Why are fans so rude and immature?

[tja273]

But being upset at the judges is a better place to aim it. With the apparently now empty promise that fan engagement means something, people are annoyed that a very gifted corps with a show that brings thunderous applause all over yhe country, being second place. I dont think booing is the best way to show disatisfaction with the judges, but i feel its an important distinction.

Wait, so we should be upset with the judges because they didn't ignore all of their training and years of experience (decades for some) and give the top score to the corps that got the most applause?

[fsubone]

Wait, so we should be upset with the judges because they didn't ignore all of their training and years of experience (decades for some) and give the top score to the corps that got the most applause?

I think the problem is that a lot of fans don't understand how exactly the judging system works, and how it is that BD's shows achieve such high scores, while ones they deem just as well performed and more entertaining do not. That's at least always been my read on the situation. I don't think DCI releases the judging rubric to the general audience, so no one except staff members and judges know what really constitutes a score. Especially when it comes to the content and GE captions. Everyone can see and hear visual and musical dirt, and a mess guard can be seen from space. But content and GE are much more subjective and intangible to the people not looking at the sheets or designing the shows I think

[tja273]

I think the problem is that a lot of fans don't understand how exactly the judging system works, and how it is that BD's shows achieve such high scores, while ones they deem just as well performed and more entertaining do not. That's at least always been my read on the situation. I don't think DCI releases the judging rubric to the general audience, so no one except staff members and judges know what really constitutes a score. Especially when it comes to the content and GE captions. Everyone can see and hear visual and musical dirt, and a mess guard can be seen from space. But content and GE are much more subjective and intangible to the people not looking at the sheets or designing the shows I think

Of course you are right. I was mostly being a smartass because of all the "booing the judges" comments. Who is to say they are doing it wrong.

DCI could do a better job of explaining all of this for the people who actually care. I expect most on DCP would be interested in a better understanding of how the scoring works. Then, they could focus their complaints to the right people. The casual fans in the stands may never understand it, but I don't know how many of those really care who wins as long as they enjoy themselves.

[CloudHype]

I think the problem is that a lot of fans don't understand how exactly the judging system works, and how it is that BD's shows achieve such high scores, while ones they deem just as well performed and more entertaining do not. That's at least always been my read on the situation. I don't think DCI releases the judging rubric to the general audience, so no one except staff members and judges know what really constitutes a score. Especially when it comes to the content and GE captions. Everyone can see and hear visual and musical dirt, and a mess guard can be seen from space. But content and GE are much more subjective and intangible to the people not looking at the sheets or designing the shows I think

I've always tried to explain why to people. I normally do very well at calling things in all but percussion captions. (I'm a visual designer) BUT.... people don't want to know why, they just want their favorites to win. So I tell people to leave before scores if it bother you that much, because it shouldn't. Entertainment and scores are separate for me. And yes, I find a lot of entertaining corps today. Lot's of variety of styles and design.

Funny, you bring up effect. I say about 75% of the Drum Corps/Band community (including educators with degrees) have no clue on what general effect is and it really does need to be explained better to people. I actually recommend people to check out a BOA judges manual (don't laugh, it brings up concepts that are used as judging criteria)... while the sheet is different, it will help out many people.

[CloudHype]

How do you think Crown corps members feel when they read your comments about them?

I think a very small percentage of corps members give a darn about DCP.

[fsubone]

Of course you are right. I was mostly being a smartass because of all the "booing the judges" comments. Who is to say they are doing it wrong.

DCI could do a better job of explaining all of this for the people who actually care. I expect most on DCP would be interested in a better understanding of how the scoring works. Then, they could focus their complaints to the right people. The casual fans in the stands may never understand it, but I don't know how many of those really care who wins as long as they enjoy themselves.

I wish they would at least show us how the shows are judged via the sheets. You're right, most of the grandparents and school groups who will go to one show a year probably aren't as invested into the competition as most of us nerds are. They are there to get entertained for few hours, and watch some good drum corps. DCP is such a small slice of the drum corps fan pie, that all of the complaints and comments and arguments on here seem amplified ten-fold. I know I would love to see the sheets, and what goes into each box. Would open up a different world of watching shows, seeing the motivations behind the design choices. Especially with the recent string of Blue Devils shows, which seem to be sheet-centered, with the audience interaction second. That's where I think people see the disconnect within General Effect, even though effect doesn't have to mean standing ovations and throwing babies. IF they changed the judging sheets to say that, I'm sure BD would come out with a show that makes people throw more babies farther and stand up more than any other corps out there, but the sheets don't say that. As long as they effect the folks in the green shirts the right way, the score will keep going up, and the trophy case will need to keep expanding.

[fsubone]

Funny, you bring up effect. I say about 75% of the Drum Corps/Band community (including educators with degrees) have no clue on what general effect is and it really does need to be explained better to people. I actually recommend people to check out a BOA judges manual (don't laugh, it brings up concepts that are used as judging criteria)... while the sheet is different, it will help out many people.

Is that available to the public? As a future band director/ huge drum corps fan, I would love to get an actual understanding of what GE is, and how the heck it is scored.

[tja273]

Especially with the recent string of Blue Devils shows, which seem to be sheet-centered, with the audience interaction second.

I don't think the BD staff sits around and thinks, "What kind of show can we do that hits all the points on the sheets?" Most of the latest concepts have been in their heads for years. And they SHOULD have the sheets in mind when designing their show. It would be a complete disservice to their members not to. The kids are there to perform AND compete.

[CloudHype]

Is that available to the public? As a future band director/ huge drum corps fan, I would love to get an actual understanding of what GE is, and how the heck it is scored.

Yes. Let me find that and I'll pm it to you.

[flammaster]

I just hope the visiting corps like Crown and BK enjoy their stay here in Northern California. I never spoke to any of the but nodded and waved to many last night. it was such a beautiful day on such a wonderful campus. o wonder they have a show here even though the stadium itself sucks for drum corps unless you are lucku enough to sit in the butt kiss..cough cough upper level.