Drum corps volume testing with DB meters?

[Leland]

I never saw Phantom '93 in standstill, but it's not surprising to see someone say that they were awfully loud.

This really isn't fair, but the loudest we ever got in the Marine D&B -- by bringing the tester and his dB meter within the ensemble while indoors and while playing as physically loud as we could -- was somewhere around 135-141 dBA.

That's like testing a race engine on a dynamometer with a stupid-high shot of nitrous and turbo boost with no exhaust, no accessories, and no intake filter. Just everything set up for power with no real-world correlation.

Indoors, we've tested over 120 without trying hard. It's all been part of studies to show that we qualify as a hazardous noise workplace environment. Some of the older guys do have noticeable hearing damage. As it turns out, we get issued musician's earplugs, which are pretty much a necessity for anyone spending decent amounts of time in front of the ensemble. The drumline goes through boxes and boxes of earplugs, too.

Between doing drum corps, firearms, and car racing, I'm fairly convinced that anyone spending time in a loud environment needs to consider hearing protection (and definitely use something when it's loud enough). It was fun when I was young, but jeez, sometimes it's just too #### loud. Besides, if it's loud enough, it shakes my chest and vibrates the hair on my skin, and that's the fun part.

[jake_the_hydra]

One of my former teachers marched Phantom in the late '90's, and he mentioned the Jet Engine comparison to me. I believe that the hornline's volume was AT ITS LOUDEST measured as the equivalent of a jet engine. He was pretty proud of that . . . not surprising, they value that kind of thing a lot. ^0^

That said, I think some of these values being thrown out are absolutely ridiculous.

[Leland]

I wish somebody had a decibel meter in the middle of the All-Star Corps horn circle prior to their Orange Bowl parade appearance.

I'm not exaggerating about the 140-ish readings, either.

[PioSop06]

I never saw Phantom '93 in standstill, but it's not surprising to see someone say that they were awfully loud.

This really isn't fair, but the loudest we ever got in the Marine D&B -- by bringing the tester and his dB meter within the ensemble while indoors and while playing as physically loud as we could -- was somewhere around 135-141 dBA.

That's like testing a race engine on a dynamometer with a stupid-high shot of nitrous and turbo boost with no exhaust, no accessories, and no intake filter. Just everything set up for power with no real-world correlation.

Indoors, we've tested over 120 without trying hard. It's all been part of studies to show that we qualify as a hazardous noise workplace environment. Some of the older guys do have noticeable hearing damage. As it turns out, we get issued musician's earplugs, which are pretty much a necessity for anyone spending decent amounts of time in front of the ensemble. The drumline goes through boxes and boxes of earplugs, too.

Between doing drum corps, firearms, and car racing, I'm fairly convinced that anyone spending time in a loud environment needs to consider hearing protection (and definitely use something when it's loud enough). It was fun when I was young, but jeez, sometimes it's just too #### loud. Besides, if it's loud enough, it shakes my chest and vibrates the hair on my skin, and that's the fun part.

I SO wanna join the Marine D&B now, if only I didnt want to be an officer.

[bluecoats88]

I wish somebody had a decibel meter in the middle of the All-Star Corps horn circle prior to their Orange Bowl parade appearance.

I'm not exaggerating about the 140-ish readings, either.

Yes I was there and that horn line in 1988 for the orange bowl parade put out some serious volume. I understand that we blew out all the over head mics during the parade when we got to the TV location.

I marched 7 years with the Bluecoats drum line, before anyone thought to require earplugs during winter rehearsals, and I hear a constant white noise.

[Leland]

Yes I was there and that horn line in 1988 for the orange bowl parade put out some serious volume. I understand that we blew out all the over head mics during the parade when we got to the TV location.

I marched 7 years with the Bluecoats drum line, before anyone thought to require earplugs during winter rehearsals, and I hear a constant white noise.

Yup, I've heard that they broke mics, too. The on-the-street TV commentators couldn't tell when the booth was talking to them, so they would just stand there, waiting patiently, with the live camera on them.

Bluecoats? In that era? Hmm... do you remember a Steve "somebody" (unnamed to protect his identity) who showed up in the contra line in '88 and stuck around a couple more years?

[torn8o]

I never saw Phantom '93 in standstill, but it's not surprising to see someone say that they were awfully loud.

This really isn't fair, but the loudest we ever got in the Marine D&B -- by bringing the tester and his dB meter within the ensemble while indoors and while playing as physically loud as we could -- was somewhere around 135-141 dBA.

