$$$Help Save Drum Corps$$$

[JCSeymour]

I realize that stuff gets wore out.

I realize corps have to replace things.

I realize a corps has to replace things before they turn into to junk and lose resale value.

I realize you can resell flags.I also realize not all used equipment get resold.

I realize that volunteers/donations are the life blood of corps.God love em all and I truly mean that.

I realize that even if it was 1 ,5,10 or 25 years ago, it's the same principles guiding how things are done,you don't spend what you don't have.And stay alive for long.

The fundementals of running a corps never really change.You don't spend what you do not have. You might get by with it for a while but sooner or later it all catches up.

I am not some big ogre who's is trying to discrecredit any drum corps.Stop trying to skew it that way.

Nor am I someone who is ignorant of how Modern day drum corps are run.So do not try to peg me as either.

I just stated I want my donation to go to a organization that is spending it's money wisely

And for someone to state that "ALL Corps" spend wisely is ignorance on their part.

I never stated do not donate.

I never stated that ALL corps spend unwisley.

[The Oz]

Notice: This is not a rant. I say what I say with respect and in the interest of continuing this discussion.

You are correct; I am not now as involved in drum crops as you appear to be. I do not believe that this disqualifies me from this discussion. I have been around the “marching arts” as a participant (longer than many), instructor (briefly), and a fan (decades). There is a lot of information available to even the casual fan. And I have been involved in non-profit organizations for longer than (I suspect) you have been alive. I understand budgeting. It is no small part of my livelihood, my life, and my avocation.

Does sewing qualify you as a budgeting and fund raising authority? No. (Said with respect.) And neither does it disqualify you.

I will leave Mr. Seymour to clarify his thoughts. But I’m pretty certain he is very actively and currently involved with one of my favorite drum corps. I respect his credentials and thinking.

The “fuel or flags” discussion is all about budgeting. I agree, uniforms and soft goods do wear out and must be replaced or repaired. This again is a cost that can be budgeted. But, if there is only so much money available, fuel must be budgeted first.

Successful business, for-profit and non-profit, handle disruptions to income or expenses by reallocating budget items. If revenue doesn’t meet projections, some expenses have to be done without. If expenses exceed projections, either the income must be augmented or, as before, some expenses have to be done without.

If an organization has committed all of its (realized and future) income when a disruption occurs, they are then only a small step from insolvency. You have to include flexibility and contingency in the budget if you are to ride over tough times.

The non-profit world is particularly vulnerable to thinking, “I can always launch another fund raiser.” Well, the same fuel cost issue affecting you is also affecting me. Will you return some of my donation if I need it later this year?

gottalovit said,

and most intelligent business people are always willing to take time to appreciate a good suggestion/idea when they hear it.

Here’s my suggestion, control the costs and do a better job of budgeting.

[tubamann]

Has it occured to anyone that budgeting for fuel costs is a hit and miss operation. I work for a Charter Bus company with 68 years in the business and WE missed the mark when budgeting for fuel prices. When you ahve a commindy that is as volatle as fuel it can be no more than a crapshoot.

I can tell you that many corps (the one I am involved included) are very careful when budgeting. You hear people whining about new horns, unis etc, but MOST corps replace these using a capital replacement budget line..ie every year make a capital purchase. For example, my corps purchased a new food truck last year, plans to purchase a new set of horns this year, and will make another capital purchase next year. (EQ truck or Uniforms, Sovuie trailer, who knows?) Most of the time this budget line is supported by endorsment deals (in the case of horns or drums) or the selling of old equipment (ie horns, food trucks) as well as a general fundraiser. (My corps does a holiday fund)

Just some food for thought..

Edited May 2, 2006 by tubamann

[SkyRyder_FMM]

Actually, not quite. I know for a fact, that if you're supporting a Pioneer memeber and use the S.O.P.Y. form, it IS tax deductible. By the way, anybody on here want to help a poor guy pay for tour?

I am sorry, but you are incorrect. This was discussed back during tax season. If funds are docnated to specifically sponor an individual, the donation IS NOT tax deductible. If it is donated to the corps for their use, it is.

[ChicagoFan]

In order to be tax deductible, a donation to support an individual corps member would have to be made to the corps itself (the non-profit); the corps could then turn the money over to the individual.

[The Oz]

[Aside: Why does everyone assume that I am dumb? (“Has it occurred to any of you …?” “If you were around it a little more recently, you might know this stuff, too.”)]

