The DCI Yearlys: 1986

[Lancerlady]

I know a lot more than you think. But since you want to talk about this, let's talk about this...let's get all the facts out there in the open.

So tell me, what exactly did "DCI" say? Who specifcally told these corps to change? Was it Don Pesceone? Was it Don Angelica? Was it someone else? What did this person (or persons) say? What was the exact wording? Did they put it in writing? Was it during a face to face conversation? Were YOU there when these things were said in those face to face conversations? Did you hear about it from a second or third party? Was a promise made to ensure finalist status if said changes were made? Let's get it all out. Be specific. And I'm not being facetious here, I really want to know. People talk about being screwed and politics all the time. This implies conspiracy. I want proof. Let's see it. You make the claim, you better be prepared to back it up. Otherwise, I'm sorry, it's all just talk. (And if you can answer even ONE of those questions with something concrete and verifiable, I'd be amazed.)

As I said, I know more than you think. And I know enough to know that my point still stands. When you say that they asked you to change, you changed, and they didn't reward you for it DOES NOT TELL THE WHOLE STORY. That's an incredibly naive way to look at it. I said it before, and the point remains: It's not as simple as "just change the show (or your identity) and you'll beat so and so." The judges may have told those other corps to change their shows as well, and maybe they liked THEIR changes better than they liked YOUR'S. Who's to say? This is a competition with a LOT of corps, and they can only take 12. There will always be very good corps on the outside looking in, and that is the NATURE OF COMPETITION.

And yet here we had a corps in 2004 that not only had amps, but they also sang into microphones (Carolina Crown), and what happened to them? They DROPPED a position at Finals to an UNAMPED corps (Bluecoats). Spirit of JSU, A DCI Finalist in 2003, DROPPED out of Finals in 2004. They used amps. How is that possible??? Did they not get the memo? Someone must have lost their job on that one. 

I ain't preaching anything. Just looking at it objectively. If anyone is looking through highly tinted glasses, it's not me. It's the people who think they got screwed when we're talking about tenths of a point in a competition where there were legitimate performance and design issues that were afoot with their corps. If you really can't see or hear them as an objective observer, than I'm afraid YOU might need to take off the rose colored glasses. I liked the 27th Lancers in 1986. I enjoyed their show very much, but they had some issues that year and by no means were a lock for anything based on what I saw and heard. Three tenths. Could have gone either way.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Who are you and what are your credentials if you want to get in this "pissing" contest about what you think you know about what on that year? Why do I have to tell you anything about my credentials and who I found this information out from. Believe me I know some people in DCI and the ones who were there...I really don't care if you don't believe me.

I was there involved in the organization at the time ,marching and you can look at it "objectively" as I had in 1985. I admitted that was probably true we didn't make finals in 1985 but I will NEVER admit it for 1986 no matter what you say. However I am not wearing those glasses. I know what happened, and you can even see from previous posts of other people who were competiting aganist who thought we should have been in finals.

I know about certain things that went on that year and in 1985. . I am very objective and know when things are not right. I don't have to "talk" or discuss my findings with you about this. The fact remains..I am not getting into an argument about that, you can get on here and disrespect without being directly involved with these organizations all you want, but look it began in 1983 with Bridgemen...they began their decline and left the world of DCI too because they were told to make those changes to keep up with the times. It's not a secret. It happened. They ended up putting the blindfolds in the drum solo to put some jazz in the show. It worked. In order to save their season..

I was at the BOD meeting in January and saw and heard things about the implifications of not "keeping up with the Joneses" and I saw which corps were fighting to keep the traditions in DCI like, Colts, Pioneer and others trying to keep retreat or some part of it. So YES politics does happen....DCI never comes right out and says "we're gonna cut you if you don't do this" but there is a suggestion that "This is the way things are now"..."You don't have to have an amp if you don't want but everyone else does.."

If you don't want to believe it, that is your right but please don't come on here slamming me about it acting like I don't know what I'm talking about.

[Lancerlady]

It's hard to put so much into something, like those kids did, and get let down like that 86 corps did.  Just a few years earlier we were on top (or near the top) of the world and it came down to that last performance.  There were a lot of things involved with the demise of the 27th Lancers.  That being said,  I think all those kids should be proud that they gave it their all that year.  They were a great group of kids to teach and I enjoyed being a part of that corps that year.  Unfortunately, **** happens.  I am so glad that we were able to erase some of those bad memories in 94 in Foxboro.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Thanks Kevin, that means alot to me, you were always one of my favorite instructors because of the heart and soul you put into it.