HOGWASH!!!! IMPOSSIBLE!!!!

Okay, since the time I started this thread, I have become the owner of one and have researched how they work extensively. What you wrote up there is absolutely impossible. 110 is the volume of a rock concert (think Metallica). 120 DBs is the volume of a jet engine taking off at 100 yards away. 130 is a gun shot at the distance of the HOLDER. Now, imagine a gun shot consistantly firing without wearing ear plugs for 10 minutes solid and YOU are saying that the Marine D&B corps is 11 dbs louder than that? And did I mention that DB levels are not proportinal. In other words, The distance between 105 and 110 is like the distance between 80-95. And that gap gets smaller the higher the DB level. There is no way in H. E. double hocky sticks that the Marine D&B corps was 11 DBs louder than a continuous gun fire HELD BY THE HOLDER! You would be instantly deaf - PERMENANTLY.

Oh, and did I mention? There is not even a DB meter in existance that reads over 130 DBs

So, I think you are....oh....just a little OFFFFF!

Edited May 15, 2006 by torn8o

[XxDrumCorpsFanxX]

138dB?

hmm...that sounds just a little bit...um....unrealistic.

Exposure to sound at 138dB of sound pressure (which is what dB/volume is) would cause instantaneous hearing damage.

a typical hand held gun firing is about 138-145dB.

Standing near a reasonably efficient jet engine from a distance of 100ft is around that same level. Deafening levels. Literally.

In fact it only takes sound pressure levels of around 85dB to cause hearing damage.

(from http://www.dangerousdecibels.org/hearingloss.cfm )

Decibel Exposure Time Guidelines

Accepted standards for recommended permissible exposure time for continuous time weighted average noise, according to NIOSH and CDC, 2002. For every 3 dBs over 85dB, the permissible exposure time before possible damage can occur is cut in half.

Continuous dB

Permissible Exposure Time

85 db = 8 hours

88 dB = 4 hours

91 db = 2 hours

94 db = 1 hour

97 db = 30 minutes

100 db = 15 minutes

103 db = 7.5 minutes

106 dB = 3.75 min (< 4min)

109 dB = 1.875 min (< 2min)

112 dB = .9375 min (~1 min)

115 dB = .46875 min (~30 sec)

As you can see, sound pressure levels and the damage they cause grow exponentially.....

Even the loudest hornlines, Id venture to say could maybe approach 105-107dB. And its a wonder how the guys who have been in the hornline/drumline staff positions for decades can still hear anything at all!

And as far as measuring hornlines....the only way to make measuring the dB levels of all hornlines would be to do so in a completely 100% controlled environment. All hornlines would have to be playing the same exact music with the same exact scoring on the same exact field on the same exact night with the same exact drill. And thats if you want to measure a hornlines ability to play while moving.

A more accurate readout of sound would require all hornlines standing still in the exact same formation and exact same distance from the mics/sound devices. If any of that is different, then the variables in question would never give you as accurate a measurement as you'd like.

And so while measuring volume levels at a corps show would be fun....it would only serve as a novelty idea to measure the volume from one show to another, and not truly the hornlines themsevles. But like I said, if you really wanted to know who could play loudest, its not quite so easy.

well said i have to agree with you on all that stuff....

i highly doubt that any hornline has reached 138 db. I mean go to a concert...the loudest that you can have it is like 109 db i believe. And thats still pretty #### loud. So i dont' really think that it could have gotten to that range unless you were standing right next to let say...maybe a trumpet...

but 138....i don't think so.... = /

[torn8o]

One of my former teachers marched Phantom in the late '90's, and he mentioned the Jet Engine comparison to me. I believe that the hornline's volume was AT ITS LOUDEST measured as the equivalent of a jet engine. He was pretty proud of that . . . not surprising, they value that kind of thing a lot. ^0^

That said, I think some of these values being thrown out are absolutely ridiculous.

Exactly. Because as I said, the equivalent of a jet engine...AT 100 YARDS AWAY...is 120db. So yes, the so called "reading" of the Marine Drum & Bugle Corps is bogus. No offense to Leland.

[torn8o]

well said i have to agree with you on all that stuff....

i highly doubt that any hornline has reached 138 db. I mean go to a concert...the loudest that you can have it is like 109 db i believe. And thats still pretty #### loud. So i dont' really think that it could have gotten to that range unless you were standing right next to let say...maybe a trumpet...

but 138....i don't think so.... = /

You are correct. And again, DB meters do not read above 130 ANYWAY NONE of them!

Edited May 15, 2006 by torn8o