trying to incite a revolution or anything.

Thanks Mr.Pronti and crew for another wonderful evening of Minicorps. It seems like it all went great and it was a blast to perform for the large audience.

I agree. While I understand the intent explained by Mr. Peashey, I don't think it's necessary.

Say a group of current DCI kids wanted to form a minicorps. If they're willing to put in the effort and money and entertain the DCA audience.... why not? The more the merrier -- let a thousand flowers bloom. If they have a great experience and come back, then we've successfully added to the numbers of performers (and probably performance quality and audience numbers, too).

DCA is great because it recognizes the activity in multiple variations; so eliminate all background requirements. We don't need to protect the scoring placements of middle age corps members, which is all the rule really seems to do. I would urge DCA to remove all age/membership restrictions -- which has the potential of growing and improving all aspects of this activity.

[melligene]

I agree. While I understand the intent explained by Mr. Peashey, I don't think it's necessary.

Say a group of current DCI kids wanted to form a minicorps. If they're willing to put in the effort and money and entertain the DCA audience.... why not? The more the merrier -- let a thousand flowers bloom. If they have a great experience and come back, then we've successfully added to the numbers of performers (and probably performance quality and audience numbers, too).

DCA is great because it recognizes the activity in multiple variations; so eliminate all background requirements. We don't need to protect the scoring placements of middle age corps members, which is all the rule really seems to do. I would urge DCA to remove all age/membership restrictions -- which has the potential of growing and improving all aspects of this activity.

Middle age Corps' members......Really...? Doesn't the term "ALL AGE" suggest something to you...? Aside from the fact that this is a function at and created by DCA I&E as a sub group for entertaiment purposes your suggestion leaves open this venue for basically anyone and everyone. Why not petition NASCAR? While on the subject........why doesn't DCI offer this option...? Just sayin........

[funcorpsagain]

Middle age Corps' members......Really...? Doesn't the term "ALL AGE" suggest something to you...? Aside from the fact that this is a function at and created by DCA I&E as a sub group for entertaiment purposes your suggestion leaves open this venue for basically anyone and everyone. Why not petition NASCAR? While on the subject........why doesn't DCI offer this option...? Just sayin........

DCI doesn't offer it because they are not[/i all inclusive -- in fact, they are now developing clubs within clubs. That's why DCA, with its increasing appeal to members of all ages (even changing the terminology from "senior") is doing more to grow the activity.

The NASCAR reference is silly. I didn't suggest changing the activity, just getting rid of a clumsily written rule that allows everyone EXCEPT DCI kids to participate -- an unnecessary, and possibly counter-productive, restriction (in this 47-year old's opinion).

[funcorpsagain]

Middle age Corps' members......Really...? Doesn't the term "ALL AGE" suggest something to you...? Aside from the fact that this is a function at and created by DCA I&E as a sub group for entertaiment purposes your suggestion leaves open this venue for basically anyone and everyone. Why not petition NASCAR? While on the subject........why doesn't DCI offer this option...? Just sayin........

DCI doesn't offer it because they are not all inclusive -- in fact, they are now developing clubs within clubs. That's why DCA, with its increasing appeal to members of all ages (even changing the terminology from "senior") is doing more to grow the activity.

The NASCAR reference is silly. I didn't suggest changing the activity, just getting rid of a clumsily written rule that allows everyone EXCEPT DCI kids to participate -- an unnecessary, and possibly counter-productive, restriction (in this 47-year old's opinion).

Edited September 18, 2010 by funcorpsagain

[TomPeashey]

you guys seem to think we could handle 20 or 30 mini corps... NOT....

10 is perfect

10 to 15 is pushing it

15 to 20 is over the top

we still have a physical show to run and we still need to be honest and loyal to our bosses... the performing members themselves...

So to change interpretations to encourage MORE mini corps is simply not going to happen... so far we have not had to refuse anyone, but it is obvious that the day of limiting entries is very near...

idealistic talk is cheap - logistics of actually running a show is another entirely different issue.

[JimF-LowBari]

Misread what I was replying to

Question: Did the rules always refer to "past/present Sr/All-Age corps" or was it "past/present DCA corps" at one point. Just can't remember and would be *ahem* "interesting" if it was DCA only.

Edited September 18, 2010 by JimF-LowBari

[funcorpsagain]

you guys seem to think we could handle 20 or 30 mini corps... NOT....