[ferb27]

Thanks Kevin, that means alot to me, you were always one of my favorite instructors because of the heart and soul you put into it.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I really mean what I said. That year was one of the more enjoyable years to teach, although the results didn't show it. Sometimes, in the midst of all the negativity you have to look for the positives. By the way, check out your 2-7 e-mail, I sent you a pretty funny joke that I think you will enjoy.

[skywalker]

As I expected. Not one single shred of anything verifiable. Thanks for being consistent. Have a great summer.

[apoch003]

Hrrrmnn.... it's 83 all over again, only everyone sympathizes with Steph.

I'm taking my ball and going home!!!

[Kamarag]

Ok, we need lighten this up. Here's my story from 1986...

Suncoast Sound was coming off of an incredible year musically. How do you follow up Florida Suite? Well, you do a show based on the music of Johnny Richards' "Adventures in Time", a performed by Stan Kenton.

AiT has been played several times over the years (Garfield, Freelancers, etc). It had never been an entire show, and the arrangement by Robert Smith, Al Murray and Ken Brooks was going to be one of the most challenging musical arrangements ever played in drum corps.

The visual staff was enhanced with the addition of Karl Lowe, who took the color guard to a whole new level, and worked with Mike Raiford to coordinate the drill far better than the previous year. Suncoast also pioneered the "placed-foot direction change" thanks to M&M caption head Greg Martin (a style that's used almost universally today).

The corps had a strong winter. We were incredibly fortunate to pick up a major corporate sponsorship from the Circle K corporation. That enabled Suncoast to purchase ten brand new Dynasty Magnum contra basses, new uniform pants and cummerbuns, and a kitchen truck that made Star's look like an Igloo cooler. The corps would also tour the West Coast for the first time.

The show was incredibly difficult, especially the horn book. When we hit the field for the premier show, the corps fell apart in the opener (Commencement). At the very first show in Atlanta, we came within a hair's width of falling apart. That night we were beaten badly by everyone including Garfield and Spirit of Atlanta.

After several days traveling west, we arrives in Phoenix for a show where the only other corps would be the Velvet Knights. In all honesty, we though VK would destroy us. I turned out we beat them by almost ten points (this time without falling apart) and the West Coast tour was off and running.

The corps worked incredibly long hours while in California. We just wanted to hold our own in front of BD and SCV fans. Not only did we accomplish that, we beat them both in brass just about every night, including SCV's home show in San Jose.

We were told by our devious staff that as a DCS corps (Drum Corps South) we could not compete at the DCW (Drum Corps West) championships in Concord (BD's home show, Pacific Procession). We'd be performing in exhibition. The corps was told in warm-up that there were a couple of members of the Stan Kenton Band in the audience, musicians that were on the AiT original recording (they were floored by our performance and told us afterwards in the parking lot). The corps put on it's best performnnce to date, and the BD home crowd gave the corps a standing ovation TWICE during the show, and again at the end.

While at retreat, we were just chiiling...until we started winning captions. How does a non-competing corps win hogh brass and best drum major? Apparantly you do when you are competing, and finish 3rd, within inches of the Santa Clara Vanguard. I'll never forget that night.

The tour went on very well, and we won brass pretty much every time we hit the field. We exchanged wins with the Cavaliers, and beat Garfield, Madison, Phantom, and pretty much everyone except BD and SCV. The last show before Madison was in Minnesota. We'd pretty much been slotted into 3rd place heading into DCI week, but totally fell apart that night. It would end up costing us dearly.

In Madison we had a very shaky show in prelims, finishing in a tie for 7th with the Madison Scouts. Having to go on so early in finals was not a good thing, but the corps made the best of it, and played an absolutely spectacular finals performance.

Bill Doyle, who was judging field brass, commented that this was the best brass line he'd ever heard, and gave the corps the "first perfect 9.9" in DCI brass history. He said he wanted to give us the 10, but couldn't as there were still five corps to perform after us. The Blue Devils ended up with a 9.8. Performance order hurt us, and probably cost us a placement or two, but it was our own fault.