Yes, budgeting fuel costs is difficult. Even for professionals. But it can be done. Southwest Airlines famously manages its fuel costs and remains outrageously profitable (for an airline). My point is that the budget has to include a contingency. If you have uncertainty in the line item, manage it with a contingency. Don’t depend on charity for day-to-day costs. And if at the end of the year you haven’t spent the contingency, live it up!

It sounds like “your” corps has successfully managed its capitol budget. But endorsement deals aren’t available to everyone. This is one if the issues I’m decrying – “the rich get richer” is not a viable financial model for the poor. Or even the middle class.

[shawn craig]

I think most of us realize that corps do make budgets and try to stick to them.

I also think we understand that fuel prices are difficult to predict and thus make an accurate budget for.

I think the comments about props and such are valid.

Some props have been effective and added to shows. For example, over the years several corps have used boxes for horn players to stand on or guard to dance on. That's been effective most of the time.

Some coprs have just put a back drop like Colts postcards this past year. They were just there, not used for a purpose, and you really couldn't make out what was on them.

Same with silks. You need to change and have variety. But how many is enough? I've seen guards use equipment for such a short time that they didn't really show me anything with it, it didn't really add to the show. Plus the planning and time it takes to move the guard to the side lines to make the change.

I guess what I want to say is when planning a prop or that 6th set of silks, really think how it's to be used, will the effect be worth it, not just in tems of expenses but also the time involved to make it happen.

[SkyRyder_FMM]

In order to be tax deductible, a donation to support an individual corps member would have to be made to the corps itself (the non-profit); the corps could then turn the money over to the individual.

Again, this is incorrect. There cannot be donations to benefit specific members. Such agreements not only expose the contributor to tax evasion issues, they also expose the corps to potential loss of not-for-profit status. There cannot be any type of benefit received from specific members. There cannot be any side agreements. No wink, wink, nod, nod arrangements. The donation must be to the not-for-profit organization for their use and their use only. Otherwise, the contribution is NOT tax deductible.

[ScribeToo]

And for someone to state that "ALL Corps" spend wisely is ignorance on their part.

I never stated do not donate.

I never stated that ALL corps spend unwisley.

If you can show me where I said any of those three things, I will donate a dollar to YOU.

I made my statements as "some" and "most" -- not ALL.. as there can be no ALL.

You have every right to know and be confident that your donation is used wisely by your chosen charity (be it The United Way or The Pioneer Drum and Bugle Corps and Color Guard).. which is why I said in the beginning, when you see stuff like this original thread.. feel free to skip it.. presume they weren't talking to you -- you've got your ducks in a row. You have your donation criteria clear in your head. More power to you! Feel free also to ignore the letters of solicitation from drum corps as well -- unless you feel compelled to investigate their budgeting and spending patterns in more depth.. but for someone like The Oz to state that "these directors need to grow up and balance their budgets" implies that ALL corps are fiscally irresponsible because they still rely to a degree upon donations and soliciting funds from private sponsors is and that all corps are operating in negative budgets.

Seriously, do either of you know that for a fact? Do either of you know first hand and for a fact that the corps you are being solicited by hasn't budgeted correctly for the things they need and that solicitation and donations represent a percentage of their budget? Do you know what that percentage represents or what dollar amount they need to raise as donations in order to balance their budgets? Do any non-profits operate without a line item on their budgets for "donations" being factored in?

No one here has said that every corps is financially responsible. I, too, have been on a board charged with running a corps from inception and know what it takes to get it off the ground.. the budgeting involved and where the income must come from every single year. I, too, have had to do these things within the last 20 years of MY involvement in the activity -- so just because you were doing it (probably) before I was born also doesn't invalidate my argument that your experience with the activity 20 years ago is A LOT DIFFERENT than the experience NOW.

It takes a different plan of action to be successful in DCI today. That is not a FAULT of the activity. That is a FACT of the activity and every generation has had to face it differently than the last.

The only person charged with finding out how the corps is spending it's money before you donate to it is YOU. If you can't get that question answered to your satisfaction, BY ALL MEANS DON'T DONATE TO THAT ORGANIZATION.. but blanket statements that imply the leaders of the activity today need to "grow up and balance their budgets" is as uninformed and ignorant a statement as any statement that would say ALL corps are financially responsible.

Respectfully,

Stef

[Lancerlady]

Why do these threads always turn into a pissing contest about whose ideas are better then whose, or who knows more about running a corps ...

Please...let's get off of that and just stick to the topic at hand before another good idea gets sidetracked..if you don't want to donate..DON'T but for those who do, just go to the individual corps websites, most have posted what they are in need of the most. Investigate your options.

Edited May 2, 2006 by Lancerlady