10 is perfect

10 to 15 is pushing it

15 to 20 is over the top

we still have a physical show to run and we still need to be honest and loyal to our bosses... the performing members themselves...

So to change interpretations to encourage MORE mini corps is simply not going to happen... so far we have not had to refuse anyone, but it is obvious that the day of limiting entries is very near...

idealistic talk is cheap - logistics of actually running a show is another entirely different issue.

1) It is not idealism to suggest that “over-subscription” would be a good problem to have. Is your mission to fit the minicorps activity into the time slot that is currently allotted? If so, then minicorps is already maxed out. If there truly were ten more minicorps that wanted to participate, it could obviously be accommodated with enough management resources. The audience is growing – charge them $5, or $10 each (whatever is necessary to retain the needed facilities and personnel) – it would still be an entertainment bargain. There are better (and more logical) ways to balance the supply of corps, audience demand, and infrastructure required than a rule excluding DCI members.

DCA may not currently have the resources to manage a larger show, but assuming that cannot change demonstrates a disappointing lack of creativity.

2) I appreciate that Dick has only had to exclude one group. I am not criticizing any decision that has been made, but of the rule itself (and it’s very bad wording), since minicorps rules are the topic of this thread.

The rule is obviously unclear; I found it confusing, and still do. Back in March, when our participation was announced, individuals (some on this web site) questioned whether we qualified since we were not affiliated with past or present DCA corps. Another pointedly made a comment that every member of his minicorps had marched in a competing corps. These comments, from seasoned veterans, indicate that they believe those are requirements – more evidence that the rule is unclear.

“1. All contestants must be a member of a past or present All Age Competitive Corps or active member of an Alumni Corps.”

“All contestants…” Dick wrote that Sine Wave qualifies because we are an alumni corps. What if we have members next year who never marched anywhere – just musicians who want to compete? What if a group of fans start a minicorps, although they never marched anywhere? I can see making the argument that they qualify by definition as a “present all age competitive corps,” but that is different from qualifying as an “alumni corps.”

Another example…

wasn't that the actual fireman's band wanting to compete...??? bottom line... Pronti will make the correct decision and won't eliminate someone unless they are not a drum corps or were a junior corps in the last 12 months...

Where in the rule does it say anything about “12 months”?

We had a 2009 Blue Stars age-out. If he had aged out in 2010 then filled a spot, would we have been disqualified? Who is policing this?

My point is, if this is how the rule is applied, then this is how it should be written! Unclear language leaves open the possibility of arbitrary interpretation later – whether in law or an I&E rule. I have no fear of that happening in the near future, but the rule should be written exactly how it is interpreted.

3) I remain “idealistic” in thinking that the central mission of DCI, DCA and all other drum corps associations should be to promote not only the survival, but the growth, of drum corps as a unique activity. In those few areas where corps is actually expanding its audience – like minicorps – setting restrictions to fit into a predetermined schedule or venue makes no sense.

[Fran Haring]

logistics of actually running a show is another entirely different issue.

Very good point, Tom.

The logistics at each I&E venue... including time constraints.... make some things very tough to do, from a scheduling standpoint.

That I&E/mini corps show... no matter where it's held, in whatever host city....poses more scheduling challenges than any other event on the DCA calendar, IMO.

Dick Pronti and his crew (which for a time included my wife until she took ill in '07) are very good at what they do, and they make it look easy.... but it isn't, by any stretch of the imagination.

[HornsUp]

Say a group of current DCI kids wanted to form a minicorps. If they're willing to put in the effort and money and entertain the DCA audience.... why not?

DCI already provides an I&E venue for this. It's called Mixed Ensemble.

If they have a great experience and come back, then we've successfully added to the numbers of performers

If. In the last 4½ decades, we have yet to see any significant migration of recent junior corps veterans to the senior side of the activity.

Edited September 18, 2010 by HornsUp

[Fran Haring]

If there truly were ten more minicorps that wanted to participate, it could obviously be accommodated with enough management resources.

I'm not trying to sound "un-inclusive" here....LOL.... but I disagree with this, for one main reason:

You can throw all the "management resources" you want at this.... but you cannot stop the clock. It's technically possible, but from a practical standpoint, all but impossible, to run events at the I&E/mini-corps venue(s) until the wee hours of Saturday morning.... or to start the events at, say, 3 o'clock on Friday afternoon.