History will record that the Blue Devils swept all captions that night. But we knew who the better brass line was (BD ended up with a 10 in ensemble brass, while we got a 9.8...a dumping if I ever saw one...no way BD was two tenths better. One, maybe, but not two). Final score, BD 19.8, Suncoast 19.7. A few years later Jack Meehan would tell me he was convinced BD should have been second in brass that night...and that meant a lot to me (I would eventually go with the "if you can't beat 'em, join 'em" school of thought and join the Blue Devils).

Another interestng thing was that Suncoast also won the M&M individual technique subcaption...mostly for the foot technique. We couldn't march intervals or forms to save our lives, but here was no better feet on the field that year. It's nice to see just about every corps using that same marching style in DCI and DCA today...and know that I was there when it was pioneered.

Other fun facts from 1986:

-- Got stuck in the elevator at Carlsbad Caverns 700ft below the ground (I have a picture of that).

-- Took a picture of the most cryptic phrase ever...graffitti on the side of a barn near Modesto, CA that said "Friends Don't Let Friends Eat Tostadas". I never did figure out what it meant.

-- A bus accident near Memphis, TN almost claimed the life of the staff bus driver and our staff. A drumk driver swerved into the bus's lane and crashed head on into the staff bus just beneath the driver. The driver's seat was pushed out the left side of the bus, but the driver held on and was able to stop the bus before it went off a ravine. He was badly injured. To this day he's a hero in the hearts of all Suncoast vets. Only minor injuries were the result to staff on the bus, and the drivers of the follow-on busses were able ot react before there was a chain reaction. The drunk driver was killed instantly and his truck ended up in the ravine.

[ferb27]

As I expected. Not one single shred of anything verifiable. Thanks for being consistent. Have a great summer.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hey, lay off Stephanie. I'm privy to alot of the same information as Stephanie, and much if it is not meant for public consumption. By you or anyone else. I guess you're one of those people that if you don't see it, it doesn't exist. Don't be like former Red Sox player, Carl Everett, and not believe in dinosaurs because you didn't see one.

There is more than one reason why the corps didn't make finals that year. I taught that year. I was there. Yes, this is a competitive activity and someone has to go home disappointed. But you don't know the situation, therefore, give Stephanie a break. That was a very emotional year for all involved and to you it probably sounds like sour grapes or a conspiracy theory. Trust me, that is not the case here.

I can tell you as a former member and instructor of the 27th Lancers, WE NEVER MADE EXCUSES!!!!! We always accepted our fate and moved on. Not once during the announcement the next day that the corps was breaking up did George B. offer any excuses. It was what it was. A lot happened over that season and let's say by prelims, the handwriting was on the wall. But again, no excuses were made. If Stephanie says there is more to the story, then there is more to the story.

HAVE A NICE SUMMER!!!!!

[bd5times]

The corps put on it's best performnnce to date, and the BD home crowd gave the corps a standing ovation TWICE during the show, and again at the end.

I find it amazing...and cool, that as competitive as the Blue Devils are and how supportive the local fans are of the Bay Area corps.....we'll cheer for anybody that puts on a great show.

I was there that night in Concord (and SJ) when Suncoast won brass. You guys were smoking, that's for sure.

Edited June 2, 2005 by bd5times

[Lancerlady]

Thanks again Kevin! I couldn't have said it better myself.

My husband pegged that you Skywalker, would come back at me with something like you did.

And Skywalker..just as I thought..where are your credentials?

Besides, I happen to know a lot more on the inside then you think and I really don't care if you believe me or not.

HAVE A NICE SUMMER!

I'm done with this you just wanted to come on here and instigate and flame an argument....go do it with someone else.

Edited June 2, 2005 by Lancerlady

[Guardguy89]

Wow - I knew Suncoast was good in '86 - but I had no idea that their hornline was that incredible. Guard people tend to listen to the horn line as "background music" for equipment work - JOKE :P

Our guard captain joined the '87 version of Suncoast Sound 'cause he fell in love with the '86 corps. I always felt a little bad for him -either way you look at it he joined one year late or one year early.

What exactly did happen in '87 - My Fair Lady was- uuummmmmm different

Later,

Mike